The Raptors have figured something out

The Raptors have figured something out

Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of the Pullup Tray podcast. I’m of course your host Samson Folk joined by of course the other host Travon Heath. The tray that pulls up. It’s uh the Raptors weren’t a team of destiny. As it turns out, they didn’t have all of the juice that, you know, we wanted them to have. They didn’t have that extra oomph. You know, your name here is Isaac Jones hate. He was powerful. He was rumbling and bumbling down the lane. The Raptors had no recourse to stop him. The offense was not as inventive as it needed to be. The the pickup point, the pressure defense, it slowed down a little bit over time. And similar to the, you know, the team Canada loss that we hate. Sometimes sometimes a 6’8 big body man just destroys you in the front court. How you doing? How you feeling? I’m I’m doing good. But I will say last week we witnessed one of the most unethical features of basketball I’ve ever seen. Summer League is about a place where young players are able to grow and potentially work their way up into eventually earning NBA minutes. But sure, I’m aware AJ Lawson is 25, but that was one guy on the team. There there wasn’t a single player under 21 years old. Under 22 actually on that Kings team that we lost to is Nick. Nick is 22. Yeah. Folk man on that team. And they Isaac Jones. He’ll probably think about this game for a few weeks, but in the lexicon of the NBA, I will never think about this 36-point game again. It it will it will never pass my mind. It was not useful for anyone involved. I don’t understand why they played, but it is what it is. I suppose it is. I I want to ask you, do you So, 100 men versus a gorilla. Which side are you on, by the way? 100 men, easily. Okay. I think we could do it with less. Okay. 100. How many of you could beat a gorilla? 75. I’m going to go 75. That’s pretty high, actually. How many How many of a gorilla then? This is This is where I wanted it to go. I think you could do it with speed though. You just This How How far can you run? How How long do you think you can run without stopping? If I make I did a I did a marathon. You did do a Yeah. But this is right. We don’t ask enough questions. We do not know enough about each other. You did run a marathon. So I think with speed I think a smooth 83 smooth. So you give Okay. All right. But I see how it is. You’re giving yourself the edge over me in gorilla fighting. Do you Wait, do you think you work together as a team better in the aggregate than I do? Like 75 Trees is stronger as a mind meld than 75 Samsons. I think so. Like I think I’m ready. You play nicer. I’m I’m more agreeable. I’m ready to just forge my way through it and knowing I’m going to die. Okay. just I was I was actually I was on a run today and I thought about that topic and I was like I wonder how many for each of us. Okay, we’re going to get into honestly the the strategy for attacking a gorilla 100 men towards it is like the swarm attack, right? Mostly and that’s how the Raptors played. I want to start with their play style. Obviously, listeners will get more into looking directly at some of the the interesting players and exciting players for the Raptors, but we’re going to start with play style, what it means for the Raptors going forward. But also, make sure to like, comment, subscribe. It’s pretty good, pretty early. We nailed it. Also, uh, if anybody has any feedback on my new mic situation, good or bad, please let me know. We’re in the process of testing everything out. So, Trey, the Raptors are the number one team in Pickup Point. They’re the number one team in pressure. They’re the number one team in turnovers. They are busting their ass everywhere on the court to try and create that way and suppress what the other team is doing. I think everybody listening to the podcast probably watched a game or two, has a sense of what that looked like. It did slow down over the course of the tournament. They didn’t have as much juice. So my question for you is given the Raptors, we know like eight guys that are going to be playing a lot of minutes for the big team this year. How do you feel about that style of play with this roster and how much of it it do you think can translate directly from summer league to NBA regular season? Yeah, I think it’s pretty transferable and we already kind of saw the signs of that early in the second half of the season when they kind of turned around their defense. And also, I think it’s very encouraging encouraging because it’s kind they’re shifting along with some of the the tides of some of the most successful teams. Oklahoma City Thunder, high pickup team, tons of pressure, they swarm guys and create tons of turnovers. One of those reasons because they struggle in the half court outside of SGA. The Indiana Pacers became one of the better teams defensively despite despite having um for for all intents and purposes, Tyres isn’t the greatest defender. Having him in their lineups, they still had elite defense with him. And that was because they’re super physical. They pick up the ball very early and they wear you down, which which I think was a big reason why one the Raptors, they came back in a lot of games where their offense wasn’t really good. They were down 10, down 12 points, were able to come back, win some of those games. They almost came back first to Kings. And like the Pacers, they wore teams down in the fourth. They kind of ascended as teams were coming down in terms of their energy level, and that’s because of the pace they play and defensively. So, I think they can do it. They have the personnel. They have guys like Jacobe. They have guys like Jamal who who really have bought into the the system. So, I think the intents and purposes of that two guard spot, whoever it is, has to be that person that is picking up the ball, adding tons of pressure, and helping them create easier buckets through turnovers. A really interesting thing, I think, is the the idea of the, and I talked about this with Caitlyn, but the rim protector being maybe one of the most important parts of the defense on the floor. Miles Turner was probably, and Caitlyn and I have talked about this, but the fourth best defender in the starting lineup. He definitely wasn’t better than N Smith. He definitely wasn’t better than Pascal and especially not Nehard. And the Pacers pick and roll defense with Turner and Seakum on the floor was top five. With Turner and Tophin on the floor was bottom five. Like the ground defense, the court coverage has started to emerge as maybe the most important aspect of defense. And you could see that in the finals with the Pacers and with the Thunder. And core coverage isn’t just pickup points because while the Raptors last season were a high pickup point team, they didn’t necessarily pressure above the break the same way that this summer league team did. A lot of stuff was getting jumped. And even though the Raptors did guard up high up, I guess relative to the NBA as far as the level of the screen with their bigs, Mo helped some of that cuz he switched everything out. Yakob did a pretty good job of stepping out, too. or at least stepping high up. The pressure was not the same at the regular season level. I am really unbelievably interested to see RJ Barrett, Brandon Ingram, those two in particular exhibit what we saw there and if they’re even going to try like 40% of that pressure above the break because I think Emanuel Quickley it kind of suits his game that type of pressure because he can pressure and he can you know rotate off ball and he can do that kind of stuff. Obviously, Scotty loves to pressure the ball. Yakob won’t be doing that. But RJ, Ingram, Grady, three guys who are absolutely necessary for the offensive health of this roster, what that looks like from those guys. I’m curious what how you think that might work at all. I I I think their current starting lineup, at least the one that we we kind of assume it will be RJ with Ingram, Quickly, Yakob. It’s hard. It’s hard to because the only guy the only swing piece is RJ. Yeah, pretty pretty much everyone else is entrenched. How could he come off the bench? It’s tough. Logically logically speaking, I think for the way that the Raptors want to play and for the overall benefit and health of both offensively and defensively, either Jacobe or Ochai should most likely be the the two guard. It allows it allows IQ to have um less pressure defensively because in a current lineup RJ is not guarding the the other team’s best guard. That would be a humongous task and we Scotty’s kind of had a mixed bag of doing it and like his overall strength is with his ground coverage being that help side like sort of like lynch pin of the defense. You can throw Ochar Jacobe ask them to pressure the ball. It’s already something that they both they both like to do and both are have willingness to do so. And in in your in your transitional lineups, you can insert RJ, take Quickly out, insert Grady, take one of those guys out, and you’re staggering you’re staggering sort of these like offensive creators like within those lineups amongst other defenders because if Jacobe is able to defend at a high level or Ochai for example, you you then have a starting lineup where you can you can see that where they’re above average defense. Brandon Ingram has tons of length. He’s a He’s a good mover. He All he has to do is be a neutral defender. And I’ve seen him do that at the NBA level. With Scotty and YaKob, you probably have one of the best defensive like big combos in the NBA. And it becomes much more reasonable to have a a above average defense. I think with the current thought process and lineup, I I don’t foresee them be able to play that type of style or be effective doing it. I’d be so surprised, man, if if R.J.’s not in the starting lineup. I’m I’m like, whoa. By the way, Fair Life Chocolate Milk, if you want me to use your carton instead of a jar, you can sponsor the podcast. It’s It’s probably more likely that just Argie’s like first first guy off and like halfway through the first quarter. But but you but you want to send him to the bench. That’s he could play the same amount of minutes. I just think he comes in. Mano Jobi’s a Hall of Famer. He made tons tons of money, a great legacy doing the exact same. How many How many coaches do you think have pulled like the Manu card? You know what I mean? It It’s got to be almost every single one. Jordan Jordan Pool I bet he wish he was still in Golden State coming off the bench. Yeah, that’s not his fault though, man. He got clocked. That’s That’s a whole different thing. Oh lord, that’s funny. Oh boy. Yeah, man. How crazy is that? Draymond just Oh my god. And then he’s and he said he wouldn’t get over it. He’s nuts, man. Dre Draymond is Oh, jackassery. Like at the at the highest level, he does it. Uh, okay. So obviously I expect less pressure from the Raptors, but I actually think that Darko I don’t exactly know. Like when Will asked us on that that round table episode that we did in Vegas, I said that I thought the Raptors were going to make the playoffs through the playin, which is still calling them a playoff team, by the way. I just think it’ll happen through the playin. 25% of the spots that used to exist statically are now different. That’s a quarter of available spots. It’s not that bad to say like they’ll get in through the plan firstly. Secondly, I I don’t know if Darko is going to approach it like, man, wins are what dictate everything this year or if he’s going to be kind of the way he’s been, whereas he really wants to stick to certain principles that appeal to his offense or his basketball philosophy overall rather than exactly what suits every player on the roster. like last year saying, “I want Grady Dick guarding every single player in the NBA.” Like that’s during the rebuilding seasons that makes sense. Yeah. It is It isn’t appropriate for the expectation, the money paid, all this kind of stuff that the Raptors have built with this roster for them to say like, “Well, we just want we just want to focus on Grady Dick’s defensive, you know, they’ll they’ll have to hide him. They’ll need his offense. Hopefully, he pops off. Hopefully, he’s better at defense, too. But they’ll probably have to do some hiding defensively. I wonder where the rubber meets the road there. The second thing I want to ask you is in 5 years, how many members of the Raptors summer league team are in the NBA? Jamal Shed 27. AJ Lawson 30. Olrich will be what, like 23, Jacobe 25, something like that. 26. How many guys on Jameson Battle? How many guys on that roster are NBA players? I guess to answer your first question, um I think they’re going to prioritize winning. They’ve invested too much in the roster into the overall payroll. And like this season, although there’s no feelers out there at all, like it kind of is like where the rubber meets the road for Darko’s like tenure as a Raptor. They there needs to be like significant progression and they like I think if they’re the eighth seed that would be a disappointment honestly. They I think they need to win anywhere from like 43 to like 47 wins to feel good about the level of investment they put into the actual roster. Like so 43 to 47. I guess the East will probably be weaker this season. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Because like who made the play? Miami didn’t have a winning record and they made the playoffs. Yeah, I think maybe they had like 36 or 37 wins or something like that. Something like that. You want to feel confident about the group in order to like make make changes, invest into it more and obviously invest into like the Scotty era of this team. You want to feel good about it and entering into the the next season. Um, and then regards to the summer league team, I would say there’s I’m going to I’m going to stick to four. Four for sure. I think Jameson Battle, he shoots the ball too well to to to be out of the league. He’s going to be choosing choosing four. Okay. Jameson Battle’s for sure going to be in the NBA. Jacobe Walter, he defends really well and I think the shot is is while streaky right now going to even out to be at least like an average level shooter. So he will be a rotational player for a long time. I’m going to say Oris Chamsh bigs get tons of opportunity in the NBA before the before the league is done with you. You get multiple kicks at the can. He’s super young. So he will have that like intrigue and mystery around him probably three or four years down the line still because he’ll be what 22. Yeah. 22 23 which is insane. Maybe 24 actually cuz he’s 19. 24. Yeah. And then the the fourth one I’m going to I’m going to say AJ Lawson is the the fourth one. What about CMBB? Oh I assumed he was a guarantee. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So Jamal is dropping out. It’s It’s not He’s just in He has the the toughest path to be etching out a long career because he’s a small guard. And although like summer league was very fun like his overall performance was disappointing just because from from a level of defense you want you want what you saw at Houston to sort of translate and it hasn’t necessarily done so. I think as like off the ball and defending and being a playmaker there, he comes up with tons of steals. He loves to gamble. He Kyle Larryesque in the way that he’s able to draw draw fouls in in in those spots, but on the ball because he’s so small. Um the overall like strength and size advantage he had in college like hasn’t necessarily um worked out the same way in the NBA. And there is no real guards that play for a long time that can’t shoot at that size. So he’s going to have to be able to be an above average shooter to stick for a long period of time. And five years is a really long time if the defense isn’t going to be other otherworldly. Like Gary Payton Jr. elite defender for a very long period of time. He still bounces around the league because shooting is so vital in order to to playing minutes and being within within lineups. So, I’m hoping the best for him. Obviously, I want him to to have a long NBA career, but I think his path is tougher than most. Like AJ Lawson is a wing with size that can shoot. And in that five years, he’s heading into like his prime of his career in terms of like overall ability. And you can see that he’s sort of fixing he’s sort of um fitting within the mold of being one of those guards that can put the ball on the floor with not many dribbles, shoot the ball at a decent level. And at that size, you’ll always get a look as like an end of rotation, end of roster sort of wing. The AJ Lawson one is pretty interesting because he can, especially with the league trending this way. His skill set is pretty friendly to what looks like the immediate or short-term future, especially with like pickup points, especially with that aggressive defense. If he was playing in a more conservative defense, you would actually probably get pretty concerned about his wiry frame. at at at his size, but since a lot of it is based around pressure, the Raptors aren’t the only team that’s going to play this way. They aren’t the only team that played this way prior. It’s pretty easy to see him keep on getting looks as you said. Yeah. And if he shoots the ball, I think Jamal shot 24% at summer league. It came around a little bit during the regular season. When I was talking to him at summer league, he said like that’s just the biggest priority. But the biggest disappointment isn’t because I don’t know. I’m not really I’m not really expecting him to shoot the leather off the ball. It’s just like yes, he can hit floaters, but the the floaters are tough because floaters require less rotation from the defense. So, it becomes more about whether you made it or you missed it. And being reliant as an option for creation on just floaters as the best thing you can create is a really tough way to carve out possessions for an NBA offense for a team to keep giving you those possessions like, “Hey, you’re going to have the ball a lot.” Because even when the Raptors were really good and they had a very talented team, everyone hated when they just had Patrick Macau up top passing to guys off pin downs. They’re like, “This isn’t creating anything. This is bad. This is not good. If Jamal does not become like a strong pull-up threat, he doesn’t have the ability to get to the rim repeatedly, although he can sometimes. He’s going to draw less rotation. He’s not going to create as much for others. And every possession becomes the dice roll of like does the floater go in or not. And even though he put up okay stats, like what are the stats for summer league? 13 points per game, under seven assists, like just shy of a two to one assist ratio, but he shot 39% from the field and and 24% from three. The Raptor struggles offensively largely, and I hate to, but at the summer league revolved around his inability to create looks for other people because he didn’t draw rotations. And as much as a fun run of like an 80 o stretch or n0 stretch that he had where like floaters going is good, the structure of the defense doesn’t care. And the Raptors when they overwhelm teams, they did it defensively. And Jamal as a smaller guard can’t be an offguard and has to justify himself completely as a point guard. And as you said, that road is so difficult, man, because because you have to convince an offense and a coach to give you the ball repeatedly. And even like Cory Joseph is like 2 in taller than him. And I don’t but he he works, man. Yeah. And he he and AJ I would give like roughly the same percentage chance to about cuz one of them is going to shoot the ball probably and whoever shoots the ball is probably who’s sticking around. But everyone else seems like very easy. Shamshay seems so easy. CMBB so easy. Jacobe so easy. I mean that’s that’s a piece of cake there. Um we’re pretty much in lock step. Of those guys, is there anybody you want to focus in on that? I mean, we didn’t get to talk about CNB’s 20point game. I did with my my screwed up microphone as I w went through a full film room. You know, over 7,000 people still watched it despite the mic being screwed up. What is going Yeah. Okay, enough of that. Enough of that. But, uh, actually, I’m going to selfishly I want you to talk about CMBB, and I want to bounce that off each other. Yeah. I like he gave us I wish I wish it was when we were both watching the same game, but um he gave us the the game that we were looking for and like you saw what if he’s going to surprise an average 15 or average 14 next season like you saw that’ll be a lot. Yeah. But like it’s the same way that that Scotty averaged 15 as a rookie despite like poor spacing despite having tons of other creators around him like Fred Van Vleet Pascal Seakum who demand the ball and need and were the guys of the team. It’s getting it off the glass. Um being able to um create turnovers himself that lead to points overall. Um the occasional spot up. I really liked his work together um with um Jacobe and Jamal to be honest. Um the snug pick and roll that he had with uh Oh yeah. When Mobile blew the dunk. Oh, we were so close, man. Incredible. That was my topic in the round table, man. That was my topic. Oh, that was Scotty’s Scotty’s going to dunk that this year. Like you you see how he’s going to be able to to score and like defensively he’s been amazing. He was the Raptor’s best defender um in every minute that he played because he can he’s unique in the sense that he can cover ground really well and was also able to like adopt and pressure the ball. He guarded multiple ball handlers and like instinctually was able to blow up tons of drives because he was able to either scr either scram people off like Jamal or able to peel peel off to the opposite side of the corner in in ways that are very like unique because of his reflexes, size, and just like overall build. But like offensively like you see a lot of the work is going to be junk junkyard dog sort of sort of way of going about things and like the Raptors have a lot of guys who are creators. I’m like they need somebody do that. So I think it’s going to it’s going to work out. I do. I mean, I I’ve made that point quite a few times, but as you say, just operating in the same sense as when Delano Banton and Justin Champany and Scotty Barnes, all three of them were in the 90th percentile and above in offensive rebounding. They all played pressure defense that year. They all got their hands on as much as they could under Nick Nurse. The principles are not exactly onetoone between Nurse and and Darko, but there is some overlap and the expectation of the in between players to kind of incubate the other players and do the dirty work. And CMB for all the interesting aspects of his driving game, which I was pretty disappointed with in the semi-finals. Like I thought there were gaps he could have tried for that he didn’t go after. And it it just makes sense. You get the big game, 20 points, and then you get the ant game. What do you have? Like I don’t even remember how much he scored. It wasn’t much. He He hardly took any shots, but the offense will take its time coming along as far as creating. The potential I do think is there. I mean, I’ve made this pitch so many times before in the leadup, but the in between stuff, the rebounding, pressure defense, as we just, as I said, the difference in Pascal Seakum being on the floor and Pascal Seakkum being off the floor means Mile Sterner is a bottom five pick and roll like big in the league or top five. Stepping into the lane and operating as a guard rail is incredibly important. And these aspects of defense show up so much because you pressure the ball, you create pickups. Pickups are uncomfortable. Moving against players in motion so that their reads are constantly changing leads to more turnovers, steals, etc. And if you can’t force the pickup, showing up in the lane as a guard rail, it creates turnovers. It creates stops. And CMBB is in a tremendous position to play the four and help out all of his bigs and support his guards all season long. He was it looked pretty natural like he was seeing the play before the play came. Now, there’s some gamles where it didn’t really work out. And sometimes, honestly, this might sound like copium, I guess, because he’s my guy, but sometimes it looked like he was operating as if the defense was going to support him in the like sometimes he’d get a a deflection, hit it into open space and and he’d go for out on the break and expect somebody to like come after him and it would be like, “Oh, nothing came.” Or he’d make a dig on somebody. He’d be like, “Oh, I thought that rotation was going to be behind me.” like he’s operating at that next level of defensive decision-m. Maybe this is me being over his elves with him. It’s let me know in the comments of course, but he does his defensive decision-m is elite. His quickness uh improved over the course of summer league and his size and aggressiveness overwhelmed everybody he came into contact with except that damn Isaac Jones who did he did go bodyto body and he did cause some trouble for him. a grown grown like how how is he supposed to deal with a 25year-old? Third game of the year. I’ve told you this story before, but when I was probably 130 pounds and I started going to like the ID camps, you know, the the CIS schools to be like, “Okay, am I going to play some college ball?” And then the Jo guys, the 22year-old guys come up from like Arkansas for a full ride and you’re playing against them. This guy weighs like 190. I’m giving up 60 pounds in a scrimmage and I just have no idea what to do. It’s It’s unbelievable the difference that size makes. I mean, I’ve guarded you in how many scrimmages and I always I always want the give me the post up, let’s go. It never it never ends well for me, man. Size matters so much. And yeah, I uh he got bodied, but I expect him to be the bodyier more than the the body e. I think um in like a lot of the the minutes where the Raptors like overall defense like wasn’t good was like the game where mobile didn’t play especially like backline like if you’re when you’re trying to force up force pickups and are pressuring the ball. It’s a lot of just similar to what you said, it’s a lot of faith in that the backline defense if you do get beat is going to be there. Um even like in the Kings game, Isaac Jones got tons of easy looks because the over like the Raptors um weren’t able to stop the ball at the level and he was getting a lot of easier looks and with his physicality was able to like separate he literally move guys like CMV off of off of their spot where I think like this the the why they can play this style like with the main roster is because that guy on the backline who I know for sure is going to be there is going to be Yako Pto who’s a great decision maker and he can handle the the size and strength of Isaac Jones is not going to be there but if I if Isaac Jones is on the block in in that sense so like still like overall takeaway from like summer league is like you could see like what the Raptors are trying to accomplish and how they’re trying to play and I think it’s super exciting as you can see on screen like depending on where the rotation comes from the guards have to be able to chase to the back line when the big steps forward. However, if the big doesn’t step forward really well, then you’re looking at the dribble getting too deep and it pressures the rim. So, guys have to stay at home instead of being able to meet the ball and clear out to their different rotations. When you have a not very active big like a Rudy Goar, they need to be truly excellent at deterring the rim just with their size and making other players take lateral dribbles. east west dribbles. And if you don’t, if you have a guy who is not very good at deterring shots or forcing misses, then you’re going to give up a lot at the rim. And if you have an undersized guy, they have to be able to meet the ball really high on the floor. And they’re backtracking elsewhere has to be really good. And your defensive connectivity has to be really good. Mobile and CMB were unbelievable at part two. Shamsh for his experience level was pretty damn good at part one. That’s at the summer league level, but we’ve yet to see how all of that looks at the for the regular season. Mo, I think his his weakness as a defender was the the rotations to the rim in his rookie season. Stopping the ball out front was the big that was his advantage. CMBB, even though he had that big sweeping block and he had a couple of them and he definitely has that in his game, I think largely will be a defender who is better at keeping the ball out in front when he’s on it and then also rotating to keep the ball up top and hoping that the active guards of the Raptors are there and eager to rotate, peel switch to the corner, veer back switch out of pick and roll, all that kind of stuff. U if anybody wants to know what peel switching and veerback switching is, I’ll diagram it on this weekend’s mailbag. So, look forward to that. Trey, is there anybody else you want to talk about before we get into Rich Paul uh a grandizing a little bit? Um I guess um touch I think we should probably touch on Jacobe Walter. talked about the breakout game he had and how great that was. And um obviously after that really mixed bag. Our boy got dunked on, man. He was like and you know what, he was polite enough not to not to you know spin the block going back when Jacobe Jacobe went one for 11 after that but he didn’t come back like yo what’s up. Yeah. Like and that was one of the reasons why they lost. like him and Jamal were probably the two guys that were asked to create the most for the team and create um advantages overall and that just like never happened. One of the things you wanted to see and like a step for Jacobe is obviously his handle improving because that makes puts less onus on him being this great shooter and he can be be a guy that he’s already good at at drawing fouls and creating contact at the rim. if he actually can get there with his dribble, it improves his game a ton. We didn’t see that. Um, a lot of the dribbles are still east west. He can’t really necessarily get downhill. And although that that is disappointing, I think for the role that he’s going to play overall, like he will fit in the Raptors like roster and like rotation and be totally fine. But I think for him, as much as like the shooting needs to stabilize and not be as streaky, if he is able to dribble, that will make him a bonafide NBA player, if not starter in the league. It is. Defense is so important in this day and age because Jacobe is actually a very limited offensive player, like extremely so. and we don’t really talk about it because we’re all extremely excited about how good he is defensively and his pressure defense and isolation defense and even though he wasn’t excellent in the pick and roll, it’s it’s fine to expect that he will become good in that. Like that is so great for him. But the he had a one like usually it goes more assists than turnovers most players. He had a one to4 not 4:1 a 1:4 assist to turnover ratio. He had I He had less than an assist a game. He just had no means. And this is summer league. You know, he’ll have more than an assist a game in the NBA probably because shooting is better, performances are better, but this goes to show he didn’t create an easy look for anybody the whole tournament. That’s a that’s a that’s a spot. That’s a bad that’s a bad thing. And it is because of his it’s because of his dribble. He can’t he can’t get anywhere. He and again he struggles at the rim. He had he there was the the weight discourse and then he had the finish at the bucket the first game. It was like nice but it was the struggles are still the same. He can get better at all this stuff. Of course, he works hard and he’s a young man who can of course improve. But currently, as we’re looking, he’s not well equipped to create anything really. And as much as, you know, a few possessions here and there in regular season where he pulled up out of the pick and roll were nice, the ability to like use his dribble to get a step on somebody, read the second level of the defense, and play make for others is just his game is completely bereft of it. And that’s not necessarily a bad thing for him because he probably won’t be asked to do it that much, but it does it is important for framing expectation around who he is and just where you think his game will go and how much work it will take to get to that point because if you want to be a guard who gets the ball and this is it’s the same thing with Jamal who you know actually credit to him the six assists he he made some plays in the lane. The short roll was an important aspect of what of how the Raptors scored. He made some of those spray passes. I’ll have a piece on Jamal coming out. I’ve been teasing it for two weeks now. Um but six assists isn’t exactly easy in summer league. His 24 and 12 game or 26 and 12 game was a nice finish at the end. I thought Jamal, he had a really great finish to summer league, but their starting guards did not have the the poise or composure to completely undo summer league defenses the way that you would want or I guess where expectations might have been. And Jacobe will always have 26 and seven. 26 points, seven steals. And the 26 points, yes, it came off of back cuts and spot up opportunities and a pull up here and there and run outs in transition. But you know what? When you bust your ass and defend like hell, which the Raptors will and he will too, you get to run out. You get to score the easy ones. And nobody should turn their nose up at easy ones, but the team has to obviously look at him and be like, “Okay, certain packages we might have wanted to give him this year. Maybe he’s not ready for that.” Uh, just credit to Jacobe for I think the defensive fire. He underperformed his shooting talent, which was pretty disappointing to see. I wanted to see him shoot the lights out and I I expect it but he had to take harder shots. It’ll all be fine at the the regular season level with the big team, but uh he didn’t give anybody any reasons to get really excited, I don’t think. Which that’s life. That’s life. Yeah. Yeah. like you you wanted him to be like too too good for for summer league and like do some of those two dribble two dribble stuff like off close out like that didn’t necessarily happen overall but like being able to defend will get you on the floor in the new NBA like before being able to like have this offensive punch so I think he’s still still in play to play tons of minutes and like how they decide who is going to be priority between him and Grady is like one of like the best underlining underlining stories of the season. Mhm. And we we had that conversation so we won’t we’ll have it once more before the season. A decently long one where we I don’t know are we going to each pick a guy? Yeah. Yeah. We can each pick a guy. Yeah, we’ll each pick a guy. Um speaking of picking a guy, the Raptors said Brandon Ingram, we want that guy. And then they traded for him and then they paid him. And I think maybe it was I can’t remember. We were doing I was dying of sickness during that month, dude. February. Oh yeah. Oh man. Rough month for me, but we did the podcasting regardless. And I I think we most people came away from Brandon’s extension like higher than I thought. A player option as well, but he’s on the team. It’s not going to kill you. The contract isn’t going to kill you. hyperfocusing on the contracts is going to put you in a like a not a fun place as a fan. And of course, from the Raptors team building point of view, you look at the past, was it helpful that they underpaid Kyle Lowry for his full tenure as a Raptor? Yes, it was. It was very helpful. Uh, and it meant that they got to spend money elsewhere. Was it helpful that they would sign guys on the banual exception and they would be playoff starters? Hell yeah, dude. like the the salary cap aspect of the NBA does force people who want to analyze into these conversations, but more so I wanted to discuss just quickly. It’s not often that you have the representation of a player kind of gassing themselves over the player. And Rich Paul being very candid, I think that he was telling the truth. Yeah. said, “I don’t think Brandon would have got this money in free agency,” which is a test a testament to one maybe most importantly how many teams carry free agency money now. How teams play close to the cap for trade purposes and they have like flatsome salaries like Bruce Brown who’s supposed to facilitate these trades, right? Mhm. Partially why RJ Barrett is included in a lot of trades because he has that type of salary that fits into those bigger trades. And two, Brandon Ingram was not seen as an undeniable all-star. So, he didn’t merit teams wanting to make moves to clear things up. And he didn’t merit a bidding war at the deadline because teams were leery of what paying him looked like. What do you make of Rich Paul saying openly, nah, he wasn’t going to get it? I the the framing of it. The framing of it is tough. was like, “Ah, we got him beside one last time on the I I think it’s just I think the conversation is just like how the CBA and the NBA has turned into like moving to free agency used to be in 2015 the ultimate like joker and wild card for any player to like usurp their their leverage over a team. But now the way that things have been structured going into free agency, you’re entering a humongous risk as a as a player. And like sometimes it works out for like Fred Van Vleet who turns down an extension and gets $40 million. But is he is he going to save the CBA? I’ve never met I don’t know. I’ve never met a player that is able to get money like Fred Vanble. He he tweeted out he tweeted out his little dice and said watch this before he and he won and he’s playing with Kevin Durant. So I don’t know but you’re like players now are entering free agency are entering like with massive risks. You you have guys like Caleb Martin last year who we thought were was going to get paid doesn’t get paid. Actually the best example is probably Gary. The rumors now I don’t know. I I can’t confirm anything, but the rumors are the extension was what between 12 to 15 a year that the Raptors offered. Mhm. And then he takes a minimum once he actually hits the market. That is a staggering difference of payment there. Yeah. Like CJ McCollum have done irreparable damage to the player player association. Like they’ve they’ve basically squeezed in the the middle class of the NBA to similar to like the NFL. Like I’ve never seen a season where like this many guys have been bought out or or flipped simply because of their their contract. This is Do you remember who was it like Linus Cla the stretch provision was used on when they introduced the stretch provision? They’re like there’s too many bad contracts. Every team gets one and but that doesn’t exist now. And Damian Lillard Lillard I that was so shocking. It’s just like it’s it’s gotten to a point where the the penalties for being an apron team are too hard and it’s affected other players. But digress, that’s for another another time. Um I think the Brandon Ingram of of that is um the Raptors leaving him to go to to allowing him to go to free agency is also a risk for them. They’re they’re not a a big destination for most players. The best free agent we’ve ever got was was Deari Carol. Hu turaloo if you if if the playoffs moments mean more to you. I remember asking this question and I people started introducing like undrafted free agents and I was like I don’t I don’t think that counts. like it can end up being yes, but the the point of the conversation is like was there ever a guy who was really good who said I will go play in Toronto now that I have the field to choose from and the best answers for that are Deari Carol and Hedo Turaloo which is not shining beacon of and I think also looking at like the deadline they had this massive bruise Brown contract that they needed to do something with to to gain value cuz they traded Pascalakum with this this in in mind. So you’re under like this very strict deadline and like I don’t think Brandon Ingram is a Raptor if he does if it there isn’t an impression that he’s getting an extension. So there is also just this ground that could be lost and losing this like big asset or salary in in theory. So, I don’t think they’re in a position to necessarily like haggle with him. Honestly, what what did it take like four or five days, the extension? Like, it hardly took any time. And honestly, here’s the thing. Is is the Ingram trade a home run? No, it’s never going to be a home run, but he’s a great player and he’s under contract and we’ll see how it goes. The most important thing is that he plays well. Teams like like here’s the thing. the Thunder. Is Isaiah Hartenstein a $30 million a year player? Probably not. However, the team construct meant that he could get paid that and the team didn’t have to worry about it. Mhm. They won and they’re totally comfortable paying that because it just so happened that how the salaries worked elsewhere, that’s what they could do. The Raptors have no home runs anywhere, especially now that Scotty’s off his rookie scale contract. And that makes people hyperfocus on how much each player makes when in reality these like yes they all fit together because they’re part of a team but it’s not the players fault. They just they just negotiated and leveraged as much as they could possibly get and you know Becky’s your aunt, Bob’s your uncle. There you go. Like that’s Now now is it awesome for a team when they have a home run contract? Yeah, dude. Bangers and Mash. That rocks. That’s like so good for a team. When when OG had Anobi, I thought he was going to get 25 a year and like sorry OG that you didn’t get it when you signed with the Raptors, but he got like 18. I was like, whoa, how did they do this? But and and Fred signed a bunch of contracts that were was so friendly. Kyle Lowry always got underpaid. It’s just they did well for a really long time. no home runs lately, which makes everybody look directly at certain players and and hyperfixate when you know players are usually in the realm of what they would have been paid. Yeah. And in majority of the like his contract and majority of them on the the roster are very easy to pivot from if it doesn’t doesn’t go up. Ingram’s only signed for technically realistically a couple years. the only like investment they’ve put in terms of long-term money, I guess, now it’s like Quickly, Scotty, and and Yaka Purto now with the with the extension. But even even like with even with like Quickly and Yako Pto, they aren’t in a position where like that could turn around in in a way that they moved or or flipped or exchanged like the Raptors like using the cap space puts them in position to make things to make um trades be much easier and be able to pivot. They aren’t a team that can say in 2027 we’re hoarding $60 million to sign Luca Donuch. That’s just never going to happen for that team. So, they need to use the salary cap so they can maneuver and pivot when things don’t work out. Yep. Fill out the salary, pivot from there. Try and keep try and keep players that teams would want to trade for, you know, that’s that’s just kind of where it is. Even if they’re I know Emanuel Quickley, a lot of people focus on his contract. Even if the Raptors underperform and it’s year three and they’re like it’s just not going to work as our point guard of the future, teams will be looking at, okay, you know, maybe it’s trade deadline. They would say like, well, we pay the second the last third of his contract this year and then it’s two years at 32.5 and the cap would have gone up by however much. And yeah, we’ll see. And with Ingram, I mean, the Raptors would I I guess they’d be overjoyed probably if he’s turning down his player option in year three because that means he’s probably balling out and they’re like, “Hey, remember when we believed in you, you know, hopefully the team’s good. Maybe you made an all-star game or two. You know, you want to come back here?” Something like that. But I don’t I mean this is all just projection of no idea how it’s all going to go. Any other thing you want to talk about before we get out here? By time any of you guys are watching? So the Blue Jays have triumphily won a game that I’m going to watch in 5 minutes. Um the dog is on the mound. I’m going to be putting on my jersey in a second. And like moving from summer league to like the Jays being one of the best teams that we probably seen in in our lifetime. I’m not ready to say better than 2015 just cuz they’re so iconic. But their record is better. They bang. Dude, this team is not as cool as 2015 cuz they don’t bang. Yeah. Do you know how sick it was when it was like Bautista, Donaldson, Incarnation, even Chris Collabella was on steroids to join the fun? I mean, hell yeah, dude. It’s just they had flare. You have you have Edwin with with the with the parrot Donaldson’s MVP of the league. Baptista is a a Blue Jay legend who’s still in his prime. This it isn’t necessarily the same. They’re kind of winning with like their money balling kind of their their wins, but they’re nickel and diamond. They really are. Sacrifice is the same as a home run. That’s not true at all. Uh, George Springer, he’s been awesome. Addison Barger. Yeah. Yeah, he’s amazing. There’s some ballers on the roster. All right, everybody. Uh, thank you for tuning in. We will be back myself this weekend for a a conversation with y’all. Maybe we’ll do some film. I It was funny. I said the Colin Murray Boils episode was a redemption episode because the SEC stole all the money from the video I did cuz obviously it’s their clips. Yeah. They don’t they don’t know what transformative, you know, legal copyright all they don’t know what it is. They just click take the money and then the the the mic was busted for it. I mean, I just can’t get the Colin Murray Boils film room that I want. That will be coming at some point in the future. Um, anyway, thanks everybody for listening. Myself and Trey will be back in a week hopefully with something exciting to talk about. I don’t know what it’s going to be. Looking We need some drama. Maybe we’ll do a mailbag. This would be a good time for a mailbag. It would be. Yeah, that makes sense. You can ask some mailbag questions in the comments and then I’ll send out a a feeler on Twitter. All right. Like the like the podcast, subscribe, comment, all that good stuff. It helps us out. We appreciate it. We’re looking for that that fair life. Uh please, what’s it called? When sponsorship is that brand deal? I don’t know what it is. Anyway, same thing. This is your world, not mine. I can’t, you know, you got we got to build out a pipeline to these brands. Anyway, thank you everybody for tuning in from myself and Trarevon Heath. Have a blessed day and goodbye.

Samson Folk & Trevon Heath recap summer league and discuss the latest in the Raptors realm.

0:00 – Introductions

1:00 – Tre thinks the Kings are scammers

1:58 – Samson & Tre v Gorilla

3:20 – The Raptors play style translating to the main team

8:20 – Tre wants a different starting lineup

11:40 – Raptors defensive pressure

13:15 – Where are Raptors prospects in 5 years

18:45 – You can’t be too reliant on floaters

21:33 – CMB has been fun to watch

31:28 – Ja’Kobe’s creation struggles

37:45 – Rich Paul’s comments on Ingram

48:00 – The Blue Jays are good

49:31 – Goodbyes

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