Miami Heat: Deploying the Herro-Robinson duo | Five on the Floor

Miami Heat: Deploying the Herro-Robinson duo | Five on the Floor

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Check the FL play got a all B y’all seen the block stop with one hand and P trust it’s have the guts we here to bring the heat y’all can hang it up welcome to five on the floor a daily Insider show on the Miami Heat the NBA

Featuring Ethan scholet Greg sander and Alex Toledo plus others from the five reason Sports Network all right welcome back to five on the floor we’re actually recording this after the Miami Heat beat the Atlanta Hawks want to give you an extra episode to put up before the Christmas

Day game against the Philadelphia 76ers the heat will go into that game at 17 and 12 not bad all things considered some bad losses in there lots of injuries and yet five games over 500 and in position to get into the top four in the East I’m Ethan scolan you can follow

Me Ethan j scolan a five re in sports I got Alex too you can follow my tropical blanket and Brady Hawk you can follow Brady Hawk 305 and we’re doing this after the Heat beat the Hawks because it’s fresh and everybody’s excited on Twitter and everywhere else because something old is New

Again Duncan Robinson and Tyler hero have been playing together now for four years we’ve seen lots of other guards come in Josh Richardson came back he played with Duncan Robinson one season when Duncan was filling in for Dwayne in a couple of games that’s how long ago

That is Kyle Lowry’s been here for three seasons we’ve had Gabe Vincent come and go Max stru come and go right and here we were tonight or as you’re listening to this maybe tomorrow yesterday or two days from now two days ago and Duncan Robinson and Tyler herro played brilliantly together and tore

Apart the Hawks dunan Robinson hardly played in the first half had three points ended up with 27 set all kinds of Records in doing it and Tyler herro had 30 which is his third straight ridiculously strong and efficient game since he came back from injury and Tyler

Herro talked about it after the game he said we’re not dunks on the other end anymore that they’re playing better defensively so they can play more together what we’re going to try to evaluate here is this okay everybody’s gonna get carried away because they love seeing great Shooters play together

Particularly a team that’s been offensively challenged over the past couple of years but there’s a reason that hero and Robinson haven’t been playing that much together since their since the their first year coming out of summer league and Brady I’ll go to you first on it because hero talked about that

Tonight the numbers haven’t been great when the two of them have played together over the years and yet it looks like they’re in better position to make this work if Eric spola decides to go with a bigger dose of this so I’ll ask you this can they play more together now

Than they did before and would you even consider starting them together at some point yes to the first question and I would say no to the second question I I I think they definitely need to up their minutes distribution for the two of them just because I mean look this is an

Extreme circumstance as well because both of them were absolutely brilliant in this this Hawks game where they both were shooting at an incredible level that it doesn’t even it didn’t even matter if they were absolutely awful on defense like the fact of the gravity that they had uh I think they had 11

Combined threes in this game like you you have to play those guys together when they’re able to impact each other in that way now starting I think you’re putting yourself in a little bit of a harder position just because we we’re seeing them we always talk about

Staggering with like Jimmy and Bam and these guys but they’re almost staggering Tyler and Duncan not in the way of Duncan’s gonna do what Tyler does but they they need Duncan to kind of generate offense so they cannot have these moments of the game where you

Don’t have Tyler and Duncan and now you have it’s just harder to generate offense through Caleb J Rich and Haywood heith like it’s a little bit harder to do so it’s a little bit of a of a trigger uh but I’m really a big fan of the of the minutes together we were

Sitting here watching the Atlanta game we’re were like why is Duncan on the floor and there’s been games in the past even I remember over these past few weeks we’re like why is Duncan not closing like why is he not out there even I think it was the Minnesota game

Where it was like why is or it was one of those games where we were like why is he not out there uh they can play together they can I I think there’s there’s a SPO talked about the fact that they have to make up for certain things

Defensively it’s always going to be that case even though they both have improved on that end but when the offense is clicking you have to go to it and you have to make that choice defensively because at one at some point like we talk about the fourth quarter numbers

Over and over 27th in in in defense 28th in offense some point you just got to pick one like you got stop playing this Middle Ground like go all the way offense if if they have it clicking and that’s the way it was tonight and I’ll say the last

Thing the ability to impact each other has been the thing that stood out most it’s not like Tyler’s turn dun’s turn bam hand up for Tyler bam hand up for Duncan like no these guys are working together it’s Duncan on back Cuts it’s Duncan put putting the ball on the floor

It’s Tyler making a skip pass to Duncan and there was one specific play I wanted to point out from this Atlanta game where Duncan went an 11-point run he scored 11 straight he had two threes he had a floater and then he had a left-handed scoop the very next play

Tyler has the ball on his hands Duncan comes and sets a screen for him slips the screen and Tyler goes and kind of breaks down his Defender and hits It’s hits a kind of a pullup type fadeaway three that’s not possible unless Duncan brings that gravity that’s not possible

Unless Duncan’s in the action like when they’re opening each other up offensively you need to play the two together so especially on a night like this it just it just shows kind of what the the blueprint offensively in a perfect world when they’re both clicking

I want to get more into who plays with them because obviously 22 wasn’t out there with them tonight and that is a factor and you have hakz who has become a great cutter at this stage of his career which I think creates opportunities for both of them before we

Get to that though Alex the numbers let’s get to the numbers because I I think the numbers have dictated what a exposure was not done with them right and and as you were looking at up it really was their first year they tried it I mean I remember summer league it

Was Duncan nun and Tyler on that team and it worked but you’re playing against summer league competition right and obviously Kendrick nun was probably the best player on that he he made he had sort of the biggest breakout on that summer league team but then he did try

It in their first year together he even tried it with dragic some uh it was not good right do you think that’s why he’s gotten away from it so much I think that’s part of it for sure I don’t think it’s only you know it’s only about the numbers but the

Numbers definitely I don’t think you know they help I I think I was looking through it just like kind of since the beginning of the Jimmy era since Tyler and Duncan have both been a big part of it since that first year um you know that first year together together they

Were about a negative five net rating every other regular season when you’re just doing Tyler and Duncan’s minutes together it’s right around neutral it’s usually negative z. something net rating which tells you like not necessarily winning or losing those minutes very much when you throw bam into some of

Those numbers when it’s Tyler uh Duncan and Bam um throughout some of these Seasons it goes to like positive two you know uh net rating and that’s cool I think that’s kind of something to me that uh is is a big part of it because I

I do think that if you’re going to play them together play them together with bam not only because bam is an awesome player who who fits with anybody but we know that the both of them individually have a great Dynamic with bam with Duncan with his Twan game and with bam

Tyler with his Twan game with bam and it was just cool to see them I think playing around each other and kind of off of each other where it’s like you have Duncan coming off of the screens and you know doing the handoff action doing everything we know dunan can do

Tyler playing his game and I think in a game where you don’t have Jimmy to be able to put up like a really nice offensive rating overall and in the half court and again the Hawks are not a good defense at all they play at a fast pace

All that it’s still impressive to me because the you know the offensive side of the floor has been such a slug and and like just so murky throughout the Jimmy era when Jimmy is not on the floor last season it was very murky when Tyler

Wasn’t on the floor um and I do think it’s it’s just cool to see them do it without Jimmy where like they’re giving you an entire game where they’re generating offense the offense never feels like it’s you know stuck in the mud over and over and over and even

Though like they didn’t necessarily play up to their standards on defense tonight uh with the turnovers like they lost a turnover and points off turnover battle um they kind of just stuck to what they’re good at on the offensive side like they barely took any shots at The

Rim they were three of nine at The Rim tonight which is so not only did you not get there you didn’t really finish well but the things that they did really well 20 of 38 in the mid-range which is is 53% 17 of 39 from three which is 44%

They went off of jump shots and we know that this team likes to get up a lot of jump shots the three the the the amount of Threes kind of scale up and down on a night toight basis but when it’s Tyler leading the way instead of Jimmy you’re

Probably going to get a few more threes up especially when Tyler and Duncan are playing together and I think them figuring out you know um that Dynamic with Tyler and Dunkey together specifically if you’re putting them with bam I think it kind of unlocks some stuff for you because it’s like another

Lineup you could potentially go to and not just when Jimmy’s out and I probably wouldn’t start them together either but you could probably find ways to figure out to make it work I I just don’t think they’re going to go to that I think the fact that you can play

Them together and feel okay about it and like okay we can consistently generate offense over and over with these lineups and get teams thinking and overreacting it’s ultimately a positive for them if they can figure it out well I think that’s the balance right is you don’t have to start them

Together but you can’t be afraid to play them together and it even felt tonight like spoler was holding Robinson out because hero was in and playing well and I I it does seem like they can be additive instead of okay it has to be

One or the other and and I I do think the fact that they’re more playable defensively helps with that but also it it’s I do think it’s has something to do with the other players on the floor so I want to get into that specifically because 22 is coming back probably for

Christmas and we know that he plays different and it’s interesting when you mentioned you know the minutes with hero Robinson and Bam because both Tyler and and Duncan have unique chemistry with bam whether it’s in the actions with Duncan and Bam and the dribble handoff and just their personal relationship and

They they you know look they they take the practice court together every single game okay before the game and then we know the Tyler bam pick and roll and kind of that connection it’s a little different with Jimmy uh and so I want to touch on that here in a second before we

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Got the guts let’s get to the Jimmy Factor here um so okay I’m assuming Kyle’s gonna continue to start it looks like they’re trying to manage his minutes a little bit more I have a follow-up question related to that uh with the other guy who’s been playing at

Point guard position kind of but let’s get to the Jimmy Factor first what do you think of the of Jimmy Tyler Duncan lineups I think Jimmy in December should love them like that’s kind of where I am with them like it feels like it’s the perfect thing

That you’d want in terms of number one you don’t have to have the ball in your hands as much as he did in the past few weeks I think is what he wants like I don’t think he wants to have this this usage as high as it was and and have

Everybody look at him to kind of get them out of the mud when he’s entering the game in the score at the scores table with six minutes left like they don’t have to do that they have other options I guess in these lineups and number two it opens up Jimmy’s I guess

Interior force a little bit easier like the I keep saying the word gravity because we’ve said it for four years but like I think this is the most it’s hard to say because it’s it’s probably the most exact it’s been just because of the fact of not even the

Three-point shooting the fact that Duncan has the ability to just put the ball on the ground makes a Defender think even more that there’s just such there’s just so many pieces flying all over the place that it feels like spola should love this like these are things

Like saying how do they fit in Jimmy next to a two Elite Shooters playing at a high level like this is like the most ideal situation you could possibly be in so I think they could definitely do it I think there’s a lot of stuff where I I

Keep using the comparison to highe just because we always do the highe to Jimmy comparison but like it’s similar to that like we saw in this game where there was pockets of the game where you said okay Hae didn’t really have the ball in his

Hands of ton but then all of a sudden he has a hard drive to the rim and he’s uh getting Rim attempts and he’s putting putbacks he’s doing all that type of stuff so like it’s very similar to that obviously just on a on a little bit of a

Smaller scale but I’m glad you mentioned before because I don’t think it’s hero Duncan Twan game that we’re talking about it’s really about the lineups around them because like you’re not playing Tyler at the two dun get at the three and Kyle at the one you’re not

Playing even it’s I’m still you I know you were teeing up the question but I’m not really that into the Jay Rich at the one Tyler at the two dun get three Tyler and Duncan need to be the backourt in those lineups in my opinion it has to be

If it’s if it’s Jimmy haimy bam if it’s Haywood if it’s Caleb if it’s any of those guys I think they can get away with it they actually ran a lineup today where we were talking about it with Kevin Love which is now you’re really talking about a lot of shooting but now

You’re really talking about a very small margin for error defensively uh so ideally you want bam to be mirrored with those lineups at all time but uh I am just interested that and I’m glad you mentioned before I I’ll just say Tyler’s answer the question about the summer

League because it is funny because we we we talk about them evolving and like you know not really having large sample sizes of them on the floor together or at least positive ones they literally started together in summer league and that’s where they both got it like made

A name for themselves they made a name for themselves in that summer league together and they played well together like they both had big kind of performances in that area so that’s just a funny perspective but it really is about the lineups I think Jimmy’s going

To defer and he could probably play a little bit of an easier game so we’ll see what they do now Philly though that’s a different game because Jimmy’s going to want I think Jimmy’s gonna want the ball in his hands a little bit for a Christmas Day game against Philadelphia

76ers I I think that when we look at where this goes it it does matter we talk about being positionist in so many ways but I’m with you they need to be the back court I I don’t like them with Kyle and I don’t like them with Josh I I just I

Just don’t they need uh they need Cutters who are gonna get into the paint um and create that kind of space we we’ve talked about Duncan and hakz having this kind of innate chemistry already it’s funny I talked to Josh a little bit after the game because he

Play again he played with Duncan but he played with like Duncan g-league Duncan right like was crazy because I remember Duncan filling in for Dwayne as a as a rookie as a starter and he’s like no he’s added a lot to his game since then

And I I but he’s added a lot like in the last two months like it’s it’s not it’s not like he’s like added a lot for four years ago but Tyler has also I think Tyler’s patience now and the way he’s reading things makes it easier for him

To understand when to let Duncan go and when not to and so I do think that sper is gonna have to find a way to get the two of them out there more together but not as starters I I I threw it out there kind of for heat Twitter tonight and

Probably like the time you listening to this last night or the night before but I don’t I don’t know it’s sustainable when you’re seeing Tyrese Maxi on the other side right or or you’re going against a back court of what Drew and Derek white okay or

Something like that like I I I think as they start to go further it makes more sense to have this weapon Off the Bench I just don’t want to see spoler go through too many more first halfs playing dunk in just 10 minutes like that that doesn’t make any sense he is

Too impactful for them this season he makes things too easy for others find the minutes somewhere else it’s cut back on someone else’s minutes I hate to say it J Rich okay Kyle um you know I I think Caleb played pretty well in this game against Atlanta but there

Are games you could probably shave a little of his we talked about Haywood in and out you know and obviously Kevin’s you know not gonna play a full compliment of minutes in every game Duncan has to be getting 25 plus minutes on a consistent BL basis Tyler it’s hard

To even quantify it because he’s played so few games and obviously he’s been great when he’s played Duncan has been like their most consistent BL this year like you know what you’re getting from him pretty much every night but I I want to go to you on that Alex as Jimmy comes

Back and now again we’re starting to see the pieces here hakz was saying on the way out we haven’t seen our team yet okay um and they’re 17 and 12 they have this kind of this very confident Duncan Robinson Tyler’s playing at a high level how do you think spol manages this now

And and who who goes I guess yes from the from the core group here yeah it’s a tough question and I think what you’re talking about is absolutely right and kind of where I landed too I think you find a way to get Duncan more minutes

And I think just he’s been one of your five best players easily this season five most consistent five best five most impactful however you want to sort it he’s there not that you know he’s been carrying them but he is such an offensive engine for them when he’s out

There like things are just always moving uh and I think the teams ball movement goes up when he’s out there I think you got to find ways for him to play and I agree with you whether it’s cutting Josh’s minutes cutting a guy like hayward’s minutes if he’s not having a

Good game Kyle for sure I think can play less he was playing a whole lot and probably too much uh when Tyler and Bam were out so you know him not playing too much doesn’t bother me I think Duncan is like Duncan is not a point guard however

Duncan Duncan Robinson and what he does his impact gets them into way more offense than what Kyle does again I’m not trying it you’re funny I’m not I’m not gonna argue with you on that I know you will but it’s 100% true I I think there’s no it’s not even hating on Kyle

It’s just like Duncan is an engine for them offensively in ways that Kyle can’t dream of at this at this stage of his career like I just think they he gets them moving you can’t play him a one stin per half type of guy anymore I don’t think you should be staggering him

And Tyler like they can’t be played together and I do think um you know it’s a big development for them and how it works out is a is a tough question because I really do think it’s just about cutting you know specific guys minutes here and there doesn’t have to

Be anything drastic but play them together and I think to me I would probably just stick to playing them with bam because it’s probably a lot easier and smoother to figure out but I don’t think you can’t play them which I mean like what Brady was saying you know

Having two guys who can make plays on for for themselves now with with the improvements that Duncan made um and get to the rim create shots for others and also space the floor a really really high level like it’s a great thing for Jimmy and I do think you can figure out

Ways to make that work and just to give some of the numbers they that uh tandem the three of them Jimmy uh Tyler and Duncan have only played 15 minutes this season negative 49 net okay so 15 minutes is obviously nothing I’m not gonna take away too much for

That as it yeah no that doesn’t include tonight that doesn’t include tonight I don’t think it does um Jimmy didn’t play so just oh yeah yeah no you’re right and then you look at last season the entirety of last season Jimmy Tyler and Bam I mean excuse me Jimmy Duncan and

Tyler played 25 minutes together negative 21 net rating whole season the entire season last season 25 max out there with him that’s why that’s the thing Max had taken that role and you know that’s kind of what it was the season before when they were the first seed that tandem played 125 minutes

Together the whole season still not that much they were about neutral so it’s not like the numbers are screaming hey you got to play play these guys more together but I do think like the growth that Tyler has made the growth that Duncan has made I do think it’s

Something that you can that’s worth trying out during the season and although I feel more confident about them playing together with bam than with Jimmy you can make it happen and they have enough around them defensively in theory at least because some of these guys I don’t think they’ve been

Consistently great defensively as a team I think they have enough around them to kind of you know help cover those holes up and they’ve gotten better as Defenders I think this is the season to really I think lean into playing them more together all I’m going to first

Thing that’s crazy that they played so few minutes with Jimmy but I’ll just close with this this is a weird team because I’m gonna go through this you ready and we’re gonna finish with this thanks for our sponsors better Edge uh and also water cleanup of Florida they

Have two point guards right I guess Josh Richardson’s kind of a point guard sort of a point guard wasn’t a point guard the last time he was here he’s kind of the backup point guard Kyle Lowry’s kind of a point guard but not the point guard

He used to be how many guys because you mentioned it so I’m going to play off of this how many guys on this team initiate offense better than their two point guards because I’ll start you ready okay you ready Jimmy right bam uh Tyler Duncan hakz we’re at five

Okay we’re gonna say Caleb we’re gonna We gonna push it to six he he brings the ball up the floor okay who who gets does does Caleb does not does not get them into more offense than Kyle or Josh does he I think he capitalizes off like I think there’s more of an

Oddball like capitalizing off a possession but initiating is a little tough but I could I would give it to you if you really wanted to make a case for like I I could I would I could potentially give it to you all right but the the first five

We’re not arguing right B B bam Tyler Jimmy hero Duncan who would have said who would have said before this season that they’re getting into better offense with Duncan Robinson initiating making the reads making the passes than Kyle Lowry have a good night everybody me thank you for listening to

The five on the floor on the fireing sports network after all someone needs to listen to my dad

After Tyler Herro and Duncan Robinson led the Heat to a win against Atlanta, can Erik Spoelstra use the two of them more consistently than he has in the past? Ethan, Alex & Brady discuss the possibilities and concerns.

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