Orlando Magic: Paolo extension, trading for a scorer, and more | 2025 Offseason Preview | Podcast

Orlando Magic: Paolo extension, trading for a scorer, and more | 2025 Offseason Preview | Podcast

Hey, welcome to the show. I’m Yosi Goslin, NBA salary cap analyst, and this is team 22 of 30 of my offseason preview. This time, we’re going to be discussing the Orlando Magic. Make sure you guys are following me on Twitter and Blue Sky. Best time of year to follow me. I’m going to be reacting to all sorts of uh transactions as they happen. Uh make sure you’re subscribed to me on YouTube, Spotify, and Apple so you can watch all my previous stuff, get alerts whenever I got more content coming out, and subscribe to Third Apron, my newsletter. At some point, I will probably go deeper into the salary cap minutia of what the Magic might have planned this off season. So, joining me to discuss today, he is one of the best guys covering the Magic. You can see him cover the Magic consistently on the Orlando Sentinel. Jason Bey. Jason, thanks for joining. And how’s it going? Things are going well. I’m uh happy to be here and uh so far so good off season. Been watching the playoffs. It’s been it’s been exciting. It’s been really fun to watch the playoffs this year. I feel like there’s been some really good battles. So, uh things are going well. Yeah, absolutely. this definitely this season, this playoff hard to I I don’t think I’ve been this excited for the playoffs since the bubble. And part of that is just the the the pent up energy from not being able to do much at all in life during that time, but also I think that was just some really good highle quality basketball at the same time. So just like a good combination. Um so yeah, Orlando Magic off seasonason. So, they’re they’re no longer rebuilding. Uh they’ve been somewhere in between a rebuild and competitiveness now for the past two seasons now. Probably the most efficient rebuild I’ve seen in the past few years where like everything they did kind of just stemmed from one trade. Like just that Vousvich trade and the 2021 trade deadline really like that got them uh a lot of assets. uh got him the pick for W for Vagner and then they ended up being able to be low enough in the standings to get Jaylen Suggs in the draft and and fortunate enough to win the lottery the next year. So like very just like efficient like they they just picked the right exact time to to move to make those to enter that rebuild and pretty quick turnaround considering this was just four years ago. So you know last year won six fewer games than the previous season. Most of it chocked up due to injuries. Uh mainly Jaylen Suggs. They really started to tail off once he got hurt. Still though remained pretty like their net really their net rating only fell a little bit. They still remained the top tier defense and their opponent slipped a bit. They kind of got to like the bottom bottom tier. Um, but at the same time, you know, you could when you watch this team, you could still tell that even when they’re all healthy, they could still use some more offensive firepower, like another some more shooting, another shot creator, another play creator. Um, and there’s going to be some like an interesting tug and pull for how the Magic do that while trying to retain their defensive identity, but it feels like they’ve kind of maxed out on internal improvement other than like their their top guys reaching additional levels. Uh, but I think they’re going to need to get some scoring elsewhere. I’m not sure they’re going to really get that from their guys internally. Um and uh management Wellman went on record even saying, “Yeah, that’s something we need to address this off season.” Uh but this is a team that has been like mostly like one of the more inactive ones when it comes to like free agency in the trade market mostly because they’ve and rightly so been counting on focusing on the draft, getting their guys, developing them, and it’s paid off. Uh, so I mean, so, so I guess I I’m not like skeptical, I guess, because like, you know, it’s like, yeah, they said they’re going to address it. Um, but like at the same time, I’m looking at their history, so you know, how aggressive they’ll be, I don’t know. I mean, so what do you think? Like, do you think the changes are coming and like what do you have an idea like what to what degree uh they might address them? Yeah, you I think I think it’s it’s fair to be, you know, a little questionable of it based on history. I mean, look, they haven’t, you know, they haven’t made a trade the past two deadlines. Um, and they said all the right stuff. Like Jeff Waltman said all the right things. Jamal Mosley backed that up. Palane Carroll backed that up. All the, you know, the key guys said the right things. And to your point, it’s just a matter of, you know, what do they feel like they need to do without diminishing too far their defensive identity. I mean, they know they have to give up some defense to get some offense. Their offensive rating was bottom five. Their scoring was bottom five. I mean, offense was hard to come by. Um, like really challenging sometimes. And you know, to your point, you know, Jaylen Suggs, Paulo Bancer, and France Vagner only played six games together this season, and they still won 41 games. So, it’s it feels as though, you know, they they’ve stuck with roster continuity for the most part the past couple of years, and it’s been a key strength, right? They haven’t had to figure things out too much. Um, and when they did have guys go down with injury, um, you know, there were some rough patches obviously, but because they knew everybody there, you know, there wasn’t a whole lot to figure out terms of roster, uh, roster spots and whatnot, they were able to stay afloat. And then once Powell and France came back, you know, Jaylen only played like one game after January 5th or something like that. Um, you know, Jaylen didn’t return. They lost Mo Vagner in the middle of the season, but once Powell and France returned, they made the playoffs. They won the playing game. Um, they were the seven seed, they lost to Boston, obviously. Um, but it feels as though like they’re they’re really close to being really dangerous because, you know, I I wrote so many different times in so many different ways. You know, the Magic, you know, don’t even need to shoot league average from three, just just a little bit better. Um, you know, it was it would be it was pretty remarkable to see how well they’d win, how well they do and and find just enough points to score and and find success. And if they did shoot league average, um, you know, I’m not talking above league average. I’m literally just talking league average from three. They had a really good record. I don’t have that in front of me, but I’ve written it a number of different ways. um talking about just if they just get a little bit more offense um you know this team can be really dangerous because you mentioned it internal development I don’t think people realize how young Pablo France and Jaylen are now they’re getting expensive in the near future I’m sure we’ll dive into that um you know Ben was up for rookie extension this summer Fran got his and Jaylen got his as well um but they’re still really young they’re still multiple years away from being in their own respective primes and that doesn’t mean you just wait for that to happen. Obviously, you want to take advantage of their contracts. As I said before, they’re getting a bit more expensive, but um yeah, it seems as though like they’re saying all the right things. Now, it’s just a matter of what in their minds do they view as, you know, how far do they need to go? How far do they need to take it? Um and and what are they willing to part with? Because they have a ton of draft they have a ton of draft capital. uh they have movable contracts, they have young prospects, they have young players. Um so all the pieces are there and that’s you know part of it is Jeff Waltman didn’t make a move the past two years. You know if when they when they signed um multiple guys to extensions last summer um not just Fron and Jaylen but you know Gogo Bataz they got a new contract Mo Vagner u they brought back Gary Harris um they renegotiated and extended Jonathan Isaac. They gave Wendell Carter an extension like what they did last offseason really set up this offseason where now you have 11 guys under contract and four more with tra uh team options. So, you know, hypothetically you have all 15 under contract. They’re not going to bring back all 15 because they’d be a second second apron team with the money. But um you know because they’ve waited their time, because they’ve relied on continuity, because they’ve relied on internal development, they’re now in this really good position, you know, of making a move. It’s just a matter of making the right move because the wrong move is can be damaging as we’ve seen not just with this, you know, other teams, but this team specifically. You know, you go back years uh to the previous regime and whatnot and where things really fell south. So, um, you know, knowing Jeff Waltman, he’s he’s not going to, you know, go too crazy, right? But at the same time, they they they they know and they’ve admitted they need offensive improvement badly and and they talked about that quite a bit on the record, which I think is is, you know, the fact that they’re able to show their flaws and talk about openly and say this is the time and now they’re ready to view this team and this this stage of their building. I wouldn’t call it rebuilding, just continuing building their roster. they’re going to view it in a win now lens and whatever that means is up to them but um it would be like I would expect a move or two potentially just based on what they said that’s not you know insider information just based on what they said um you know they’re ready to make a move and now just to see what it is. So we’ll touch on the finances a little later because yes as the roster gets more expensive that is going to influence who they might go after. Uh, but I do want to just touch on that point about making the right move because I, you know, we we saw them pursue Contavius Caldwell Pope, which in theory I I like I like the theory of it where you already have France, you already have Powell, you already have Suggs, you’re one, two, and three options. So KCP proved that he can be an excellent fourth or fifth option. And when he’s hitting threes at a high rate, okay, that’s like and he defends, he always defends at a pretty good level. that’s he fits the kind of archetype that the Magic would want in the team. And um but I so I but now that they have this, you know, they’re looking to improve the offense, I’m not sure that just going after like a guard or a wing that like is that is a good score that can create shots that it that that would be quite enough because of the shot hierarchy. If you’re still gonna have Paulo and Fron and Suggs take the take the most shots and out of those guys, you know, Suggs has been the better the best shooter of the bunch. Um, then when does this guy how often does he get to score? Um, you know, how is he how are how much are you really going to boost the offense? I’m actually more concerned about that more so than them losing a step a couple steps on defense because I think no matter what they’re going to probably be like a pretty well above average team, but I I feel pretty confident they should still be like a top tierish defense, maybe at worst 5 to 10 range. So that’s where I as I look at this roster like we can get into the guys that could pursue, but I don’t know if that’ll be enough just bringing in that guy who can score. They may need to do something a little more uh they might have to do a little more. Um and as I look maybe uh what if they want to do something with uh big men? Maybe they want to get like a significant upgrade there. I’ve got a couple ideas what that could look like. But if you can bring in like a legitimate stretch option who can shoot there as well. Okay. Now you’re really I think uh revamping your system in a way that can really boost their offense. So I think we’ll I have a I have a bunch of names. We’ll go through and we kind of we can just kind of decide how we feel about like their fit and if it’s even worth what it would take to go after these guys. Um, but like in what do you think of that theory I just laid out where I think it’s going to be a little more I think it’s it’s going to be a little more required than just like getting some scores. Yeah, it’s it’s interesting you mentioned the KCP signing. I think when they brought him in, it was interesting to me because you know he’s not a point guard obviously and when they had Markeel Folultz on the roster he was your starting point guard next to Jaylen Suggs. So when they didn’t bring back Markeel for a number of reasons and and you know there’s still some fans that and I’m not saying that Markel is a great person but he just didn’t work for them anymore. Um but when they moved on from that and made Jaylen Suggs their starting point guard and brought in Contavius Cwell Pope and you know obviously Jaylen only played 35 games but even those first five games of the season it was interesting because that’s such a small sample size. Um, I’m just not sure if Jaylen is your point guard of the future just because of the way he plays. And, you know, he said it himself at exit interviews, he’s not going to change the way he plays, which for better or worse, that’s the Jaylen Slugs experience. That’s why he’s, you know, an alldefensive type player. Um, and what he was able to prove the year before was when he is on the court, he is one of the better defenders in the league. um earning that second team all defensive when he played 75 games, but he went from 75 games to 35 games and you talk about expensive players. Um you know, he’s got to be available and he knows that obviously, but he’s not going to change. He says he’s not going to change the way he plays. So, if you’re going to bring in a guard and Jaylen Suggs in your mind, I’m saying from the team’s perspective as your point guard, well, that means conte to be willing to come off the bench or be moved himself. Um, obviously the second half wouldn’t be up to him. It would be up to the team. But, um, you know, to trade your big offseason acquisition would be, you know, I’m not saying it would be fatal, but that’s just a, you know, you you want to sign free agents to bring more free agents in the future to show that you can take care of big names like a KCP who’s won championships. Like, he chose the Orlando Magic because he sees something in them the way he saw something in the Lakers uh, and the Nuggets as well to help them win titles. So, um, you know, with with with Kenny, it’s one of those things where he was, you know, above 39% 40% of the last three straight years in a row. Then he comes to the Magic and shoots 34%. Um, he just had a really challenging year and a lot of that had to do with who was on the court next to him, finding his shots. Um, you know, like I said, you know, Powell played the first five games, then he was out two plus months, and then France Vagner goes down, and then Jaylen Suggs was in, not to mention, you know, Mo Vagner, Wendell Carter missed mo most of November. So, there were a lot of moving pieces. I don’t really know if we know what Contavius Calwell Pope looks like with Jaylen, France, Paulo, and Wendell Carter in that starting five. And I understand there are some fans that go, “Well, we do. It’s not really good.” Um, and I get that, but you know, you talk about internal development. I you know obviously Kenny is a veteran player and and he is who he is at this point in his career. Uh but he had a down year and and he needs to figure out his shooting. He he said that himself. So um you know in terms of what they need to actually add um I’m not sure if if if Jayen Suggs the way he plays um is is your point guard of the future. And if he is, you know, Contavius Calwell Pope, if he’s going to be on the roster, has to be comfortable moving back to the bench, which maybe he is. I don’t know. Um, we didn’t ask him that, but uh maybe at some point we will depending on what they do with this roster. But you’re right. No, it is intriguing because obviously you’re, you know, Powell and FS are your are your two versatile wings that can do a little bit of everything. And they have Wendell Carter, they have Gogatas, they they they are going to get back Mo Vagner coming off the bench. So they have all these centers that do a little bit of everything but not all of it, right? They have um different pieces of the big. So, you know, I think I’ve talked with other people on the Magic Beat like if we feel that the big problem being bigs um is more of a future thing and right now they need, you know, they they need a point guard, they need shooting and how they’re going to fit into that will be interesting because right now you do have Jaylen Suggs and Contavius Cwell Pope and um you know, Kenny said it himself, he needs to shoot better and Jaylen needs to get healthy again. So, you’re right about the the KCP thing where yeah, they brought him in as it’s one of their biggest free agent signings. I mean, they haven’t really been in a situation to have major cap space recently. So, on one hand, yeah, it wouldn’t be the greatest look to future free agents if they just moved on from now. But at the same time, they’re probably not going to have cap space anytime soon now, uh, now that they’re paying all these guys. But, uh, thankfully, like there, even though the payroll is adding up, there are ways then they could keep him and have him come off the bench if needed. Uh, I mean, it’s only a two-year deal. It’s it’s definitely higher. They definitely overpaid him a little bit to get him to steal him from the Nuggets, but in the short run, they could make it work. If they need to bring him off the bench, that’s not a big deal. And honestly, that’s just he’s a that’s a terrific player to have come off your bench right now, right? No, that’s not a bad thing. Like I think that would still be an upgrade from your other bench guard options. You know, if you can bring Casey P off the bench instead of Gary Harris at this point in their careers, I think most people are going to be taking Contavius Cwell Pope, right? So, let’s kind of get into the finances a little bit because I’m going to explain just kind of quickly why I don’t see them going after a very expensive player, even like a max level guy. Uh so, first Paulo, yeah, he’s extension eligible this this off seasonason. He’s gonna get a max. Right. Right. Right. No, he he obviously obviously he is that’s that’s super easy. That’ll be the first thing that gets reported on that date. Yeah. I don’t think we really need to delve too much more into that. The only main thing is maybe they’ll probably give him the provisions where if he gets on he can get a higher max up to the 30% max. I guess the biggest question is are they going to make it like oh if you’re third team then you get the 30% or maybe they want to put escalators in there. Uh so like third team 27, second team 28, something like that, right? We’ll we’ll see about that. But either way, he’s going to be on a max. Then uh the other big thing that they’re going to they have to address is that they have a very high payroll at the moment. That’s like right up against the second apron. That’s not really as concerning as it might appear because if they’ll probably look to see what they could do in the trade market, but uh at the very least all they really need to do is decline the team options of a couple guys if they were to Yeah. They’re not going to be a second a team. Let’s be clear about that. Yeah. So, if they decline Mo Vagner his 11 million a team option, which I think they will because of his injury, Gary Harris 7.5 million, I think they’ll do that as well. And then Corey Joseph, he’s got a team option which I think they’ll probably decline and then they could bring him back on a just one-year minimum which would pay him actually more money and but the Magic spend less uh due to the due to the the one-year minimum veteran minimum rule. Uh so then you’re you’re right under the tax now which I would expect the Magic are probably not going to exceed. So after that now you finally like are in a nice level. I would assume they’re going to bring back Mo on something like just a little cheaper. So, whatever trades they’re doing, they’re probably going to try to take back equal salary or below. So, with Paulo still making just 15 million on the last year of his rookie deal, they could get crazy if they want if they want to get really aggressive, combine the salaries of like KCP and Isaac and Cole and go after a max guy, they could theoretically do that. I don’t think they will though and that’s mainly because they’re going to already have two Max guys plus Jaylen Suggs making a lot of money. Uh it’s a declining contract but in the short term it’s going to be very tough like like some names I’ve seen people speculate when they do their hypothetical trades are like Darren Fox the Mont Sabonis. A big one’s LaMelo Ball which actually LaMelo Ball I was going to say LaMelo is in all of them. I’m like that doesn’t make any sense. I well he actually makes a little more sense I think than the other two because his max is the lower is much lower tier than them. So if the Magic was willing if they are willing to get into the tax a little bit in the next few years which I I don’t think they’d be opposed to it as long as the team proves it’s going to be like a top tier contender. I don’t know if LaMelo does that. But I don’t think Yeah. So either way, they’re not making that move unless they’re willing to pay tax and they think that really puts them in that A1 uh contender tier. Even then though, I I I don’t see them I just have a hard time seeing them be that aggressive and trade like the dra the extra draft picks that it would be required to get one of those types of guys. probably probably might take like if because if they’re not trading their top three guys, you know, I don’t really I can’t really say like a lot of their guys on rookie deals have like considerably high trade value. So, you’re going to probably have to trade like a good amount of picks anyways. For what all we know, maybe the Magic want to still hold on to their young guys and see how they pan out. But I would be surprised if they’re willing to go like three or even like four picks into the future to bring in a guy like that and pay the premium that’s going to come with having such an expensive roster. Yeah, that that you know that even though Jeff Hman is saying they’re they know they have to swap instead of sign, right? they their free agency is not a you know they’re going to have some veteran minimum guys like you mentioned and and they’re going to you know all likelihood bring back Mo Vagner and Cory Joseph showed a lot of what he could do when he’s on the court and he’s not you know your starting point guard or even your backup but he’s a great spot starter and and he just started in the playoffs for them which is pretty remarkable when you consider it where he is in his career. Um, but I think you’re right in the sense of that, you know, even though they’ve said they going to make swaps, just because they’re going to say that all of a sudden doesn’t mean they’re going to, you know, just blow up everything they’ve been building towards. And I’m not saying they’re not going to make moves. Like they literally have said Jeffman has said they know they have to make moves. Now is the time. Now is the win now mode. Right. But like you said, they have Paulo Banko, they have France, they have Jayen Suggs. They’re not trying to add or change that right now. Um what they just need is a little bit more help. And and where they can do that is, you know, you mentioned Jonathan Isaacs, you mentioned uh Kavius Cwell Pope. Um they have some movable contracts. Wendell Carter, um Cole Anthony, um you know, you mentioned some of these contracts where, you know, they have two first round picks. That would be really surprising if they use both of them. I would expect them to use one of them just because I feel like um it is a it is a cost-saving way to add a roster a roster player who’s a controlled number at a low number with either 16 or 25. Um and you can get help through the draft. Maybe we’ll dive into that later, but um there’s help in the draft for them for sure to help some of that. Um, but yeah, no, there there’s there’s definitely some ways they can get help without having to get a really expensive guy because, you know, you look at what the Boston Celtics are about to go through. You know, there there’s you can’t have three you’re not going to have three Max players unless you winning championships and and then I don’t just don’t see them, you know, being so conservative in the trading market all of a sudden blowing up all their assets, all their young guys, all their movable contracts just for one guy. um even if that might bring you a championship or put you in legitimate contention um you know just the way they’ve moved in the past based on history that seems pretty unlikely. Um you know just based on that alone but um they know they need to make some moves and and there’s other like they don’t need a max guy. There’s other guys that can um at a lower price point that can really help this team thrive because you already have you’ve done your difficult part. um you’ve gotten Pa Banker, you’ve gotten Franbar and you’ve got Jaylen Suggs and it’s just a matter of putting the right pieces around those and um you know you have your star players who just now finding the right role players to put around them to have success. Yes. And to those viewing if you’re concerned that the Magic are just going to try to completely run it back again like they can’t completely run it back uh just because of the roster issues where I’m looking at it right now. If they do those cuts I mentioned, they decline Vagner, Cory Joseph, Gary Harris, but they end up bringing wanting to bring back Corey Joseph and uh Mo Vagner, they’re going to be at 16 players. They’re going to have to consolidate a little bit. Even if it’s not for like a like a a high-end starter or something like that, like they have two draft picks. I would have imagined they’re going to try to move up in the draft. Maybe what can they how can they package 25 and 16? Could you move up like three, four spots potentially? Uh they also have like I think four second round picks. So that can help as well. They’re they’re going to have to trim some of those. So they’re going to have to they’re going to have to uh combine some salaries and just like lower their their total, you know, this total available players they have right now. And you know, the rotation players, like a lot of rotation players. though. Let’s get to the fun part because I this one I feel like there’s a lot of guys where the Magic they’re in the market for a, you know, like a scoring. It could be like a a scorer who could be a guard, a combo guard, a point guard, a wing. Not a lot of teams are in the market for that. And there’s so many players like this. It’s like one of the more saturated player types in the league that it’s gonna be I think the Magic are gonna have a lot of options and they should be able to get someone they like and pretty inexpensively. Um so I’ll throw you a couple names and just kind of tell me how you what you think of the fit if that’s something you a guy you would like to to see. I’ll start just with an obvious one. He’s been in rumors recently. Anthony Simons who seems like the most hurry up and kiss already rumor out there. It seems like seems like that’s that might happen. That’s been a rumored for like a couple years now. Salar is not too high makes a like a little bit more than what uh Contavio Caldwell Pope makes right now. So maybe you can replace his slot there or you can consolidate a couple guys like Isaac and Coanthony to get there. Um I would and like a lot of these guys probably I would imagine going to cost like a first round pick maybe two. Uh but uh you know he shot 36% from three, eight and a half attempts. Where do you where do you stand on the Simons rumors? Yeah, I think he’s the fan favorite among the rumors I guess. Um I wonder how much of that has to do with him being from Orlando. Like if he wasn’t, let’s say he was from Kansas or something like that. Like would there be as much connection? I feel like I feel like he’s the name where obviously he Let’s be clear from a basketball perspective. Yes. Yes. Obviously he would help. Yeah. like there’s no question about that. But um I think he’s like the most obvious rumor where like you know people are just connecting the dots. Well, he’s from Orlando and and they that’s what they need. And I I just think I wonder though like if that’s what they need and he’s from Orlando and there’s a lot of connections and he came to a playoff game and and he, you know, was in the stands and people saw him. I I just think because he’s out there already, I just feel like they would have already had him already if if if they really wanted him. I’m not saying like again team people have to remember that like it takes two to tango obviously like they can’t you know this isn’t 2K teams have to agree to deals um you know they can’t just make trades happen on their own, right? So um maybe what Portland’s asking for is is in Orlando’s eyes too much. Um because you know otherwise they would have had him already. Um I think the contract I think he’s a lot of I think he’s quite a bit of money. Um you know obviously not not max or anything like that but um that’s a heavy contract and then you have to resign him in a couple years to a lot more money. So I’m not sure contractually if that makes the most sense. Um, there might be other options out there um that you might that you might bring up, but I think for sure Simons is like, you know, you ask any Magic player, who should the if you were to pull 100 fans, probably 80 of them would say Anthony Simons is makes the most sense. And he does. I think I think yes, he would, you know, bring bring exactly what they want, offense and shooting. And, you know, defensively, we we’ve already said they’re willing to give up some defense to get some offense. and they need that at this point because their offense is bottom five in all the key categories. So, um yeah, it would be it would be a lot of fun to bring him in. Um I don’t think you need to give up too much in the trade. I just worry about from a contract standpoint in the future. Um you know, how much how much he’s worth now and what he could be worth in the future. Um for sure. So, that’s a really good point you mentioned. He’s on the last year of his deal. I think his salary right now is going to be so his salary right now is at 27. So, two things. One, he’s going to be extension eligible. What is that number going to come up to? Cuz his max extension can take him into like the 30s. It’ll get pretty high. That’s a lot of money. I mean, that’s a lot of money when you already have, you know, Paulo and Fran on Max and Jaylen’s getting a lot of money and and and you know, those three in 26 27 are going to be making total 120 plus million dollars. So, you add another guy making a lot more. I mean, that’s four guys and you’re looking at $160 million. So, in the long run, I’m just saying I’m not saying like, let’s be clear from a basketball standpoint. Yes, that’d be awesome, but I’m not sure for the contract what that would entail. So, that’s the one thing. Now, you also mentioned, you know, what would Portland want? My feeling, and I did the Blazers on Friday. I talked about them. I get the feeling that the Blazers aren’t really interested in draft picks or like like some of the young like some young players. I think they want like what they’re going to try to do this summer is consolidate themselves also for like a guy who can potentially be their number one guy. Uh so if if there is a Simons trade to Orlando one, it would probably be a multiple team trade where the Blazers are getting something else uh for Simons and you know maybe Aiden has a bigger salary if needed and and some picks. But then two, I think the Magic and Simons are going to have to figure out what that contract’s going to be because I don’t think the Magic going to be I I don’t think right now they would be interested in giving him his max contract. I don’t I don’t have what that figure is, but it’s gonna have to be something that they feel fits on their cap sheet in the future. So, if they can get all those all those, you know, crossed off, okay, then there could be something that makes sense. So, you know, I think it’s definitely still worth keeping an eye on. We’ll see how that plays out. Uh, another guy who’s like starter end uh guard, like combo guard, I and I I like him a and I like him more than Anthony Simons would be Kobe White. Uh, I don’t think the Bulls are gonna It’s probably gonna take a lot for the Bulls to trade him right now, especially since he’s making just like $12 million, something like that. Um, but, you know, you can bringing him bring him in easily now. But then, same kind of question. He’s probably going to be looking to make more money than Anthony Simons, right? Uh, how does that fit? But just like another guy I I feel like out of everyone I’m me I’m gonna mention as far as a guard I feel like that’s kind of like the perfect uh I think Kobe White guys yeah I think Kobe White for me is the top top one just because I think defensively um a little bit more there a little bit you know I think it fits the identity of the Magic. Um I think he’d be he’d be a really great fit. Yeah, absolutely. And but it just goes back to that point about the contract in the future and Yeah. Yeah. Um but again, you you have to spend money. You have to give something to get something, right? So, um you know, what does Chicago want potentially if he’s even available? Um you know, that that that’s the tricky part. But yeah, I think Kobe White would be a really good fit. Yeah. Um and and probably also Oh, sorry. Probably also would be like would really fit the identity. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 6’5 like a lot like I I I was surprised to only learn this theory was 65. I thought he was for whatever reason was smaller than that. So, actually could Yeah, I think he could fit the archetype. Probably also would be a multi-team thing. I think like the Bulls are also not really they never really traded for draft picks. I think they’d want like a guy to replace him. Uh there’s a couple comments about it about this just quickly. So, someone’s asking about Hero. Two guys are asking about Tyler Hero. I would be surprised if the Heat move him. I feel like they overvalue the their guys quite a bit and um yeah, I don’t unless they’re getting like it’s like a bigger trade and they’re getting Giannis back or just some other superstar, I just have a hard time seeing hero be available. Uh someone touched on the Kobe White extension. Yeah, so his contract is so low that he it’s probably not viable for an extension. It the max would be like 4 for87. So, more likely if the Bulls or if the Magic acquire him, he’ll probably hit free a unrestricted free agency first and then you know you guys then whoever has him has to deal with it from there. Um, and then the last of like these starter types, this one I don’t know if you’re going to expect I don’t know if you’ve ever even considered it. This one I’ve never heard anyone consider the possibility of the Magic going after this guy. What would you think about Jaylen Green? You’re right. I haven’t heard that name. I was I thought you were gonna say Derek White. Um, that’s interesting. I mean, you know, the Magic would totally go after Derek White. I I thought you were going to say Derek White because that was that is a name I’ve only seen recently among, you know, uh, fake trade proposals online that not many people have brought up. Everything I think Jaylen Green is an intriguing name. Um, you know, I’m not I’m not privy to his, like you said, it’s a name I haven’t thought much about. Um, but that would be interesting for sure. I if uh you know, the Rockets do end up making some big trade. Just a guy I I don’t know. I I kind of I think that’s kind of intriguing. I probably would prefer some of these other guys, even Derek White like you mentioned. Uh both guys though making already like low30s. So that is an issue but just like an interesting fit. Now I would guess if they out of any of these guys it’d probably be like Simons if they can get him on like a team friendly deal. And then after that you kind of look you start to look at more like stop gap guys like a little bit older but they’re on cost control deals right? Uh, and potentially the Magic can like if they wanted to, they can get one of these guys we mentioned and an additional guy I’m about to mention, which who might be, you know, you could probably have him come off the bench if needed. So like Malik Monk, for example, I think that’s a guy that we should keep an eye on just because the Kings need a point guard. I would imagine they’ll get it done through trading to Rosen, but if Monk is available, uh, you know, that’s a guy the Magic can to he can they can get without really giving up too much. Um, I’ll just kind of go through him quickly. Devin Vel a little better than that. Probably closer to the first tier of guys, but if the Spurs end up trading him to get Giannis or someone, maybe the Magic can get involved, bring him in. I’d really like I kind of really like that. Uh there if he was younger and less expensive, CJ McConnell. No, C.J. McCollum would be pretty nice off the bench. Yeah, TJ McConnell, too. TJ McConnell would also be really nice off the bench. I just I just remembered that PJ McCollum or CJ McColl McConnell meme from last year. But yeah, I think McCollum, he would have been a nice guy off the bench if he wasn’t making quite as much. Uh Norman Powell is the last guy. Yeah, Norman Powell. He’s extension eligible. Uh what if he and the Clippers can’t agree to something? Another guy the Magic could bring in. He could start or come off the bench. So I there just there just so many guys that the whole point is there’s like so many options. They’re going to get someone maybe even to Oh, last one. Benedict Matan. Uh you know, I I get the feeling that might that his time might be coming up in Indiana. Could be a pretty nice bo option for the Magic. Um, so yeah, I mean I think I don’t know like where do you settle? Do you think they’ll they’ll just kind of get one of these guys or is it possible they get a little more aggressive and maybe have like multiple of these types? Yeah, I think it’s probably just going to be one. Um, and I think, you know, probably some of the earlier names that we mentioned more likely in my opinion. Um, I’m not sure exactly where they how, you know, what they view their draft capital, what they’re willing to give up with. Um, I, like I said earlier, I think they’ll they’ll use at least one of their draft picks. That just seems like something that would make logical sense from how they value their rookies and and and you know, kind of viewing their roster on two paths, uh, development and winning, which I think can go hand in hand. Um, but they need to do something and I think there’s they have enough pieces to go for a Kobe White, to go for an Anthony Simons. Um, you know, maybe you maybe it sets you up for a different future, but um, they’re not going to, you know, you mentioned the rotational players and whatnot. Um, you know, that it’s time for them to make a move and I would expect something, you know, where they maybe they do get multiple players. Um, you know, but at a certain point they’re also going to have to have, you know, they have to bring back guys on the roster that are that are, you know, after if they do go after a Simons or or Kobe White, you know, that’s where the guys like Cory Joseph come back on a real cheap deal or or Mo takes a little bit less. And um, you know, it would be it would be interesting to see um, who gets moved, how many draft picks. Um, but yeah, I think Anthony Simons or Kobe White, like those like Kobe White to me is is like the perfect one. Um, that just makes the most sense to me just just given what they like, given who they like. Um, you know, Tyler Herro, you mentioned before, someone asked about that. Like again, there’s so many like I don’t think unless you’re a Magic fan and you watch the Magic, like there’s so many guys that would help because the offense is really hard to come by right now. And the fact that Cory Joseph helped the offense towards the end of the season says so much about where that offense is. Um, and that’s nothing against Cory Joseph. Like, let me be clear about that. But I’m just saying the fact that someone as someone of his age can help just as much. Um, yeah, I think it’s it’s intriguing. There’s a lot of options for sure. Like you said, I mean, you can go on and on about all the different options. Um, but I really think it’s it’s it’s probably one one proven shooter, one one shooting guard. um you know, point guardish that could that could start that they need to to help Powell and France and Jaylen. I and the reason I think Corey Joseph’s end up starting because he’s their most traditional point guard out of all the other point guards they had left. Uh so another thing they could do is also just maybe if they don’t bring him back. I would guess they bring him back. But if you’re going to get one of those one of these guards I mentioned who could do some secondary playmaking, you know, make up like the point guard in in combination with Suggs and then you you don’t get like another backup guard like let’s say you could what what if you could get one of the Jones brothers, you know, that would be like a pretty nice uh backup, but I don’t know. U maybe they’ll just end up getting Cory Joseph back on the minimum and then you have you can make enough of a point guard rotation there. But what I what I’m curious is, you know, they’ll probably trade for one of these guards, but let’s say, yeah, they do get like a Kobe White, for example, only cost him like one future pick, like not this year’s picks, like a future one. And then you can bring in another guy like a Monk or uh or like a Norman Powell and it just cost you like one of this year’s picks. Like if the cost gets that low, I think it’s it’s definitely worth exploring. The main thing though is then you’re kind of giving up on a lot of your your bench guys. You’re because then that’s that’s kind of it for Jed Howard, Caleb Houston. Uh to an extent Cole Anthony. Um like if you’re doing that then then you’re really like that you’re kind of like ending it with the bench. So uh you’re what I’m so I don’t know how much more they believe in some of these guys uh coming off the bench. That’s what I’m most curious to see cuz maybe they just get really aggressive and just get like multiple scores and just go go with that and and that’s kind of the end of their like the the last remnants of the rebuild, so to speak. Yeah, it’s it’s definitely possible. I mean, I think I think you do need to bring in multiple rotational players. Um, you know, I’m not talking you’re blowing up the roster, right? They don’t need to do that. But, um, you mentioned some of those names there, three guys that, you know, if they do what they want to do, if they if they go after some of the players we mentioned, you know, those guys are going to be part of those deals. Um, you know, because a guy like Jed Howard, you know, I’m not really sure if he fits into Orlando’s future. And and, you know, maybe really a fresh start somewhere else would really help him. Um, you know, Cole Anthony was huge this year. At the same time, he was inconsistent and had his issues and and fell out of the rotation at one point. Um, and Caleb Houston had a great month, but it wasn’t a great year. It was it was, you know, he had he was streaky. And, you know, the right team, the right fit, the right, you know, maybe it’s a new look for some of those guys. Um, you know, they’re serviceable for sure. I mean, Cole Anthony is a fantastic backup point guard. He’s accepted that role. He won multiple games for the Magic, but he wasn’t playable in the playoffs. And Caleb Houston had a great stretch of the final end of the year and you could argue he could become eventually what they need, but they need it now. Not eventually. Like there’s no more eventually eventually eventually. Um they need help now. And and I think that’s kind of what they learned, you know, when guys went down, who can they really rely on? And you know, it’s the fact that Gary Harris was able to come back in the rotation says so much about the other rest of the bench and their young pieces. Um, so yeah, there there’s there’s enough capital, enough pieces to make multiple moves to not just get a starter, but to get a rotational guard as well. Um, and then then also add through the draft. I think the draft is an opportunity where again, you talk about saving money and and cost control in the future. It’s huge that they have two first round picks and they have an intriguing pick swap in 26 um that’s between Washington and Phoenix and Orlando as well that I think is really really intriguing and a little complicated but um there is not enough talk about this. Yeah, I don’t think there is. I I’m not sure. I think I think maybe the viewers of this podcast understand that stuff, but the average fan might not realize how valuable that 2026 pick swap can be. uh when you really think about where the Wizards are and where the Phoenix Suns could be. So I I love talking about it. I’m gonna just bring it up real quickly because um imagine the standings played out this year. So the ma the Magic have a swap with the Suns. Now the Suns also traded it to like the Wizards, but the Wizards are probably going to be worse than the Suns next year. So you can forget about that conveying. And then but then also the Grizzlies have a swap with the with the Suns. But it’s but the Magic have the priority. So Magic had the 16th pick and the Suns finished with 10th. So basically that would be the swap right there. The Magic would move up to the top 10 and the Suns would drop to uh 16th and then let’s say the Grizzlies next year are like I don’t know mid20s. Now they got to swap with the Suns again. Uh the Suns just go from like you know a lottery pick all the way down there. So, the Magic have a very very interesting uh uh draft pick. Just one specific draft pick in next year’s pick. A lot of variability there where that might end up, but like if you’re like most teams, a lot of them are are bearish on the Suns. That pick alone can get the Magic quite a lot. So, at the same time though, maybe they want to hold on to it, see how high it could go. Do you want to gamble on if Especially in a 26 draft that’s loaded? Yeah, like like on the other hand, maybe it’s worth holding on to it and seeing if it could potentially go up to the top four because if you’re if the Suns are going to outright miss the playoffs, uh that’s where the ma the Washington stuff would kind of interfere with it being like potentially first or second. But like, you know, if you’re talking about the if if you want to there there’s a there’s a case for the Magic taking the risk, holding on to it and seeing if it jumps into like the top six or or top five. Uh especially because I mentioned earlier, I just don’t really expect them to go after like a max player or anything like that. Uh that might make trading that pick worth it. Uh and like based on these names we have mentioned that we see are realistic, might not be totally worth trading that pick for. I don’t know. I just I think that swap’s so fascinating. Yeah, it absolutely is. I mean, I think it was such a uh when it was done, it wasn’t a big deal at all really. Um, and I don’t think a lot of, you know, the average fan, I’m not saying the dedicated fans, but the average fan, you know, doesn’t pay attention to that type of thing. So, it is really intriguing. I think they have the capital. Um, you know, in the new CBA, you talk about secondaround picks being so valuable. They have a lot of second round picks in the future. Some of those also swaps as well with different teams. Um, so yeah, I think the fact that they have four picks this year, two firsts and two seconds, um, plus movable contracts plus young guys, it’s it’s it should be a really fun offseason. Uh, last thing really quickly, I touched on big men last year. It seemed like they were I don’t know how aggressive they were in going after Isaiah Hardenstein, but I when I found out that might have been a possibility, I just I really loved it. and especially seeing how he panned out for the Thunder. I think he would have been an amazing addition as the Magic starting center just would have fit everything like just like that’s exactly who they would probably want to be like their ideal center. Uh there’s a lot of big men that could be available, not quite as good fits like you know Jared Allen’s a guy whose name could be out there with the if the Cavs want to save some money. Uh Claxton could be available. Um, one other guy that Magic fans will probably be like, “Oh, no.” Based on how the playoffs went, Kristoffs Porzingis just kind of like some overlaps with Hardenstein where I am sure because the Magic just went at him relentlessly in that Celtics matchup. They’re probably thinking, “No, no thanks.” But he is, he’ll probably be available. Like I’m not saying they’re gonna trade him for sure, but like you know with their attack situation, he’s definitely one of the high bigger candidates for him to get moved. So uh you know if he’s healthy and moving well just like excellent excellent fit helping it would like just help. Well, I think I think you just pointed out why it wouldn’t and that’s the health and they have so many guys if healthy than this and and you know I I think when we talk about I think you’re right. I I think I think when you talk about this being a championship roster, um, you know, Wendell Carter is has has proven that he can be really good, but he’s bound to miss 20 plus games a year just because of whether it’s a foot or a knee or whatever it might be. He’s just hasn’t cons I mean, this year he played a lot of games, but um, he’s bound to miss time just because of his history. And you know, they they brought back Goa Bataz and maybe Go talked about the fact that he could have maybe gotten more money elsewhere. Um, and Mo Vagner was on track to be a candidate for sixman of the year until he tore his ACL and and he’s going to have to come back and earn earn a contract, you know, next season for the future. But he really likes Rena as well. And I think Wendell Carter fits just well enough where, you know, I wrote in his season recap, his three-point numbers have just consistently fallen. And I think a lot of it has to do with his body, his knees and his and his feet specifically, like his corner threes have just dropped, you know, from 40% to 30s to upper 20s now. And it’s and if he can get his shot back and rework his shot again, you talk about championship roster, I don’t know if he’s on your winning title team. Um, but I think right now what they want to do, it feels to me as though getting a true center, a championship roster for center, that’s probably like a move or two away, right? Like that’s down the line. That’s in the future. I don’t know if that’s this offseason type of move. Um, but they have him on an extension. Um, and they got Goataz for multiple years and and he’s spot starter and he has his flaws, but um, you know, they all do a little bit of everything. Like Mo is so huge. I think fans just look at Mo Vagnner as his energy guy and he’s much more than just an energy guy. And Gogo Betaz is kind of that rim runner, rim protection. Um, you know, he doesn’t shoot. He’s he he said he wants to shoot. He wants to work on his shooting. It’s just a mental thing. doesn’t take a lot of threes and and him, you know, when you have a guy on the court with paddle and fans and you’re trying to spread the floor, you know, Goku Batazi doesn’t really fit well compared to Wendo Carter who you can stick in the corner and even if he’s not shooting threes, he’s at least taking them. Um, but I think eventually down the line, center is a position where they need to upgrade. I don’t think right now though, you know, if Wendel Carter has comes back and has a great year and finds a three-point shooter again and and Mo Vagner can can prove he’s six-man candidate, like that’s that would be huge for them um from a contract standpoint in in terms of finding that center. But, um I think that’s like a like two or three things ahead. Um they just need they just need offensive help badly. Um and I think right now you have enough at center where the fact that they have three really serviceable centers, some teams only have one. um I think is is they’re in a well enough spot where you can have success in the playoffs with those three. Um but maybe maybe they maybe they have the right deal and maybe they could find something. But I think we talked about before is the priority this offseason at least. Yeah. No, you’ve convinced me. I think they’ll there is no rush on that. Especially because as I get through the type of center, I think they would be the ideal uh type for this team. uh like a Porzingis Hardenstein type. They’re they’re not really available out there. I don’t think Miles Turner is going to be available to them either. So, might as well just, you know, ride it out with their bigs. They’re they they’re getting enough from the combination of them. And yeah, maybe some guy like that could come up in the future. Uh there was one comment earlier by Mauricio Aguular asking Wendell Carter Junior’s on a good contract. I don’t think he’s really expendable. Uh, so the interesting thing about Wendell is he signed that extension. It’s gonna pay him like around 20 million on average, but with the way the cap’s going up. If they do end up making that significant upgrade down the line, they can keep him on that contract to be a backup to come off the bench, still play like 20 plus minutes a game. That would be like one of the better that that that would be like one of the best uh backup center options. So, just interesting how with Wendell, like you can and you can make a case with the other backup guys, but with Wendell particularly, if they do make uh get an upgrade at center, I see I do see a world where they can still coexist with Wendell. I don’t see why not. Yeah. No, I I I would agree with that. I think Wendell is has been around enough um you know, he’s he’s part of this identity of the team and and I think he knows he has to figure out his three-point shooting. He didn’t have a healthy offseason last year. he’s able to have a healthy summer this year. He doesn’t need surgery. Um, you know, last season he had the hand surgery that he told me before. Um, that it took longer than he expected and then he dealt with the knee and the foot again and kind of battle through that this year. I think if he can get healthy and find his three-point shot again, that would be huge because you’re right. You know, you look at the number and his contract extension that they gave him, um, you know, he he can be really important piece to this team down the line. Um, for sure. Well, Jason, I think that just about covered everything. You know, pretty speculative, but that’s, you know, they’re probably going to do something. We could only try to see who fits and what might make sense, but thank you for joining. I had a lot of fun talking about the Magic here. Uh, you got anything coming up we should be on the lookout for? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think u, you know, obviously as we get closer to the draft, um, going to be doing some draft preview content for sure. Um, you know, they’re magic keep things close to the vest. I think if you’re not aware of that, but um we’ll see what happens. But it’s it’s it should be a busy offseason. It should be a fun offseason. I think if you’re a Magic fan, you know, you you look at what they have and and how the fact that they won 41 games with what they just went through. Um you know, this team is really close to being really special. So, um but yeah, you can follow me at the real BD on Twitter and read all my work at Sentinel.com. Yeah, you make a great point. like the Magic they I I if I had to guess whatever they end up doing whoever they get will probably be someone we even touch on. Uh yeah, because they just keep things so close to the vest. Like that Vousvich trade like it didn’t even seem like he was close to getting traded and the Bulls weren’t even like on the radar at the I was surprising trades uh of the past five years in terms of like who went to where and to where. Uh so yeah. Yeah. No, I’m I’m excited to see what the magic end up doing. But yeah, like uh thanks for joining me. Make sure you guys are following him on Twitter and Blue Sky at the real bey. And you can check out all his work at the Orlando Sentinel. Make sure to follow me and subscribe uh to all my platforms at my name. You’ll see Gosslin. Uh subscribe to Third Apron. As I mentioned earlier, I’m going to be getting deeper into the salary cap stuff. So, I’ll talk about more about Paulo’s uh extension and just kind of like project how their expenses are going to look over the next few years uh in regards to tax and that type of stuff. And uh check the link of the in the description about sports business classroom. There’s still some spots available. I’m having a promotional code there for whoever wants to sign up. Uh yeah, still a couple spots left. So, anyone trying interested in breaking into the industry and you know, taking a chance on that, uh check the link in the description. I’ll see you guys later. I’ve got a video coming out tomorrow and then I’ll be streaming again on Thursday. I’ll see you all then.

Jason Beede of the Orlando Sentinel joins the show to discuss the Magic offseason.

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