Miami Heat offseason: Another DeMar DeRozan pursuit? | Five on the Floor

Miami Heat offseason: Another DeMar DeRozan pursuit? | Five on the Floor

Welcome to the latest episode of Five on the Floor on the Five Reason Sports Network. Thanks for joining us on your favorite podcast app on Apple, Apple Podcast, on Android, Spotify, or the Five Reasons YouTube channel. We’re recommending that people switch to Spotify at least for now. Stream us from there. It’s available on both platforms and Apple Podcast has been a little slow lately. So, there’s like Kyle Anderson of of uh podcast platforms of late. So, check it out. Not that Kyle Anderson can’t be effective, but anyway, download us on both. Actually, we prefer that. So, you do that. Go to the five reasons YouTube channel. Hit like, subscribe, turn the notifications on, all that good stuff. Also, go to the link here in the description. You’ll bypass the Apple Upcharge off the floor. Uh, it’s draft season. We got a draft channel on there. You want more content from Adele. We just put up another episode about all the guards are going back to school or a lot of them. 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Welcome to Five on the Floor, a daily insider show on the Miami Heat and the NBA featuring Ethan Skolnick, Greg Sander, Alex Toledo, Brady Hawk, and others from the Five Reason Sports Network. Also, make sure to subscribe to Off the Floor for the most heat [Music] anywhere. Hi, welcome back to Five on the Floor here. Today’s floor plan. I’m Ethan Skolley. You can follow methan Joling with Five Sports. I got Greg Sander. You can follow me at Greg Sander. Also, check out recent episodes that I’ve done with Adele. One coming up with Brady Hawk, another one with Alex. Uh we’re all over the map here. We’re covering what’s going on in the NBA Finals or heading towards the NBA Finals. As we speak here, the Knicks have made it a 3-2 series with the Pacers uh still leading. We’ll have an NBA Finals preview once there actually is an NBA finals to discuss. Also, check out the rest of the content on the channel. We will of course be covering the Panthers and oral and Oilers. Panthers and Oilers part two. Hopefully it doesn’t turn out like Heat Spurs part two in 2014. Uh Greg, today we’re going to talk about Demar De Rozan uh for the Have we done more Demar De Rozan or more Kevin Durant episodes over the years? Kevin Durant for sure. But we have done a few of these, right? I feel like definitely we definitely talked to Rosen last summer and there’s been um I don’t know conversations about what he could be in Miami and things like that and I know that there’s been interest um you know for quite some time but it’s never came to fruition. Uh so here we are again the rumor mill is churning and Demar De Rozan’s name came up. Actually though Ethan keep me honest. Is this one of those where the odds were and it’s through some book that Yeah. Bada one of those and then it was thrown out on hoops. We love our friends over at Dunk Central, but like they literally had who’s going to win the Jackson Hayes sweep stakes on there yesterday. Um and so yeah, so that’s basically like, you know, D Roza’s at a higher level than that, but I I I feel like this is where that’s emanated. And I know some of our friends in our podcast circle, they did an episode on him. And I just figured, look, let’s discuss it because it’s not completely crazy. I’ll just I’ll put it out there that this is one of those players they’ve had, you know, diance with for a long time, as with many others. There’s a really close relationship with Dwayne Wade. There’s a close relationship with Jimmy. So that we always talked about it in that context. I remember we had conversations like three, four years ago about whether he would take the minimum to come to Miami. If you think about how ridiculous that was with what he signed with in Chicago and then last summer, and by the way, D Rozan’s 35. He’s going to be 36 by the start of next season. Same as Jimmy for what it’s worth. Uh, and I I can tell this story now, and I’ve told it on Off the Floor, but they were involved in the D Rozan thing last summer, but not really the way a lot of fans think. So, right now, D Rozan is on Sacramento. Essentially, the Kings decided to put together the playin bulls for some reason. Uh, so they don’t have Hallebertton anymore. They don’t have Fox anymore. They have Sabonis. I guess he’s their Vousvich a little better uh than Vousvich in some ways. And they basically put together and and they went out again and now Sacramento’s kind of ruer list. They had three point guards if you include Fox, Calibbert, and DaVon Mitchell at one time. Now Davon Mitchell’s in restricted free agent still with the Heat at the moment and now they have no point guards. So anyway, that’s kind of where this is all at. He’s in Sacramento. He’s still a very good player, and we’ll discuss that, but I still think he’s not a fit, and we’ll discuss that, too. But last summer, they did inquire about D Rozan. They had $5.8 million to spend. They hadn’t signed Heywood Highmith yet. They had offered money to Caleb Martin. Um, Caleb’s agent committed what can only be termed as malpractice. Uh, basically, you know, the heat said, “This is what we can offer in this circumstance. Uh, don’t come back to us in 24 hours because we won’t have it anymore.” The agent came back in 24 hours, less than 24 hours. They didn’t have it anymore. Uh, Caleb ended up taking a, you know, a much much much lower less than half uh, deal in Philadelphia. and then he got traded for Grimes in Dallas and now he’s kind of ruerless and making half the money he would have made with Miami. Anyway, that’s that part of it. So, this all this was going on last summer. The Heat did have this $5.8 million vehicle to spend. It’s not an endless spending league. Okay, this is what they had to spend. And they did call the Bulls to see, you know, what was going on there and maybe they could work out some kind of a sign and trade or something like that. and the Bulls were not interested in any of the Heat’s contracts. So, that ended that conversation as far as D Rozan coming to Miami because unless D Rozan was to take 5.8 million, it wasn’t going to happen. Okay. But then there was a three-way deal that the Heat then inquired about getting involved in and there are a lot of these that they do this and essentially that deal was sending D Rozan to Sacramento on a contract that at the time I think three years 75 million roughly. And as part of that deal, initially Kevin Herurder, who’s no longer with Sacramento either, but he was going to be traded from Sacramento to San Antonio, and the Heat were then going to turn around and trade Duncan Robinson for uh Harrison Barnes, who was still on Sacramento. If they done that, they probably don’t resign Heismith, by the way. They probably go a different direction. Maybe they would have signed Taius Jones. I’m not sure, but they would have gone a different direction with that. At that time, Tyus Jones was still out there. I think Gary Trent had already gone to Milwaukee. But anyway, so I’m just telling I’m saying telling this because what happened was, and I talked to Harrison Barnes about this, by the way, when he was in Miami, he was koi about it, but he didn’t deny any of the Heat’s interest in him. What happened was the Spurs decided they didn’t want Herder, they wanted Barnes, and they wanted to keep Barnes. Um, and he he played a role for them last year. actually made a big shot which bounced Golden State down to the playin. Okay, so he had a role with with the Spurs and because of that there was no need for Sacramento at the time to trade for Duncan because they had held on to Herder at that time. So I’m I’m telling all this because Bobby Mars and others Bobby I respect and others talked about how the Heat uh Greg you know were trying to get into for D Rozan in that trade. They weren’t not that part of it. They were there was a smaller deal that they were going to make. doesn’t diminish the fact that they’ve had interest in D Rozan in the past. Um, let me just ask you this. What do you think of Dear D Rozan as a player at this stage of his career? I think that he’s still productive. I think he’d fit and carry a similar profile on offense to to Jimmy in certain ways with if you just think about the way he’d fit in in Miami specifically. And I think like as we talk about this being a viable option for Miami or not, um there’s a part of it where if you take some swings and you mentioned San Antonio specifically just a minute ago, uh in the inner workings of that deal that that never happened, we’ve been thinking, oh gosh, Houston can outbid Miami and they’ve talked about other teams, OKC being able to outbid anyone for anybody. Now, San Antonio’s popping up as kind of like a team that is in the mix for a lot of big names and they could be in the mix for a guy like Kevin Durant all of a sudden. So, like the Heat are going to have stiff competition to get one of these top guys, right? So, then the next part of it is you’re going to look for the best available players you can get that might not cost quite as much as as the KDs and the Giannis’s of the world, but can help you win. And I still think Demar Rozan is that type of player. I think he can still be part of a competitive group, part of kind of what the Heat have have built um in the East in terms of being in that playing area. So, you have to adjust your expectations. I don’t think if Demar D Rozan is your biggest acquisition of an off season that you can go back to the fans and position yourself as any more of a playoff contender than you are now. Um, if that answers any kind of question, I think that he can help. But I don’t think that like fans are going to be um like just because of his name and his all-star resume and things like that that all of a sudden people are going to think that that catapults the Heat up to the top of the East. I do want to sneak in a a quick note here on his salary because I think this is interesting to think about. Um because it also is connected to like you say like what kind of player is he still today? Here’s another thing in 2627. So he he’s technically uh he has two years left on his deal, not including the season that just finished. But the last year of that, the 2627 season of that 25.7 million, 10 million is G is guaranteed. Um it goes to 12 million if he makes the Allstar team, 14 if he makes the All-Star team. um in both the seasons prior to the last season of his deal. And it’s also fully guaranteed if he makes the finals or if he plays in 60 regular season games, it becomes also fully guaranteed. I’m giving you all that because similar to the Duncan contract where there’s value in him beyond just what he does on the court because of what cost concessions you can maybe get from his contract later in the contract. I just think that’s something to think about when you think about who’s on the books for 26 27. Would it make sense to have a a a partially guaranteed D Rozan over a fully guaranteed Wiggins? That’s a question I guess we have to ask. So, there’s just there’s a lot to unpack, but I do think that on the court there’s there’s cases to be made for the scoring he brings. This team needs offense. Um, and so I’ll say that, but it does feel a little bit like um bargain bin shopping versus like really going to the full price retail stores. Well, I I I’m glad you I’m glad you broke that down though about the the contract because even without the partial guarantees or even if even if that was fully guaranteed, you’re basically getting a player at potentially at the same age that Jimmy is at less than half the price. You’re getting you’re getting two years for and and that’s not even that’s if everything was guaranteed. Uh which it doesn’t appear that it would based on the the qualifiers there. So you’re getting two years for I mean for less again less less than one Jimmy year would have been. Um that is interesting. Uh what’s also interesting is you know you look at his numbers he plays. Mhm. He plays uh availability is a big thing to them. Last year he played 77 games and I’m just going through it like he was right at his career numbers. Like he hasn’t slipped as a player. Um, look, we’ve seen him destroy Miami many, many times. I mean, he averaged 22.2 last year, and that’s with two different teams. His career average is 213. Uh, 3.9 rebounds. He’s never been a great rebounder. Uh, even though he had great athleticism early in his career, uh, and 4.4 for his career, 4.4 assists compared to 4.1. I mean, he’s basically the same player as his average year. He shot 48% last year compared to 47% over the course of his career. 33% from three. It’s never been his game. Uh he’s been a little better than there was 86% from the line. He’s not a great defender. Um he’s not horrific, but he’s not like he’s not he’s not what Wiggins would was advertised to be. Let’s put it that way. I didn’t think Wiggins was great when he came over, but he’s not what Wiggins was advertised to be. Now Wiggins is younger. And he’s a pro. I mean, he’s a pro. Like I nobody says anything bad about Demar Rozan, okay? Except this. All right. And this is why I want to handle this on the other side of the episode. He is not a playoff riser. He’s not um he’s a really good player in the regular season to get you to the playoffs. You cannot count on him to come up big in the playoffs. the the whole I I remember looking at uh some analytics that were done prior to the Raptors trading him to get Kawawaii and at the time they ran they had the 25 best players in the league based I don’t know what the AR I don’t know what the metric was I arbitrary whatever but D Roza was considered one of the 25 best players in the league at that time I guess and they they uh they said who rises most in the playoffs and who falls most and the biggest playoff riser in the league was Kawhi Leonard and the biggest faller, the biggest dropper was Demar De Rozan and that justified that trade and they won a championship. Now you can see they had a very good team. Siaka Manobi Lowry uh they were very underrated looking back. Everybody says, “Well, it’s just because Clay and Durant got hurt.” Well, maybe, but that was a it was a pretty damn good team. They had Mark Marul, who was an effective player towards the end of his career. It was a good team. Um and Van Vleet, etc. But I I think on the other side is that’s kind of where I am with this. And I’ll explain why I might be open to this, but it’s under a very specific circumstance, Greg, because again, you cannot count on him to be a lead guy or even a second guy in the playoffs. He’s just never done that. Um anyway, do want to mention something you do need to do if you got a leak in your house or any anywhere else, house, place of business. Reach out to our friends Michael and Robert. You can find them at Water Cleanup of Florida. That’s wcuffl.com, your one-stop water cleanup shop based in Boca Raton. Service the entire Trian area. If they can’t do the if they can’t do the job, they will let you know. They’re honest contractors, just really good people actually. Um, and again, based in Bokeh. They’ll service everywhere. They go all the way out to Fort Myers. They went up to Orlando. Wherever there’s disasters, you’ll find them, okay? And a lot they’re just helping people, okay? But they also, again, they do a really, really, really good job. You get the preventative maintenance. That’s the best thing to do. You do not Look, I live in downtown Lauderdale. Like literally I’m I’m in panther country right now and you it as soon as it rains like you need a boat. Okay. So we know we’re a low-level area. Reach out to these folks. They will help you make sure that you protect your valuables and everything else in your property. So check it out. Water cleanup of Florida wcf.com. If you’ve got the schmutz, they got the guts. All right. Let me let me throw this at you, Greg. I am okay with them going against Demar De Rozan if they also do something else. So in other words, if they’re reconstructing a team here and they find someone else to lead it, I don’t hate this idea. Okay. If you have D Rozan is like a secondary score at 25 million with, as you said, partial guarantees in the second year. That’s per track by the way, just so everyone knows where I got that from. I didn’t that’s their information. No, it’s good. It’s good information. I I was not aware of that part of the contract, right? I should have listened to the Locked on Heat episode more carefully because I I didn’t uh I I didn’t know that. But anyway, I I’m okay with adding him to some collective if they’re trying to compete if their idea is they’re trying to compete next year and you’re not committing long-term money to him. You don’t have the off the court issues with him that you had with Jimmy. And you know, he’s he’s going to get along. He’s going to play. Um he’s gonna help you get through the season. He and now his fit as far as a player, he’s a mid-range assassin. Okay. Um they tried to get away from that last year. Actually, as soon as you and I are done, I’m doing an episode with Brady about whether they should get back to the mid-range because we’re seeing Shay Gillis Alexander and others. Kawi’s done it for years that the mid-range is available in the postseason. Okay. Which should have made D Rozan a great postseason player. And so maybe you you look at it. But I guess Greg, that’s where I’m at. Like if you’re adding Kevin Durant, but you also figured out a way to get Demar D. Rozan, then I’m like, okay. But if you’re just adding D Rozan to Hero and Bam, I’m like, you’re going to probably be in the playing again, right? Yeah, that that’s kind of what I was alluding to earlier. Um to your point though like there is a team building world where we say and just this is totally hypothetical. Okay, Tyler Hero is up for a very big extension. Maybe we don’t want to pay him whatever it’s going to cost to pay him uh whether it’s 40 in excess of 40 million annually for however many years they extend him or it could be more. Who knows? Let’s say that they were to find a way to get Kevin Durant and then say Demar D Rozan provides offense and he has a much more friendly contract. So, we’re going to do some maneuvering. D Rozan’s going to supplement scoring next to Durant um in a way that um that Tyler would have, but obviously differently from a different area of the court. And then you’d also have to beg the question of like what other shooters are you putting around the team because I think that would be something that you’d need to iron out and if Duncan is unlikely to be back um you know what shooter are you replenishing the roster with I think that’d be an important question but you’re right it’s it’s a situation where if they look to completely shake this thing up um and it would be more the Tyler aspect of it I or I guess you could make the case for Wiggins. Um, but I I I don’t know. I I I think that it would there just needs to be multiple moves for D Rozan to make anybody feel differently about this Heat team or get um overly excited about this heat team. But frankly, if you want to remain competitive and you want to also balance your books to a degree, I could see where eventually after you canvas the league for some sort of um all-star that is in a weird spot or just a better player that you could get at a value or something becomes from an opportunistic perspective available that we can’t forecast yet. Like if all those wells dry up then I could understand where this D Rozan thing comes in. And if you did do D Rozan hero and Bam next year like I guess that could shoot for the six seed in the East I guess. But again like is that what we’re playing for? I think then the fans start to ask the question of if that’s what the time the kind the type of team we’re going to be should we be making different decisions about the long-term direction. So I’m with you. It’s like it it’s a perfect fit, but it doesn’t make anybody like stand up and and fist pump uh about the season if he’s your your your big acquisition of the summer. No, and that’s where I’m at. And I I think a lot of it comes down to what you think of Wiggins also. I mean, if if you think that if you think that Wiggins, you know, what we saw in spurts where he had the 42-point game, the 30-point game, it it seemed to me like they couldn’t really figured out if they wanted him to be Golden State Wiggins or Minnesota Wiggins or what. And and I it’s hard to tell if he even really liked being here because it just his personality is so understated. Uh but there were some things towards the end of the season that were a little worrisome in that regard, I think, and then also skipping the interview with the media at the end. So, I’m not really sure. I just know we didn’t um totally see it uh you know what what we were hoping to see, particularly on the defensive end. You know, he’s five years younger than D Rozan. Um he has the same number of years on his contract. He’s $5 million more per year. That’s not even including the the partials that you’re talking about. So, that that actually make D Rozan more affordable. I I think as far as an excitement level, I think it’s six of one, a half dozen other. I think the D Rozan thing is one of those things that and Durant to a certain degree this is but he’s still KD uh that I think Heat fans are just so fatigued by this conversation because we’ve had it for for so many years and it’s like okay you’re getting him at 35. I do not think he’s declined significantly as a player though. When I saw him against the Heat this year I’m like he’s the same guy like he you know what he is he has perfected that craft. He’s never going to become an elite three-point shooter. I I saw the numbers on him. Um hold on if you’re looking at it from three. So, I mean, he’s basically he’s a 30% three-point shooter over the course of his career. Exactly 30% on 1.7 attempts. It’s not He actually took 3.3 attempts last year. That’s the second most of his career. That’s per game, he shot 33%. The best he’s ever shot from three was in two 21-22. His first heat in Chicago, he shot 35%, but on under two attempts and he led the league in two points makes and two-point attempts. Okay. It’s who he is now. I I like him as a player. I I like him as a person, honestly. I think he’d be a great fit for their culture. He’s a good role model for the players. He He modeled himself. I talked to him when he was like in his third year. He was literally modeling himself after Dwayne. I remember talking to Dwayne about it. Like there’s a kinship between them. Um I don’t think he’d be scared off by coming to the Heat just because Kyle didn’t seem to like it very much. which I know how close Lowry and D Rozan were. Or even because Jimmy at the end didn’t like it so much. I I think he’d be fine here. I I just You’re right. It’s just It’s like if he’s if you’re just putting him in place of Wiggins, then I’m kind of like, okay, you’re just spinning your wheels here towards the the middle of the playin. Um and he’ll be in the playin because he’s always in the playin. Uh and he might get you out of the playin, but he’s not going to get you in the next round. And I that’s but but again if you’re adding KD and you’re flipping this and the Tyler conversation is one we’re having a lot here and you just want to be competitive and you think you got a shot and you put D Rozan with Durant and and uh let’s say you’re putting D Rozan with Durant and and Bam and you add a shooter somehow then are we having a different conversation? I I don’t I don’t know. I think everybody be focused on Dro on Durant not D Rozan. But if if again if D Rozan’s your second or or better yet your third option, it’s kind of like when Eddie Jones was your third option, like or when Mash was your third option, like that’s what this feels like. So I’ll let you close on it. So again, I don’t hate the idea of Demar De Rozan. I don’t love the idea of and I don’t even hate the idea of of getting swapping him into what you know, half of what Jimmy’s money was. I just don’t think it’s going to excite anybody if like you said that’s the move. Well, and here’s the other part. We’ll close here. He’s not a free agent. Um so you’re going to and we talked about giving up stuff to get something and like how willing are you to do that. The other part of this conversation as we close is what’s it going to cost? And so if you have to sacrifice future draft capital, particularly first round draft capital, what what if it what if it’s Hawk as a first and filler? See that first is weird to me. Like that’s that’s where I’m a little I’m I’m as I look around the league and there’s been predictions lately. I think Sham’s actually predicted this so we’ll take it. Right. He said uh he thinks this could be one of the craziest off seasons ever because everybody there’s not a lot of teams with cap space. So free agency is not going to be the vehicle. It’s going to be trades, trades, trades. Hopefully something opportunistic pops up. Um and that could maybe make this seem like uh part of a a a bunch of moves that make sense, but ultimately like what are we talking about here? Like are are we really going to talk ourselves into D Rozan? He’s the guy who hits a buzzer beater over Haimey Hakez in game 26 of the season, but he ain’t getting you to game 26 of the playoffs, you know, like that’s just not who he is. Um, so I just I I’ll say that it is a move that I wouldn’t hate and I could understand why you would want to do it, particularly if you moved off Tyler’s money and you wanted to have the same amount of productivity from a scoring perspective, just sheer points. um but don’t want to have the money committed. But again, like uh this is um he he fans are not going to take this as the as the um the win of the off seasonason at all. Well, we’ll see where it goes. Again, we have to have the DDR conversation at least three times every summer. He’s he’s going to retire his actually D Rozan’s number retired before Jimmy’s in Miami. That’s my prediction. He got retire. Actually, everybody will. Uh Greg, appreciate it. Everybody’s gonna get mad at me for that. I just I’m just speaking for what I’m told on that. So, that’s not not my preference one way or the other. All right, more episodes coming up. Uh we’re also going to do something uh interesting list that came out about who’s paid the luxury tax over the past few years uh and how much success they’ve had. And I think that’ll be Greg and my next episode. So, we’ll get into that. We’ll do the heavy lifting while Brady just teaches me about the mid-range game. Have a good one, everybody. Thank you for listening to the five on the floor on the five reason sports network. After all, someone needs to listen to my dad.

Several times over the past few seasons, DeMar DeRozan has been linked to the Miami Heat. Does the veteran midrange scorer still make sense? And would the Heat look seriously at him? Ethan Skolnick and Greg Sylvander discuss.

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