The Close Up with Phillip Rossman-Reich

The Close Up with Phillip Rossman-Reich

All right all right all right welcome to another episode of the closeup of part of the M Orlando Magic HQ Network I’m your host Stephen Cameron today we got my good friend Phil Rossman Wright what’s going on man welcome back to the show how you doing this evening it it is

Good to be back uh is there anything going on this week I mean any big games any big momentous occasions you know just just clear sailing into the All-Star break right pretty quiet week pretty quiett quiet week yeah no trade deadlines no Miami game for standings and nothing we’re we’re making his first

Trip to Orlando just nothing nothing going on nothing going on we’re just waiting for Tuesday the national TV game Shack Rosie retirement just we’re just waiting just a casual casual Monday uh listeners we’re recording this Monday February 5th 2024 um the magic have just uh they’re they’re on a three-game winning streak

And uh they have some really fun things like like we were teasing the trade deadline uh big game vers Miami Heat that Philip is going to road trip down for um all sorts of things you know this new big closing lineup so we have a few things we’re going to talk about today

With with with with Philip you know like I said the three- game winning streak we’re we’re going to dig in a little bit to Cole Anthony in that second unit just because they’ve been struggling a little bit and we want to figure out why um obviously that the big lineup that we’ve

Been closing with with ji playing um without a point guard it’s it’s a massive lineup all four guys plus a 64 or seven or 610 and above it’s wild and jayen Suggs being the shortest guy in the court um and then obviously trade deadline stuff so before we get into

That with Philip though uh just a couple of housekeeping things I want to remind you of um we are part of the believe podcast Network make sure you tap into all the believe content um you know they’re GNA have a lot of Super Bowl stuff coming up this week they’re really

Big into the NFL also they have a bunch of uh NBA podcasts so go ahead check out believe podcast Network um second thing check out our Instagram subscription program we’re about to be doing another giveaway probably uh probably after after the allstar break I believe we’ll probably run another one um but even

Outside of that come join our subscription program it’s five bucks a month it gets you into the group chat it gets you 20% off select home games they actually just released the rest of the home games for the season uh and it it’s pretty sick there’s some good games on

There that you can get some good discounts on um we’re going to be doing a Q&A after the trade deadline probably next week for like just Round Table talk for our group um and then we just do custom content just for you guys so think about joining that that five bucks

Just comes back to you eventually with like better content um and you know giveaways and stuff like that allows us to just keep pushing this train along so uh all your supports really appreciated we’re very thankful of that and we’re very thankful for all of our current

Subscribers so appreciate you all um and then the last thing we’re gonna do is we’re GNA talk about our presenting sponsor of the week uh it’s the normal bet online um they’re they’re great partners of us we love bet online was actually on their site just the other

Day thinking I I might need to play some bets recently um because it’s playoff time and the road to the NFL Victory goes through San Francisco and Kansas City bet online is your number one source for playoff football odds stats Trends and lines with everything from point spreads to hundreds of player

Performance prop and prop bets head to bet online today to stay updated on all the action bet online where the game starts another thing that you can use bet online for and and philli I we did not talk about this but I’m I’m just bringing you in hot right now just

Because I want to give our sponsor a little bit of extra love and I wna kind of jump in and tease a little bit of what we’re getting into tomorrow the Orlando Magic play Miami Heat pretty big pretty big game there’s there’s a lot on the line for for this it’s it’s it’s

Potential tiebreaker stuff going on for the playoffs there are playoff team their standings they’re they’re we’re neck and neck the stand division title for that Banner y think that doesn’t matter but it does it does matter it does you still hang banners for that we need banners in the practice courts all

Right like come on people um so yeah I I might I might have to place a bet on that one I might have to place a bet on that philli if you were to place a bet I would just highly encourage you to go to bet online uh and place a bet through

Them because they’re great and you can use them in a lot of places that you can’t use other traditional betting websites I’m not encouraging anything but I also am at the same time all right um Phillip the magic are 27 and 23 it’s funny they actually haven’t lost a game since my last

Episode I’m calling I’m calling our mutual friend Richard you’re putting all the pressure on me now like if no it’s it’s a locked on it’s a locked on um you know closeup collaboration because it was Richard staman was my gu guest last week locked on Big Board you know locked

On Magic we’re just going to keep this train rolling baby um 27 and 23 they are currently let me get back to my standings um seventh in the that puts them they are seventh in the East one game one game up on Miami oh I got this

Memorized I got my podcast record right after this it’s nice it’s it’s it’s fun because just a few weeks ago we were like pretty solidly an eighth and then the heat started dropping the Bulls started catching which put a little fire under our ass it was a little scary um

And then Indiana just kind of you know they didn’t go too high they didn’t go too low they just kind of stayed stagnant um just with like where the magic are right now you know we’ve won three in a row we’ve won four out of the last five

And we’ve won uh three out of the last four on our five game Road Trip just how are you feeling about this team right now it things like it feels like things are changing kind of back to what we saw at the beginning of the year yeah it you

Know there definitely signs over the course of the last road trip and and and signs as this team started to get healthier that that that they were a little bit better than their record indicated and that the injuries just were really taking a toll and so as

We’ve seen guys get healthy so you know frons Vagner comes back Markel folz comes back wend Carter comes back Jonathan Isaac comes back you know now we’re seeing Gary Harris come back as these guys work their way back into the fold it just makes sense you have better

Players you know guys are back playing the roles that they thought they were going to be playing in in the in the preseason it it would make sense that things start to click a little bit more you know guys are just kind of in the right spots more often than not and so

And you know po does have to carry as much so he’s not as worn down later in games although he’s still really good in clutch situations um it’s just you know so much of it is guys are back in their proper rules and guys are back playing

Their proper proper areas they know they depth that’s been a strength of this team so they can play with the intensity and fire on defense that maybe they couldn’t when they were all hurt because you know you got to preserve yourself to get to the end of the game you can’t you

Know burn too bright because you don’t have that guy that’s coming in to to spell you um you know Jamal Bose’s I think mentioned it several times specifically referring to Jaylen Suggs play yourself to exhaustion like they want though they want guys to to get after it like that you can’t really do

That when you only have nine guys available or 10 guys available really 10 or really eight guys that you trust um you know because you know they have to throw some guys in there and and just roll the dice a little bit and see what

You have so I think health is a big part of it the schedule it you know despite how Road heavy it’s been the last couple weeks is at least on paper lightening up a little bit it so the magic are in a position where they can make some

Mistakes they can find themselves again and put themselves back into a position to start stringing together wins and obviously they’re starting to do that they have this you know last last Road game and then four straight at home and you know they’re not all easy games Oklahoma City’s a very good team New

York’s a very good team um but they have these four home games and that’s again an opportunity to really build some momentum heading into the All-Star break uh before you kind of take your last deep breath before the end of the season it’s it’s interesting it because there

Was this time when we were coming back from injury and then the team was pretty healthy for a few weeks and things still just looked off right and now they’re not and now we have not only that we have like they’re just back to their like top dominant performance on defense too and

We know from earlier that’s what was really what was bringing them wins was their defensive effort um and and and like you mentioned there’s no easy there’s no easy game in the NBA but there is easier schedules versus harder schedules right you still got to show up

In this and we learned that like versus the Grizzlies game you don’t show up you ain’t going to win even if the team is missing half their roster and honestly like even that Grizzlies game like I I I know I mention this on my pod I was more

Upset by the way they lost to Dallas than the way they lost to Memphis because they Lo the way they lost to Memphis they you know they didn’t defend great in the first half and so they kind of put themselves in the hole a little bit but I thought they played a great

Second half and they just couldn’t hit a shot and and you know that’s a problem with this team we’re not you were gonna get to it um but but um you know if you’re losing games because you just have a really bad bad shooting night which this team does you can you could

Kind of live with that I what eats me is when the magic have a great shooting night like they did Monday in Dallas and or last Monday in Dallas sure and they don’t take advantage of that because that means their defense is letting them down and that can’t happen so generally

12 points in one quarter doesn’t help it doesn’t help but you could surv you know you could survive a 12-point quarter when if you’re only giving up 20 you know they gave up what 36 38 something like that they gave up a lot you know

They went up from up six 17 to down eight you know they gave up a big swing bad very bad the defense was a bigger issue and the defense was you got them back in the game obviously but was a big issue down the stretch in that game as

Well so you know to me to me what this stretch of games has really been about is now that everyone’s healthy you’re right they’re back to their defensive identity they’re back to using their defense to lift them up and you know your defense gives your offense a chance

To to to to stay in the game and and can create some offense when you otherwise might not have it that’s big for this team and that’s their formula for success and we are seeing that in a really big way as I tease this uh with our current closing lineup um you know

We’ve seen it a couple of games now where Jaylen Suggs is at as is the smallest person on the in on the floor you can call them a point guard in this situation if you want but they’re all they’re all kind of point guards sort of in this situation uh it’s being run

Through Paulo and frons but you know so you got 64 jayen Suggs you got 610 frons at the two you got 610 Paulo at the three you got Jonathan Isaac or Wendell Carter uh you know Jonathan Isaac seven foot yeah I mean they’re just so big uh

Jonathan Isaac 7even foot uh wend Carter you know 610 and that team is that that lineup is just ridiculous um I know you have the stats in front of you probably or just memorized I think they’re like I think defensively they’re giving up like 83 points or something like like like

Just break that down break just just Jonathan Isaac big lineup closing Jonathan Isaac playing 20 minutes a game it’s pretty awesome just go I’m just gonna let you thought yeah so generally I think what we all believe is that the Magic’s overarching philosophy is let’s just get the five best players

On the court like positions are fudgy um get your five best players on the court have them be versal enough that they can guard any position that you know the versal Defenders um and you can figure out how to piece together the offense um

And so to me this is that ideal like we got to the end of that game and in uh we got to the end of that game in Minnesota and it was very much like okay the way Minnesota was defending Mar FS early on it was just like you can’t go back to

Him uh you know Cole Anthony has we’ll talk about him in a minute I I know that’s on our rundown he’s not reliable and he’s a he’s a negative defend you know not that he doesn’t try but he’s a negative Defender at this point and so the logic was just we’re defending

Really well this is a big team anyway let’s go with Isaac and obviously there’s numbers to back up that this is working I mean they’ve only played 22 minutes together which which does not feel like a lot um in six games so that’s what almost four minutes per game

Yeah um they got a 114.3 offensive rting a 97.9 defense 93 yeah um and so this is a lineup that works and I think what’s really really important to remember and I think it I think this would change things the magic have played from ah head in both of these

Games they’ve been protecting the lead and so I think the magic understand that our best defender is Jonathan Isaac like like as good as as good as this team is defensively and Jaylen Suggs has been awesome defensively Wendell Carter is great defensively Jonathan Isaac is still the best defender on this team and

When he’s healthy by a mile yeah it’s it he’s he’s the he’s the top two Defenders on this team Jonathan Isaac in the post and Jonathan Jonathan Isaac in the paint and Jonathan Isaac on the perimeter are the two best defenders on this team correct um uh um if you’re protecting a

Lead you keep your best defender out on the floor and just let him envelop anybody and fron is fron is Defender I don’t love him guarding quicker twos um for very long but for these short three four minute bursts it it’s you know a lot of us wanted to say want to compare

It to the Golden State Warriors death lineup with Draymond Green at Center everyone forgets that they really only use that lineup for like two three minutes at a time really at the end of first half so just kind of give a jolt before halftime and then they use it in

The playoffs as matchups dictated that’s kind of what the magic are doing here they use it for those last four minutes when other teams don’t really know what to do with that kind of Versatility and size and Jonathan Isaac is such a monster defensively that you know he can

Shut you know cat can push him around but he’s still G to challenge and scrap against cat you know he can switch out onto Kade Cunningham and lock him down or box out Jaylen Duran it’s all because of Jonathan putting a switch on Jonathan Isaac he

Will just yeah he’ll take any switch you give him and be fine yeah and and everyone else is capable enough defensively that when you have a lead it works like I wouldn’t say the magic executed great to close that game out on Sunday in Detroit but Detroit wasn’t

Scoring on that team either and so you could keep that lead at like six seven points instead you know I’d love to see the big send that to 10 12 so we can relax and they end up winning by 12 anyway but um but you know Detroit hung

Around but they couldn’t score on that group and so at the end of the day at the end of the day this lineup this group Jonathan Isaac is just so locked down defensively you know you wor you don’t worry so much about the offense because you’re playing with the lead

Right now anyway I am curious if the magic are trailing if they go to that lineup thinking okay we got to use our defense to create our offense but you know Jonathan Isaac is still very much work in progress on on offense even though he had he had a big shot uh he

Had the big tip in against Minnesota so again it’s not like he’s a zero but you know the magic are still playing with guys that that don’t have much of an offensive game out there yeah his offense is definitely what’s missing you know you see him trying it’s just not

All clicking together yet and shots are not falling for him yet you know there’s he’s had a couple of good moments where he’s cut to the basket well or like that tip in um he’s taken some threes but they’re just they’re not falling really he’s he’s hit a couple here and there um

At good time not running any place for him let’s let’s let’s let’s be he’s still just kind of like you know playing within the flow of what happens organically with him and and hopefully you know a lot of standing in the corner yeah yeah that’s okay for now um you

Know that that’s fine I don’t ultimately we should have other players on the team offensively that that can allow him to kind of be one of the weaker guys on that side and to and kind of sorry sorry to interrupt but to that point you know

A lot of coaches and like this is why the magic went with Terence Ross over Jonathan Isaac back in 2019 and and for parts of 2020 a lot of coaches prefer to put their best offensive lineups out late in games even if it cost them defensively because they want points

It’s almost you know it’s almost an El amending thing is like we got to hit we got to hit a Target score as much as protect the lead the magic are almost taking the opposite mentality of saying we’ve got a lead all we got to do is

Hang on and we’ve got the Ace in the Hole and Jonathan Isaac to help us do that well it also helps that we have an Ace in the Hole of Paulo and Caro offensively who can he’s pretty he’s been pretty darn clutch in fourth quarters too right so top I think he’s

Sixth or seventh in the league total touch points this and there’s still going to be some bumpy moments there but it’s like I think you’re you’re balancing the two of them out Jonathan Isaac’s lacking the offense you have Paulo uh you know you got Jonathan Isaac who’s can be

The best defender on on the court for both teams it’s you know there’s very few players in this league uh maybe two three that might be a better Defender when Jonathan Isaac is healthy and engaged and locked in um which he is most nights which is pretty awesome to

See but before we go too much deeper I want to ask specifically about Jonathan Isaac’s ramp up right so he started off this this this year before his injury playing like 12 to 14 minutes a game occasionally there was a little abnormal there there was a game where he played

Like 19 minutes game where we played like 16 or 17 but mostly kind of stayed in that 12 to 14 minute range and then they were just like about two weeks ago week and a half ago they’re like 20 plus minutes let’s let’s let’s go um and it

Looks like he’s done really well with that right there was that moment where fultz was out on the backto back after the Grizzlies game going to Memphis or I think that was the schedule um or going to not Memphis sorry going it was Phoenix Phoenix Dallas Phoenix Dallas

Phenix Dallas yeah thank you for that Phoenix at home starting on the road trip in Dallas and you know he played eight minutes in the first half magic fans calm the [ __ ] down all right they did not plan to only play him eight minutes that night

We heard it in the post game I just want to I still see some of y’all chirping out there excuse my f bomb but at the same point it’s not that hard to understand that the intention was to play in both halves he wasn’t feeling 100% they said you know what let’s not

Push that person he’s really important to us so they took him out we had May threw some things off we lost the game oh well magic fans sorry I’m on my soap box I just want you all to chill out I will play the devil’s advocate here you

Know I’m fine with all that like I get it these they’re like this isn’t 2K guys aren’t just magically better and you can play them 30 minutes you know there there is a ramp up and and they’re very careful with Isaac for very good reason my only complaint about that whole

Situation is that the magic never specifically told us what was going on they never they they they should have announced Isaac was experiencing soreness they decided to not play him in the in the second half and and that that announcement never came through their so through their PR channels on online it

Never came through the broadcast except for what Dante said saying that this was the plan which again that again is to me it’s just miscommunication totally we were happy to see Johnson Isaac play in a back-to-back period um and there’s not many of them left and as I keep reminding people there’s no

Back-to-backs in the playoffs when things really matter so let’s you know let’s be calm about it and we’ll be okay and you know it’s it’s very frustrating how they dance around that stuff and that’s never going to change know even in the post game when when when Jason was asking

Specifically about what’s going on you know it just wrapped it up as precautionary didn’t even mention like it was his thigh it was his ankle it was you know did like yeah could give us a tiny bit more but that’s just how the magic are a lot of things are scripted

With with with how they respond to injury questions it’s one game he came back the next game he was fine we’re let’s move on we’re moving on but anyways outside that one game the ramp up how are you enjoy I mean obviously I’m imagining you’re enjoying this ramp

Up but what do you kind of expect him to get at by is there another stage of this ramp up that you think he’s going to get to by the end of of the year like what what are you kind of thoughts on the ramp there there definitely is I mean

Jamal Mosley has said as as he hit that 20-minute mark that they’re trying to push him a little bit more physically they’re trying you know they’re they’re constantly communicating like how are you feeling like the sorce ISS like any soris any any like tightness anything like that but they feel they’re at a

Stage with him where they can push him a little bit you know he played the entire fourth quarter against Minnesota honestly was awesome honestly that is more significant than playing 20 minutes in the game like right like being able to play 12 minutes of an NBA game

Straight and play at the high level that he played at throughout that entire quarter like Jonathan Isaac I I don’t say won that game but Jonathan Isaac was a was a big factor in that game and it was a huge win one of the best wins of the season

Um they’re trying they’re they’re willing to push him more and to me that says he is getting healthier I mean I think obviously the big hurdle for him is playing in back-to-backs you know being able you know being comfortable enough you know there’s no back-to-backs

In the playoffs I I get I know I just said that but that is like the last big hurdle is being able to being able to kind of deal with the regular grind of the season um and not have those restrictions in place and so you know I

Think we’re still not there it wouldn’t surprise me if he plays the uh plays the the back-to-back next week Oklahoma City New York before the All-Star break because there’s no travel involved but there was another home backtack that um that uh that I think Marco folz ended up

Not playing in because uh because because even though there was no travel involved they they didn’t want to push him on a back toback so again it’s a lot of it with these guys is like this team has their benchmarks you know they ask how the guys are doing

They you know they have their dat they have data on all these guys I they used to have catapult I don’t know if they still have catapult but they have they all have wearables like they know like what these guys are and whether that science is good or not the NBA seems to

Be disputing some of it the magic have their benchmarks to say okay he’s ready for to do this and then they’re going to do it and kind of like concussion protocol they’re going to do it see how you feel and then you got to you know

Kind of do all the the other steps before before you get to do it again um so you know I’m a big believer just like everything else it’s process over results we can discuss and say whether the process is flawed whether magic need a new process that’s not really for us

To say we’re not doctors but as long as the magic are following that process and and and they feel he’s they’re ready to push him a little bit more then they’re doing the right things I I personally don’t have a problem with the process I

Think the only thing I wish we had more and it’s not even ji related give us better communication on things like it doesn’t have to feel like a script to where people like you who are in the post game don’t even want to ask questions and waste a question on it

Because you’re just going to get a a blanket response I had some people in uh in one of our postam and look I like I get some of it like I get not putting a timeline on a guy like like Jeff Jeff Jeff wman is explained why they don’t

Put timelines on players they don’t want to put pressure on the player to come back sooner and get hurt they don’t want to set a dat and then they hit that date and they’re like well he’s not ready and now everyone’s ticked off at the team there’s other ways they can balance that

Stuff yeah that’s not going to change so like like we’re an understanding media we’re not like New York we’re not sharks there’s like five of you know there’s five of us in that room like we’re not we’re not out here to get anybody you know for the most part you know maybe

There’s maybe there’s a few people U that that Pat Beverly sends in but um we’re not out here to get people like we get it um and and so like I I I there’s not an adversarial relationship but it’s it’s it definitely feels like like hey

You can trust us that we’re not going to exploit the information that you give it yeah to aggregated I that’s how I feel I don’t know I don’t know maybe maybe we need to be like that I don’t know I don’t think so no I don’t maybe that’s an offir conversation I don’t

Think that’s the right way to do journalism so that’s no no no they’ve been fair with us uh we should continue to be fair with them um all right let’s move past ji and how we wishes front office we talk a little bit more about injury we don’t have to totally move on

Past J I’m sure come back the good news is no one’s hurt now so there’s nothing to say we’re good yeah exactly everyone’s healthy for once it’s pretty nice um all right the second unit I want to talk about the second unit for a second and Cole Anthony specifically he

Has been in a slump uh there was a a photo of God what was the NBA player it there was an NBA player and they did the photo before and after haircut and it was just like before haircut bad after haircut stats were insane um and it’s

Kind of been the same with Cole except in Reverse before haircut great after a haircut the Mojo has been gone um granted he was dealing with an injury for a long time and he was playing through it which definitely probably was a factor in his performance um and I

Don’t know maybe he’s still dealing with that right now I’m not sure but what’s your thoughts on Cole Anthony and the second unit like they used to be one of the best second units in the in the league as far as scoring and now I can’t

Say they’re even close to that so yeah what’s going uh you know a lot of it I think is I think Cole is probably still dealing with that quad issue um and so hope you know I will be I’m concerned don’t get me wrong but I I will be more

Concerned if it’s still an issue if this is still an issue after the All-Star break if you know he doesn’t get that we off and he doesn’t look a little bit springy and refresh but honestly like I think some it is this is just kind of

How Cole Anthony is like I we’ve had three three four years with him now and I I feel like he maybe not this bad like this might be worse than usual but it all it does feel like he goes in and out like he has a long stretch where he

Isn’t playing at the level that he was maybe earlier in the season and I think that that is you know that is just kind of who he is like he’s really streaky and so so the problem may not necessarily be Cole Anthony the problem may be that the

Magic are relying on Cole Anthony to to be a six man to to to play that role and maybe the thing you had to figure out this year was whether he could fulfill that role or not you know I’m I’m a big believer like this year is very much

About figuring things out and figuring out you know kind of what a what this team looks like as a playoff team that may be one of the things you’re figuring out and obviously that sucks right now because the magic be offense and in that second unit especially with fron out you

Know now that fron is back maybe he starts playing a little bit more regular rotation minutes um you have you need to have that that primary horr and Cole was doing a lot of it um you know running his more stuff through Joe Engles so Cole’s working off the ball working off

Rotations uh getting frond back in back with that group uh playing his regular minutes because his minutes have been you know slowly been ticking up as well um as he comes back from his injury um you know it it’s it’s going to come down to just Cole making shots like again

Like I I hate to say it like so many of the Magic’s problems it isn’t rocket science they have to make shots and Cole is really good at getting in the paint and taking these kind of floaters and right now those floaters aren’t going in and that’s all touch that’s all feel um

There’s not a lot more you can do than get those shots and just be confident that you can make them and you know maybe Cole makes them a little tougher than he has to maybe Cole has to be a little bit better of a passer but that’s

Also part of the problem with Cole is he’s small like like again like I mentioned earlier it his his defense is not bad for lack of trying the guy tries real hard on defense but he’s small and everyone takes advantage of that in in especially with the way the magic want

To play and so I think some of this is you have to WR ride this wave and hope that this deep valley leads to a high peak again uh but it may just be the realization that Cole isn’t the Sixth Man option that he looked like he was

Early in the season and now the magic have to figure out a way to fill that role again it’s it’s interesting because like they just gave him a three-year extension um you know and he’s just yeah he’s just been really on andof streakiness and it it’s

Like you want to love Cole and you want to root for him hard because he’s a fun personality he’s an Energizer he’s a ride or die with this group like there there is no bigger cheerleader on this team for his than Cole Anthony like he is he is really important to that

Slocker room but the the the the coaching staff is starting to make adjustments because of his poor play the last two games he hasn’t scored or he hasn’t he hasn’t played over 12 minutes in either game he played 12 in the Timberwolves game and he played 10 or 11

In the Detroit game so they are making adjustments for that which I want magic fans to like realize because you know online I’m hearing you know let’s get Anthony back playing over him right let’s do this let’s do that well they’re making adjustments he’s getting less playing time because he’s not playing as

Good he hasn’t been as effective so they’re pulling him out sooner and playing other guys longer like Jonathan Isaac playing the entire fourth quarter the other night that that definitely fed into a little bit of Cole Anthony’s minutes there and it’s just just important little things to realize that

I just want to point out that you know again the coaching staff is making adjustments we hope Cole can find himself again offensively with his efficiency because when he is on he is awesome he is a great player for that second unit um but and and and I want to

Point out too like sure the second unit is still winning a lot of these minutes like they the magic destroyed Minnesota in the second and fourth Quarters on Friday they they won the Pistons game because of their second and fourth quarter so even though Cole may not

Necessarily be scoring and and he can be a bit of a drain they’re still winning these minutes uh I don’t know what his plus minus is in these last couple games um but at least during this win streak the magic are still like winning the minutes that Cole Anthony are is

Typically it would typically be in the game just just generally so I’ll tell you it’s plus minus his plus minus in the Detroit game was a negative one but something funny his plus minus in the uh in the Timberwolves game he was a plus two so again individual plus minus in an

Individual game doesn’t tell much yeah uh and obviously like the magic were down 17 you know if Cole plays a little bit better maybe that that that number jumps up a little bit more um I’m not we’re not saying here that the magic don’t need more from Cole but like at

The end of the day the only stat that matters for any of us is did you win the game did you score more points to the other team like that’s that’s the stat that matters the rest of the season um you know because we’re in a playoff

Chase yeah and you want to be able to like just rely on that second unit to to do their job and and and score and you know when Cole’s on you just want to see him continue to make buckets it’s just fun it’s fun and it’s hard and

Frustrating to see him struggle right now because he’s one of the few offensive players that can really help swing this team um you know and get hot on the second unit and we don’t have many players that can just get hot and get going right there’s couple and

Cole’s one of them but he hasn’t been there I which then brings me to the trade deadline right we’re a few days away we are we’re three days away when you guys is two days away things could be happening by the time you listen we could have Deontay Murray or

Broken surgery repaired Zack LaVine on this team in a day probably not neither one of those are actually gonna happen but it’s it’s possible uh that they could do something big by the time you hear this podcast sorry I had a tab the ESPN tab was playing an ad in my ear at

The same time I had to quickly close that Tab out um and I’m just checking right now WJ has not dropped anything about the Orlando Magic his last post was six hours ago about Donovan Mitchell playing in the three-point shooting contest in All-Star break so um with

This team with some of the holes that we have with them having all their own picks plus a bunch of extra seconds plus an extra first plus some pick swaps with Phoenix um and a bunch of really tradable contracts what are you how are you feeling about this trade deadline we

Could do something big we’ve been connected to a few people you and I as we were talking in this leadup obviously don’t think we’re g to do something big but I do think they’ll be personally I think we’re going to do something that will affect the roster in a positive way

Right um how are you feeling about this trade deadline yeah you know I think I I think the biggest thing for me is that the posture for this franchise and for this team is completely different than anything we’ve seen from Jeff welman before we are no longer

Sellers at the deadline the magic are buyers they’re looking to find something to make this team better they’re not looking to collect assets they’re not looking for draft picks they’re looking for a way to make this team better but I I still think the most important thing

To recognize and understand is that the Magic The Magic aren’t necessarily playing for the season um you know as much as I think we all want to get to the six seed and that’s very much in play the magicar half game back of Indiana they’ve won that season series

Already they got Indiana one more time in Orlando um you know they got you know one of the easier schedules left in this in the NBA at least my opponent win percentage um there’s very real opportunity for Orlando to avoid the play entirely but nothing Orlando’s

Doing is going to ensure that like they don’t care about that they’re looking at a at a two to four year window they’re looking at the next two to Four Seasons like what can we bring that’s going to help us next season and set us up or or

Tell us something about this group uh moving forward so that we can get you know from where we are this year to second round next year to Eastern Conference Finals in three four years to NBA finals in let’s say five six years like that is the track the team wants to

Be on and so they’re not about to go spend all their most valuable assets to go get a z you know if Zack LaVine were healthy a Zack LaVine a dejonte Murray a D’Angelo Russell they’re they’re not about to kind of go crazy just to make sure they make the playoffs this year

They’re pretty sure they’re in the playin they’re pretty sure they’re in the seven eight game regardless that’s huge progress for this group and for this team um as much as we would like to just be six and and and no one’s gonna say no to no to that but um this magic

Team is thinking still longterm and so when you look look at the trade market a what do the magic have that that they’re willing to give up that won’t disrupt the apple cart too much um because I I I do think you know they’ve said it all season long they

Value their continuity they value that familiarity and yeah things may be bumping up against the ceiling for this group and I I believe that wherever they end up this year as as far as this group is constructed will go they definitely need to add things but they don’t want to just throw away

What they built they they want to give this I think like honestly they want to give this team the chance to go as far as they can go and then make some and then make some decisions like honestly like I know a lot of magic fans have

Been obsessing over tus Jones and there there’s a lot of reasons to like tus Jones but honest but honestly like I look at this team and I think to myself I don’t really know I I know they need a point guard I know they need shooting I

Don’t really know exactly what they need until we get get into a playoff series and they just get their butts kicked by someone like I want to see how Milwaukee I want to see how Milwaukee just tears them apart or Boston ter because that’s gonna tell you a whole lot more about

Where Paulo and frons are and what they need to work on that’s gonna tell you a whole lot more about what this team actually needs to succeed and and look some of it’s obvious they need shooting if they can you know flip Gary Harris for a shooter you know for like a Luke

Canard or for Doug mcder if they feel like they can cover for the defense I think that’s low cost um trading Markel fols to me is a little bit riskier because so many players on this team love Markel and trust him and you know how hard he’s fought to stay in the stay

In the league and I think a new voice there is a is a much bigger risk than I think people you know people believe but having said that if it makes the team better it makes the team better and and and ultimately that’s the goal for me

Though the goal is better for the next two to four years not this year and and I think that’s that’s going to be the bigger challenge because you know a lot of things the magic could do and and that honestly includes like pushing in for dejon Murray they can wait for the

Summer and do them like tus Jones if tus Jones is really their guy they can just sign him in the summer outright and they don’t have to spend anything to get him um I hope he’s not their guy I don’t think I don’t think he is either but but

I have thoughts on tus Jones there’s there’s yeah there’s a there’s logic there I don’t think he’s their guy either but there’s logic there so you can’t ignore he’s there he could be their guy if they want to eventually move him to the six-man role and be

Looking for another point guard in two years that’s my theory I think you have I would be fine with tyus Jones but to me that just feels like another stop Gap right because we have to pay him another contract he’s 61 he’s not a good Defender as much as people want to lie

To themselves and say he is he’s not he’ll be a better defender in the Magic’s defensive atmosphere but when you get to the playoffs you’re going to find out you can’t two 61 guards right you just simply can’t have that you’re going to get destroyed with them getting

Attacked and especially the way the magic want to switch like they they want switching schemes they want to be able to switch one through five like I think if you get tyus Jones you’re saying goodbye to Cole Anthony in a season or two I think that’s might the case either

Way yeah and you might and that that might be the case you’re right but but that’s just my that’s just my theory right there like if you’re let’s be let’s be real here though you know we just had that big conversation about whether Cole Anthony is the six man or

Not um like us wavering on that is very much a sign that he’s probably not part of this team moving forward and and I think what’s really really important to remember is they just can’t trade him because they literally just sign him to an technically can but they’re not going

Trade is very complicated I don’t think they I don’t think they will but um even this summer I think is too soon I think they’ll do him at the next line at the earliest but this like the team that they have now is not the team they’re

Winning a championship with no of course not outs like Pao and fron are the only two players that I feel confident will be on the CH the whatever the championship team of the magic is Jaylen Suggs might be the only guy I throw in there next I might throw in Anthony

Black maybe Jed Howard but other than that every like everybody is up for grass so yeah you know at some point the magic are gonna have to ask themselves very difficult questions about guys that have been on this roster for a long time that has that have helped build this

Thing and figure out how do we maximize these spots around our two guys that we’re really invested in sorry go ahead no and so like some of these questions honestly like like I have a lot of questions about Wendell Carter um and and I know I voiced them

Over the summer yeah where I’m not sure you can have a center in the playoffs who isn’t an Above the Rim Center but but I think wend Carter’s earned the right to prove to us whether that thesis is true or not and and so that’s a question that I don’t think’s

The most pressing question like like the most pressing thing for the magic is finding shooting um the second most pressing question is finding more shooting and probably the the third most pressing question is what are you doing at point guard and so when I look at this this team and it’s no coincidence

That like everything we’ve talked about at the deadline has been point guards it’s been you know tus Jones it’s been dejonte Murray it’s been Malcolm Brogden it’s been Chris Paul for a little while it’s been uh you know it it’s been point guards um and you know I I think that

Honestly I think the way that Jeff wman operates he wants to Value continuity he’s he’s not going to make these wholesale changes unless his back’s against the wall and he has to they’re going to trust that they have a solid group that’s building a good foundation and then start layering these things on

And so this summer it this this offseason this next like transaction cycle so the deadline into the offseason um is going to be about finding a point guard and and adding some shooting and then from there they can incorporate that into their culture and then figure

Out what the next thing is that they need to to get where they want to go I don’t think anyone’s really expecting like a big move I do think there’s like a marginal move that’s going to happen where you know Gary Harris could be flipped maybe chumo KK and seconds I

Salary filler he does have value for salary filler I do I do think the and I’ve have no nothing to support this but I do think the magic are probably open to trading their draft pick and oh yeah they should be I think they’re they’re not using Jed Howard right now like what

Are they going to do with another with another rookie on their Roost Jed Howard can be the rookie next year exactly um but I think like you know just going into that and part of the reason why I was going into the tus Jones rant was more just

Like one tus isn’t a long-term fix at point guard as as a starter right and you got and and you you have to pay him this Summer he’s probably you’re probably looking at figuring out that situ ation again as a starter in another year or two and he is going to the

Second unit so like if you want the magic to trade for that point guard right now tus Jones that’s that’s likely the timeline you’re also seeing us having this question all over again in a year and a half um Mark hultz he’s expiring I don’t personally see him back

On this team next year but this front office also is not scared to let people like hit free agency in the summer like they want to bring him back they can bring him back they can extend them if they you know I’m sure they can negotiate they Jun or they’ve been fine

To let people just walk they we’ve seen both and that is okay Marquel Foltz doesn’t have a lot of value around the rest of the league right now either he’s played 16 games maybe 17 so far this season um so I just like kind of wanted

To like harp on that just for a second like I’m with you I think the splashiest move they could make but then this goes everything against we just said is like Malcolm Brogden but that ruins the continuity thing because to me if you’re getting Malcolm Brogden you got to throw

Out you know Markel PTZ to go get him yeah and like I mean I I think Brogden is a really good fit and and I think he would at least give this team a kind of test for what they’re looking for point guard because you know part of this

Equation two is if they really believe in Anthony black then all they need is a placeholder all they need is a guy to hold the hold the boat steady for two years until Black’s ready to take over but having said that they have shown no inclination that Anthony black is a

Point guard they don’t play him like a point guard they don’t use him like a point guard he’s you know he they’re they’re very like kids gloves with him uh almost too much he he deserves to do more than he than he’s done um and

So you know I I I don’t know if they’re looking for the answer but they’re looking for an answer to hold their boat steady for the next two to four years as they figure some stuff out they figure out who they are and so you talk about

Like I don’t think I don’t necessar I like in as an idea I I don’t think there’s necessarily a trade framework with Portland to make it work with what Portland’s looking for um if the magic do go all in I I do think there’s an opportunity

To do so with the Jon Murray to get kind of a third All-Star level player um he fits the size that they like you know he’s not a terrible Defender he’s not a great defender and and I think being in the Atlanta atmosphere hurts him a little bit defensively he goes for

Steals a lot um yeah but he gives you another great score big point guard doesn’t need the ball in his hands all the time although he’s better with it um they have an opportunity to go all in on him he’s cost controll for the next four

Years he’s 18 million this year and then his extension kicks in next year um there there there is an opportunity there I just I just don’t think the magic feel like they’re ready for it like they they want to give Paulo and fron the latitude to make mistakes so

Like I think they’re trying to look for someone who is going to to help this team but be as least disruptive as possible and that and that’s where I feel like a Brogden if they could make a trade work there around folon a pick would be fine um you know and again like

Well you know magic fans like well you just want on this rant on tyus Jones and how he’s not a long-term solution Brogden would be the same thing but but Brogden is is like you don’t have to pay him again right where we do have to pay

Tyus Jones who is 26 27 would w a four-year contract got this year next year it’s it’s a little easier to deal with you know and potentially is a and he tests a theory for you like to me to me the big thing is okay we know this magic team

Like size let’s find like let let’s grab a big point guard who can shoot right that doesn’t necessarily need to be have a ball in his hands and let’s see if poo can run a lot more point or usage is very friendly when it comes to a

Situation like that he can be a little bit heavy he can be on off he can be you know light he can score when you need him to score more but he he’ll be F yeah is a good theory to test but you know ultimately you and I agree if they’re

Going to do something it’s going to be on the margins you and I might be a little bit different on how big of a margin it might be like I I think maybe something like Brogden could be a little bit more realistic than that’s to me that’s that’s like that’s the that’s

That’s a big deal I think it’s a big deal to an extent other than like probably not it’s probably not even like I mean I guess is a bigger deal but it’s like I I the reason why I’m saying margin is because it’s probably not

Going to cost you a good a really good asset to go get it’s not it’s going to cost a Denver pick probably and that’s really that’s that’s G to be a bad pick that’s almost a the first round of the the first pick in the second round might

Be more valuable than the Denver pick to be realistic yeah so um yeah maybe maybe but yeah I think it’s gonna be you know like like a couple of the names you said Alex Burks type Luke Canard yeah um you know those types of guys Harris in a

Couple seconds might might be able to get you or something or Gary Harrison chuma if you need salary filler um you know in a couple of seconds or protected first or something like that can go get you so we’ll see we are just hours if not day days to hours away from this

Trade deadline shaking out I do expect something because the front office has done something every single deadline I don’t think it’s going to be a nothing um but I do think something will happen which will be interesting so um Phillip any last thoughts before we

Wrap this podcast up uh you know as as much as this trade deadline stuff is is exciting to talk about I I’m I’m really excited about this playoff Chase and and like like I I’m I think I’m an outlier I care more about games than that transactional part of the NBA sure like

Tuesday like I I assume this is going up Tuesday yeah Tuesday’s game against Miami is is about as big of a game that the magic have played and like we all felt how big that Boston game felt uh in the inseason tournament and a lot of that felt a little manufactured it was

Black Friday it was an afternoon game the Celtics always bring a lot of heat to the building um it you know the inseason tournament was a new thing it really felt like the magic could advance in that but like this is this is a big game on the road against your instate

Rival like I mentioned it like the division championship actually matters if there’s a three-way tie between Indiana Orlando and Miami for um the first tiebreaker after obviously they they’ll have the same record the first tiebreaker is division winner if one of those three teams wins their division they win the tiebreaker and so

Like Orlando being able to tie the season series with Miami they have the ability to catch up in in in Conference record to them um to set up that to have a chance to set up that scenario and potentially win the division like it doesn’t feel big because division don’t

Matter anymore but it’s big and so there is a lot in this game it’s not only that it’s going four- one on this five game Road Trip is huge is huge you get and then you get four games at home heading into the All-Star Break um it’s a chance

To rebuild a lot of that Goodwill you had back in November you know they’re on a three- game win streak now you win that you win this game you’re at four you get San Antonio that gets see to five Chicago is a winnable game at six

And then you you’re setting up that huge game against Oklahoma City you’re playing your you know your best basketball in front of a national television audience hopefully you know you have a chance to really kind of build yourself back up and and potentially climb some teams in the

Standings again that that that you maybe let get ahead of you uh during this room so beating Miami means a lot to this to these magic players I I I think they do view Miami as kind of the measure um in the Southeast in the division like they

See them a lot um these games I think do matter to the magic I know they matter to a lot of people within the organization that that maybe aren’t playing I know it means a lot to the fans it’s a big game like like it is big

Game it’s a big big game a lot of fans hate Miami yeah lot magic fans of the building probably yeah it’s going to be a lot of fun they have been traveling you’ve been traveling well you’ve been I know you dude the road trips are have

Been fun it’s been fun to see you on some road games I uh I’m glad and happy and I know a lot of magic fans are to see more than just magic paid media in those rooms and Jason and it’s really nice to have you out there and uh we’re

Psyched I just want to give every fan uh that’s listening to the show right now if you haven’t done so go to Phillips patreon page and subscribe do that before you even subscribe to our HQ page to be honest um it’s the same amount of dollar it’s $5 doll a month you

Literally will have something in your inbox every day that is that is custom made just for for the patreons um I think it’s every day but but like I’m I’m I’m about daily like I’ve missed a few days here and there but it’s and it is some of the best paid

Content the the six-man show do great things we have one I know there’s some other guys that do some patreon type stuff they’re all good Phillips is the best by far it’s the one you will learn the most about basketball on so um I just want to like plug that because I am

A believer I am a paying subscriber of his service um I learn a lot from it so go sign up for philli because the more you do that the more he can go on road trips the more he he’s going to the playoffs to cover this team to help him

Out all right um it’s it’s it ain’t it’s just just go do it it’s it’ll be the best five bucks you spend all season on the magic so um with all that being said thanks for tuning in Philip go ahead tell everyone where they can find your

Work yeah if you want to subscribe to that patreon page it’s the Orlando Magic Hub so it’s patreon.com orlandomagic Hub uh you you can of course find my work at Orlando you can find my free work at orlandomagic daily.com as well as the podcast I host locked on Magic if you

Want a daily dose of magic podcast goodness uh every day yes um tune in to that stuff guys it’s great I listen I’m a lock magic I will probably not be quoting Dr Dre very often I didn’t even catch that I’m obviously tired I love it though um

Thank you so much I appreciate you joining the show let’s go magic let’s beat the heat let’s let’s let’s crush it and uh thanks for tuning to another episode of the closeup Peace

In the latest installment of The Close Up podcast, we’re thrilled to have Philip Rossman-Reich of Locked On Magic and Orlando Magic Daily! The two discuss various topics, from the Magic current impressive play, the BIG closing lineup with JI, Cole Anthony’s current struggle, the trade deadline, and much more!

You won’t want to miss this one.

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