Details On Jonathan Kuminga Contract Situation With Warriors – July 30: The Insiders + D-Lo & KC
You get a belt and you get a belt. Hey, we are up in here Warren. What? What’s up, Will? What’s up, Stephen? Casey Tucker’s here. David’s here. Will Z’s in the building. Norm is here. H boy, lots going on. Joe Brazil is here. I am back. Hello. He did it. Hi, guys. Say hi to Joe. There he is. Hello, everybody. I am so happy. I’m I’m really happy to be back. How is Disneyland? Don’t answer that. Oh, Jesus Christy, man. We have a show to do. You didn’t write it on the rundown. It’s not on the run. Applied. He’s here. I should have written that’s uh What’s that say, Bo? What’s up, Tina? What’s up, man? Yeah, I have this random thing at the top of the rundown that I have no idea what it is, but it doesn’t say Joe Brazil. No, the random thing on top of the rundown is a is a great goddamn question is what it is. All right. And then Jesse, I texted that to Jesse today to because I float all my ideas to Jesse and he’s now trying to figure out who the NBA version of the NFL player I mentioned is, but we’ll get to it. All right. I’m realizing that some people don’t know what I look like. That is funny. What? Joe Joe’s been a Yeah, but I I could see it. I could see it. Especially if you just listen on the radio, you know, huh? All right. I miss Mike. The return of Joe big time. I look like your average Joe. Very similar to the return of the man from Snowy River. Honestly, you don’t look like the average Joe to me. I do get told that I have like a familiar face, so I kind of attribute that to just being like an average Joe. Here we go. I don’t think of the name Joe and think of Not anymore really. No, not not anymore. Used to be like that. behind the scenes facilities. Okay, we have some fun stuff to do today. I have a very silly question. Joe Brazil is back. He went to Disneyland and I am thrilled to ask him about Disneyland and we will get to all of that. 11:30 Matt Barrows is going to join us and he’s going to talk to us about what’s going on uh out at 49ers camp. The 49ers are off today, but I have some questions. We have some questions about some things going on out there. And of course, the San Francisco Giants lost again last night and uh I think they might need to move on from their manager, but we can talk about all that. But first, we got new reporting on Jonathan Kaminga. Oh, yeah. There’s actual like new, not news that nothing has happened. Still nothing has happened. Mhm. But I’m going to try and summarize the article that ESPN that was posted on ESPN by Sham Steria and friend of the program, Anthony Slater. So, the Warriors have offered Jonathan Gaminga two years and $45 million. But the hangup from Kaminga’s camp is that that two years $45 million includes a team option for next year and a there’s a built-in no trade clause to such a deal and the Warriors want him to wave that no trade clause. Yeah. So, we’ll start there. So, Kaminga is saying no deal because his whole thing and we’ll get to this in a second is wanting control over his career for the first time. Mhm. And by signing a two-year $45 million deal, like forget the finances for a moment. If you’re waving your no trade clause and then giving the team a team option, you’re now seeding all control of your future to them. Oh yeah. And that that may be worth more than dollars at this point to to Jonathan Kaminga. At least that’s kind of what that’s kind of what it sounds like to me. Yeah. I I mean like look, this thing is is heading towards a conclusion. At least that’s what the Warriors are trying to push right now. you can see that they’re like, “Hey, we want to end this thing now.” And it’s like, “Okay, well, that’s nice if you want to end it because I don’t have to sign a contract. Uh, I don’t have to, you know, play for the qualifying offer. I I can play for the qualifying offer, but I can accept qualifying offer a month from now.” Do you know what Jonathan Kaminga’s deadline is? October 1. Oh, yeah. That’s when he has to sign a qualifying offer. He has until October 1st. He’s not Jonathan Kaminga’s life doesn’t change. if he agrees to a deal today or figures that out on September 30th. Yeah. Like he’s chilling. Yeah, but the Warriors are on a different clock. Correct. Because of the six-month rule. Correct. And because of they want to do other moves. Well, yeah, they have other moves they want to do for sure, right? But uh yeah, this is just a a total mess. And you can see how they are pushing towards a conclusion. But that doesn’t mean there will be a conclusion because this is just one line of you know again there there are so many factions in this. There are three different groups of people and probably more like four or five because there are other teams that are interested as well. But the team that wants to get Jonathan Kaminga, Jonathan Kaminga’s camp and then the Warriors and nobody is on the same page it sounds like. And I at this point sounds like the Warriors are trying to play hard ball and say, “Yeah, we’re going to pull all this sign and trade stuff off the table.” No, you’re not. They’re definitely not. You know you’re not. So like it’s just not believable. So Kaminga’s camp offered framework of a deal. Again, this is reporting via ESPN. Mhm. Their counter offer to the Warriors was three years $82 million. So a $27.3 million average annual value. It keeps the Warriors under the second apron. I don’t know how that would be laid out and how it would affect additional moves they want to make this offseason, but that’s the counter offer. Yeah. Is 3 and 82. And the reason this is important to me is we’re now getting at least a ballpark range of kind of the the dollar figures we’re working with. Yes. Kaminga’s camp is like three and 82. Great. That gives us a really good foundation to work off of when we’re here in Sacramento talking about the Kings and what it what what a Kaminga deal would look like for them. Um, the other wrench that is now thrown into this though that had been kind of reported a little, but now we’re getting really firm reporting on this from from ESPN is that we’ve talked about the difficulties of the Warriors and Kings making this deal just from a pure financial perspective. Yep. and then figuring out what that compensation looks like for a player like Kaminga who’s ostensibly an unknown or relative unknown. Yeah. And so if you’re the Kings like what are you giving up for him and what’s So we’ll we’ll get to that in a second. But Phoenix is now in the mix. They are and they aren’t. Okay. Financially Phoenix is in the mix. Yes. They have, according to ESPN, made the most lucrative push for Kaminga. Mhm. with a deal, a four-year deal that has a player option in year four approaching $90 million. Okay. It is $70 million more. Let me nearly $70 million more guaranteed than Golden State’s offer. So, um, Phoenix is in the mix. Okay. The Kings are in the mix, I assume, financially. Yeah. Yeah. Phoenix isn’t in the mix because Phoenix doesn’t have the access to a single first round pick. So that’s the issue. Golden State here’s further reporting. Golden State is uninterested in trade offers from the Kings and Suns. And so what the reporting from ESPN is is Golden State is viewing this like, “Okay, Jonathan, here’s two years and 45 million with the no trade with the no trade clause waved and a team option in year two or you can play on the $7.9 million qualifying offer, but barring a change in offer from one of these other teams. You’re playing for us next year and we’ll kick this can down the road.” this this disaster that they they being the Warriors, Jonathan Kaminga, everybody is to blame here in my opinion. Uh they’re kicking this disaster down the road and into the regular season and just doing whatever they can to squeeze just that little just that little bit of extra value. Hey, maybe he plays really well the first half of the year and they can get something better than Devin Carter Dario Sarich in two seconds or protected first maybe. Okay, you can try it, but I don’t foresee that going well for them. No, I mean, like, look, this is why you should have taken care of this deal last year. Mhm. But you’re in wait and see mode and you’re still in wait and see mode if you’re the Golden State Warriors. Everyone in the league realistically is in wait and see mode on Jonath Jonathan Kaminga. We have no idea really what he is as a player. You can look and say, “Oh, he did this in a playoff game or or he had this stretch of games, but for every one of those, there are a bunch of stretch of games where you’re like, “Oh, boy.” Like, he’s just hit and miss. And that happens a lot with young players. But it really does feel like no one has developed over the last like five or six years in in Golden State as far as young talent. They they they’re just not developing at all. And that’s partially on the Warriors. is partially on the fact that they’re packed with Hall of Fame players or they were um and and so it just makes this really complicated assessment and if you’re a team like the Kings, you’re like, “Okay, we’ll we’ll roll the dice on him, but it’s got to be a contract that makes sense for them and you’re not going to give up a bunch because you see the leverage. There’s no leverage here.” Sure. Do the Kings want him or not? Yeah, that that’s what it’s going to come down to. So, so that’s just it is is do do you want Jonathan Kaminga or do you not? Yeah. Do you want Jonathan Kaminga, but like not really? Like we’ll take him if it’s dirt cheap and it’s an easy flyer. Okay. It doesn’t seem that it’s going that way. So, to me, if you’re Scott Perry, and again, there’s there’s two different ways this can go for Sacramento. Sacramento might want Jonathan Kaminga. like genuinely they say this is the most talented player we can possibly get. We’re looking for potential franchise building blocks, we think he is that guy. In which case, if it takes Keon Ellis to get it done, all right, then you got to do it. But if they are in the camp of, yeah, we’ll take him, but like we we really like Keon. We’re not going to give up Keon for him. like we’re gonna we have a backlog at at guard so Devin Carter can be in the deal and here’s this protected first and Dario Sar to make the money work. Yeah, here you go. Here’s this this is as much as we’ll this is as far as we’ll go. If that’s where they are then call up the Warriors and go hey we’re out like we’re done with this. Yeah. And just and just be done. Wash your hands of it. But you we know they’re not. They had a meeting with him last week. They had a meeting with Kaminga last week. So, so this is one thing that I I keep seeing out there like, oh, you know, Scott Perry’s holding the line. Oh, this is like, oh my gosh, you know, they would have already folded in the past. Mhm. Tell me when uh when Monty McNair and Wes Wilcox folded like they didn’t get deals done, right? It was the opposite. Yeah. No, they they just like said, “Okay, we’re just not going to do the deal.” They didn’t fold, right? fold would have been to throw in more picks. Fold would have been to give up way more. They didn’t fold, right? They just sat there and just didn’t get the deal done. We’re in the same exact holding pattern right now. So, like look, it it started out we heard it was Dario Sarich, uh Devin Carter, and two second round picks. Like I I’m not gonna like put words in the king’s mouth, but I would be very surprised if they weren’t willing to go up to a protected first round pick, right? And I don’t know what protected pick that would be. So like maybe they they give up, you know, that 2027 uh Spurs pick, but they protect it 8 through 15 because it’s already protected 16 through whatever. You know, maybe they do something like that. Maybe they uh they they give up it’s literally just a lottery protected or top 10 protected pick. Maybe they give up that. But like if you’re on the brink of a deal, then figure out what it is that they actually want because the the Kings don’t have the young player that is going to like move the needle unless it’s Keon Ellis. And again, I’m not giving up Keon Ellis in this deal. Like if you’re starting young, younger, if you’re looking at your team and going, “Okay, where are we two years from now?” Keon Ellis should be your starting shooting guard most likely. Like he if he wants to play for your team still. Yeah. If he still wants and that’s the other problem, right? So this is complicated, but it’s like do you need to throw in is it a a protected first and a second? What is it that you have to give up? Because figure out what that is and move forward or or don’t or you know say okay we’re done with this. And I think that’s why this is just the discussion amongst fans with it is and I’m not I don’t have the chatty house open at youtube.com/ ESPN1320 and twitch.tv/esbn1n320. Um if you’d like to catch a simcast. I think I’m sure when I said then include Keon Ellis there were people who were like absolutely not. You’d never do that. But I think there are people who go man is pretty good. But like he had average 28 or whatever it was in the in the playoffs against Minnesota. I get that talent in here. And we’re talking two years from now K’s going to be like 27 28 like Yeah. Here. And he might not even want to play here. Yeah. Sure. Send him. It’s all about how much do you value Kaminga. Yeah. And how much you value him or I value him or Joe values him or or any anybody listening to this, anybody who who who calls himself a Kings fan, that’s going to vary. But if you’re the Kings, like let’s go to put your put yourself in the Kings front office. If you’re a member of the front office, you have to you’re deciding are are we committing to this player? Because that’s that’s the other that’s the other part of this. You can’t halfass the Jonathan Kaminga thing. No, you have to kind of go for it. and and the reporting from ESPN is directly quote Kaminga prefers the longerterm offers presented by the Kings and Suns because he believes they signify a fresh start, a larger guaranteed role, a promised starting position, and a greater level of respect and career control. If you’re going to seed all of those things to Jonathan Kaminga, then go make the move. Go do go do what you have to do to get that done. And if you’re wary, then like, all right, hey, we’re out. Y we’re done with this. We don’t like if that’s that’s just it. If Scott Perry and I’m assuming it’s Scott Perry making this call. If Scott Perry’s like, “Yeah, like him, don’t love him.” Like would much prefer to have Keon and and sorted out that way then bringing Kaminga because we don’t know if he fits and we got questions and ties us up financially a little bit. It just Okay, cool. Then separate yourself from this madness. Get out. Because if the Warriors really want to get a deal done, if the Warriors really really want to get a deal done and they go, “Hey, that that two years or the qualifying offer thing was a bluff.” Uh, it didn’t work. It’s August 13th. We we need to be done with this. Then they’ll pick up the phone and call Scott Perry and go, “Hey, all right. Let’s let’s try.” And now maybe you’re getting him for the for the for the kind of pennies on the dollar that you were hoping to get him for. Well, let me add in the other problem, though. The problem is that if you do get him on that contract, you’re now way over the luxury tax and now the Kings have to unwind something else. Mhm. And number one, I I do see where the Kings can look at this like we can’t sit here and yell at the top of our lungs for a year and a half, two years that the Kings have got to get more size and athleticism at the at the three and the four when a 6’9 like super athlete is sitting there on the table. Not only that, but Kaminga slides right into starting lineup alongside Keegan Murray. It moves Keegan Murray to the three, which is a better natural position for everyone involved here. That gives him the ability to move around the court a lot better. Uh it just changes his upside. A and not only that, it it creates this young switchable forward thing, right? Mhm. The problem that you have is that you now have to get you got to go find a way to save another 10 million bucks to get below the luxury tax or at least get close to it because they’re hardcapped at at 189 million 188 whatever the first apron is. So now they have like this process that they have to go through. And I bring this up because that could also cost something. And so if you’re going out there and saying, “Okay, we now have to move move Malik Monk or we now have to move uh Demard Rosen,” there might not be a team out there that’s willing to just take those those players on without you giving up something else. And I know people are like, “Wait a sec. You’re going to give up Malik Monk and a second round pick or and two second round picks?” Yeah. That’s the way the dynamics of the league work. No one has any cap space. Yeah. So you’re going to have to give up something to get something. Mhm. And so now that has another cost at the back end. And so you’re looking at this deal as a collective deal. Like it might feel like it’s two individual transactions, but realistically it’s not. It’s all part of one bigger deal. And you have to figure out how to like, you know, it’s a it’s a minefield. Yeah. And I I don’t know how they get through it. I don’t either. We’ll continue discussing this. Would love to know your thoughts. 9169-1320 91691320. We’re we’ve talked about it ad nauseium. Should the Kings go get Jonathan Kaminga? Should they should they push their chips in for him or not? Because the Devin Carter Dario Sarge in two seconds deal clearly is not going to work. Mhm. So, do you want to go more than that or do you not? And I think that’s that’s what the question has to be. We’ll keep talking about this. We’ve got some 49er stuff coming up at 11:30 with Matt Barrows. He’s covered the team for a long time for the Athletic. Uh does a great job. I will talk to him at 11:30. Uh Joe Brazil back in the building. Uh can’t wait to get his thoughts from Disneyland. And I had a weirdass question pop into my head today that I would love to ask you, James. Uh we’re the insiders. We’re sponsored by Jify Loop. And this is ESPN 1320 Sacramento Sports. Oh, there it is. Jeez Louise, I forgot where I put the Giants thing. Oops. H Chris Aachoa’s uh angels are out here getting a bunch of relief pictures. Good for them. I will say uh I wore the Giants hat to Disneyland. Mhm. Overwhelmingly positive from the comments that I got. Like people were coming up to me and were like, “Oh, are you from that area?” yada yada. And it’s very positive. So, shout out to all the fans everywhere cuz that was cool. That was really cool to hear. Nice. Not one negative moment from that. So, nice. Unless the Suns are willing to give up young guys like Ryan Dunn and SL or Oso Igadaro, which they aren’t to my knowledge, what they have is of no interest to the Warriors. Thanks, Brian. Yeah, but like look, like if they’re willing to give up Ryan Dunn, I mean, that’s a better prospect than Devin Carter. The problem that they have is that they do not have any picks. And I I also well we’ll we’ll get to this because are we sticking on this topic for a minute? Sure. Right. Wow. H It’s funny. We uh we heard last week that the Ben Simmons sweep stakes was heading towards a finale. Yeah. Nothing has happened. That’s interesting. Oh. Um, S Kyle, what’s your top three sports movies of all time? Cremony. Um, Miracle. Miracles. One. Remember the Titans 2. Um. H I’m gonna say the natural. Okay. [Music] Um I love Eight Men Out. Haven’t seen that one. That is a great film. Um Die Hard is a baseball movie, so I’ll go with Die Hard. Happy Gilmore. Uh, Happy Gilmore is so good. If we count Happy Gilmore, it’s such a good ass movie, dude. I think I’m putting Happy Gilmore in my sports movies. My wife and I watched that the other night. She had not seen it uh either ever or hadn’t seen it since she was very young. Yeah. And man, what a great What did just This is so good. H I’ll have to think about number three. Kingpin changes. Now back to the Insiders with James Ham and Kyle Madson, brought to you by Jiffy Lube on ESPN 1320. Somebody in the chatty house, youtube.com ESPN1320 and twitch.tv espn1320. Somebody in the chatty house asked about our top three sports movies. And uh you know it’s Miracle and Remember the Titans for me. Those are two of my favorite movies of all time. But then number three is a little bit difficult because it’s just there’s so many good sports movies. But somebody in the in the chatty house mentioned the program. Oh yeah. Which is that James Khan? Yep. James Khan. Uh, I want to say Omar EPS eps. Uh, Omar eps is in it. Craig Schffer, Christy Swanson. Oh, Christy Swanson. Yep. So, incredible film. The thing about the program is that movie, watching that movie gave me the same feeling I get when there’s an obnoxious guy at a bar and he’s talking really loud and really close to you about like things that you don’t want to really hear about. You don’t really care about like like, man, I don’t care about that MMA thing. Yeah. Like I don’t And he’s just loudly talking at you about it. Yeah. Like oh my god. That’s how I felt watching that movie the whole time. It’s kind of so like uneasy. Like it’s the point of the movie. It’s great. It’s that that’s the point of the film is to make you uncomfortable. Any given Sunday. Same thing. Yes. Yeah. Same exact where I mean he’s literally yelling at Alpuccino is yelling at you the entire time. Screaming at you. Man, you are screaming at me. I feel like I’m on a football field. Yeah. Yeah. Um that’s one I need to That’s a movie I need to consume. as an adult as like a person who understands life better now. Oh, watch when I was younger. The Sandlot. Okay. I I would put Sandlot in my top three. The Sandlot place for sure. Yeah. Like the Field of Dreams is up there for me. Uh Bull Durham’s up there for me. Yeah. Field of Dreams. Just the sports movie stuff is I mean it’s all it’s it’s very rarely like an Oscarinning movie. So, it’s just how you connect to it. Yeah. I saw someone say Major League. I loved Major League. Major League. I did. Major League 2 even plays for me. He does. Corbinson at the at third base. Yeah, man. Yeah. Uh, Coach Carter, good film. Really good film. Uh, hey, Coach Carter is hilarious because that’s the first thing I ever saw Channing Tatum in. And man, if you want a fine piece of acting, go watch Channing Tatum and Coach Carter. Anyways, yeah, shout out to sports movies. Let us know your favorites. Benchwarmers is not I’m sorry. Never mind. No, I’m not. I know. Like, how do we do we put Happy Gilmore in this? Absolutely. A sports movie% It’s not even And it was amazing. Yeah. Yeah. I haven’t watched the second one yet. I’ll I’ll get to it this week. But but then but then I mean if you’re talking sports movies, then you get into like The Fighter with Christian Bale, Million-Dollar Baby with Hillary Swank. Oh yeah. Rocky Rocky. All the Rocky movies, the Creed movies. There’s a Oh, man. Now it’s getting complicated. I know it. Like right off the bat, I was just thinking baseball for the most part and then some football movies, right? Yeah. And then there’s the the the Hooers, of course. Oh yeah. Um Tallaladega Nights. Does that count? Oh man. Little baby Jesus. [Laughter] Oo. Is Tallaladega Nights a sports movie? Let us know. N take that poll today on nights a movie. Hey, underrated. Not underrated. I I’m saying underrated is a bit I don’t actually think uh have you ever heard of the Disney movie Gus about the field goal kicking donkey? Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, man. You’re in. You got to lock in on What about Airbud? Is Airbud Boy, which one? A sports movie. Airbud’s a sports movie for sure. Of course. Without question. Yep. Anyway, do you know they’re re either revamping it or doing another sequel? There’s a new Airbud movie coming out. Oh, well they just keep producing those. But but no, like like there there was Airbud one and then there was Airbud 2, uh Golden Receiver, and then I think there was Airbud 3, World Pup. I think that was it. I think it was just three. There might have been another one in there. It helps that like 80% of Golden Retrievers look identical because I have a Golden. Sure. And there’s so many that look identical. You’re like, “Oh my gosh, he looks just like my dog.” Keep cranking out air buttons. Yeah, that’s true. So, I don’t know if it’s a revamp or another new one. I hope it’s a revamp. I would be in. I’d go see it so fast. That’s James Ham. I’m Kyle Matson and Joe Brazil’s with us. We’re the insiders. We’re sponsored by Jippy Lube. Uh we were talking about Jonathan Kaminga last segment and how the Kings need to decide, do you want this guy or not? And what I mean by that is because I’m of the mind that if you’re trading for Jonathan Kaminga and signing him to a 4-year 90-ish million dollar deal Mhm. that you’re pushing pushing your eggs into the Jonathan Kaminga basket. You’re you’re now accelerating this. I mean, we’ve talked about 2027. Can you can you shorten that timeline? Yeah. And that’s what that does because you’re not getting Jonathan Kaminga and going, “Hey, okay, let’s see. How does he work in a in a pick and roll game with with Domas and how does he play next to Zack Lavine?” Like, no, it’s to hell with that. This is now you’re focused on having Jonathan Kaminga on your team and you’re committing to that and you’re committing to him playing some significant role for you. And I think if you’re going to do that, then I I don’t know that they are because they’re they’re not acting like it with the offers that that that has been presented or at least has been made public. That feels like an offer of eh, yeah, we sure well it works. They also they have the Warriors like the Warriors are in a really difficult position. They’re in a weird spot. Yeah, they have screwed this as screwed this up as about as bad as you can. Yeah, because what So, let’s just look at what the options are here. The 7.9 million he opts into his player his uh qualifying offer, right? If he does that, that means that number one, he has a full no trade clause. Yep. Built in like can’t be waved. Yeah. It’s done. He can like say yes or no to whatever trade going forward. The problem is if he does get traded, he has no Larry bird rights at all. So let’s say he gets traded to the Kings. The only real quick, sorry, real quick. Yeah. Not having his bird rights means there his earning potential is less. Oh, yeah. It’s it it’s substantially less because the only team if we get to next summer, the only team that would be able to extend him using and go over the cap to extend him would be the Golden State Warriors to resign him. Now, they could sign and trade him and try to get their leverage back, but again, now you’re dealing with like whatever it is he is at that point. Like, how much have you marginalized him during the season and and what does he look like next off season? Like, people are like, well, we kind of know a little bit more. He’s five years in now, right? You know, so you run that risk, but the other thing is he’s again, he has a full no trade clause. He can walk in and say yes or no to any deal. Yep. It takes away every bit of leverage that they have. And then, you know, the other deal that they’re offering him is a two-year deal with a team option in year two. They are signaling so hard that they have no interest in him as a player at all. They their only interest in him is as a trade ship. That’s it. And I mean, I guess if if you’re telling them, hey, the only interest we have is a trade ship, then I guess that’s fine if he’s willing to accept that. But that’s not what he wants. He wants to get his career started because for the last four years, he’s been spinning his tires waiting for them to either commit to him or not. And here we are at the end of four years, they still haven’t committed to him in any way, shape, or form. Mhm. So, I don’t blame him for saying, “Hey, like, get me out of here.” Like, I’m done. I don’t want to be here. I don’t, you know, even the money that they’re offering, the three-year uh $82 million counter offer that his people made to them, that’s so he at least has a couple of years going somewhere else to make his way. If not, man, they could destroy your value this year. You could get traded somewhere uh like midseason on this 2-year $45 million deal that we’re hearing about, right? They could trade you somewhere and it could just not work out. the team could opt out and now you’re in the same position where yeah, you made $12 million more this season or $13 million more, but you still have no bird rights going forward with anybody and you’re like, “Okay, this is miserable.” In this scenario where he signs a 2-year $45 million deal with the team option. Let’s forget the no trade clause for a second with the team option. No, we can’t forget the no trade clause. It’s been waved, too. So he takes that Warriors deal, team option, no no trade clause and he gets dealt to Charlotte. Yeah. Okay. U Charlotte while he’s there goes, “Man, this guy’s just we’re not picking up that team option. We’re just going to take the cap space and move on.” Kaminga in next off season is is he getting a mid-level? No. I if Charlotte is like no thanks on 23 millionish dollars. I don’t think that that there’s real money out there for him in that in that scenario. And if he’s coming back to Golden State and the first was it October, November, January, December, Jan, the first four months of the year, it goes like his last four years, then he’s going to get h little less than half a season. Yeah. To build value in wherever the hell they wind up sending him. like that just I I don’t the only the only wrong thought on this is that anybody has done everything right. I think Jonathan Kaminga has done some things wrong along the way. I think Golden State’s done a ton of things wrong along the way. Um but I’ll even like there’s just I’ve got a player comp and people will go, “Oh no.” Um, this it could easily go the same way that the JJ Hixon situation went where the Kings gave up a future protected first round pick to get him from the Cleveland Cavaliers. He averaged 13.8 points and 8.7 uh rebounds per game in 20101 with Cleveland. And his last like post all-star was like 18 and a half points per game. like the Kings thought they were getting like this 22year-old like crazy power forward that they were going to build around. He didn’t make it to the deadline. They actually had to wave him because it wasn’t working out so badly and they were on the hook for that first round pick forever. Here’s the other thing I I’ll point out though too. The reason why the Kings should like look at a fouryear 80 something million dollar deal here, right? Mhm. is because players at that price range get traded all the time. If you want to do a three a four-year deal with the last year being a team option, that’s fine. Like I think that that’s probably where the power is right now for most teams. It’s not a four-year deal with the last year as a player option. It’s a team option and that’s kind of where Kaminga is. But look at the Kyle Kousma trade where he’s been moved what three or four times. It’s easy to move an 18 1920 million contract to $22 million contract. It’s when you get above that when you get into John Collins range which is 26 27 million that it becomes a lot more difficult to move. So if we’re looking at it just as a pure option for you know you bring in a guy you you check him out he’s 22 years old there will always be a spot for him in the league for them to move on from him right now if they need to a year from now or two years from now if he’s not working out. But that’s like a it’s a lowrisk like potentially high reward situation that would tie you up a little bit, but also it drops your age range way down and it forces you to go move one of your other players because that’s the only way it works financially, right? And to be honest with you, forcing the Kings to make a move right now with one of their their other players is actually a really good thing. I agree because we all watched what that looked like last season and it didn’t it didn’t work. So, go ahead and like force yourself to move one of those guys. Um, but yeah, I don’t know. It’s still complicated. The the thing with let’s let’s say they deal Malik Monk and a second round pick for whatever it takes to get that deal done and clear the necessary cap space to sign Jonathan Kamingo to this contract that he wants. I would at least feel. So, it’s Malik Bunk, a second round pick. Um, and then let’s just do the Devin Carter, Dario Sarich, and and a protected first. You’re giving up all that for this for this player. And I would understand the hesitance one from people who love Malik Monk and just want him on their favorite team. Salute. Then this deal is not for you. But I think at the very least in that scenario I see the vision like okay they did something that pushes them toward uh an upward trajectory in the next couple of years. They did something that is bringing in a potential franchise building block instead of yeah we’re just going to play it out with some veterans this year and we’ll see what Nick Clifford has. We’ll see what Maxim Renault has sometimes maybe a little bit. It depends on how well we’re playing, but we’re not going to put any veterans on the bench or any of our key veterans on the bench. And we’re not going to I would so much rather go into a year where it’s like, all right, Keegan Murray’s at the three, Jonathan Kaminga is at the four, and yeah, Malik Monk’s not on the team anymore, but hey, we’re seeing what the Jonathan Kaminga experience looks like. Like that that at least gives me something to look forward to. And maybe it works, maybe it doesn’t. Again, there’s always going to be risk involved. We’ve talked about this before. There’s risk in not doing anything. There’s risk in going, nah, well, don’t want to give up a second round pick to move Malik Monk, and we don’t want to give up anything more than Devin Carter in a protected first and Dario Sarge for Jonathan Dominguez. So, we’re just going to kind of stay here and stay the course of 2027, and we’ll figure it out then. O, like you said earlier, that’s just inaction. That’s standing pat, not for the sake of we like what we’re building. If the the the Spurs standing pat and not going to get Kevin Durant, that makes sense to me. That’s a team that is beyond square one of a rebuild. They have young talent to build around and they said instead of giving up that young talent and trying to push all our chips in now in this small Kevin Durant window, we’re going to hold off and we’re going to keep building. I see why that inaction happened. That makes sense to me. inaction from the Kings in this scenario doesn’t make sense to me because it’s not servicing some greater good of hey Dylan Harper, Darren Fox, uh, Victor Webyama, and we’ll Devin Vel, and we’ll see kind of how this works. It’s, hey, we’re scared. We’re scared that it might not work. Yeah. And Okay, it might not, but neither’s this. This roster is not going to work either. No, I mean that’s why Vegas has them at 35 and a half wins right now. 35 and a half. 35 and a half is what Vegas has opening line. That’s low. Yeah. So, hey, look, I I’m going to keep saying this. If they make a move, it you have to have the corresponding move afterwards. And that’s where people are going to be like I don’t know if they’re going to be super upset, but like if I’m the Kings, uh if you’re able to pull off this trade, the first thing you do is you go to Brooklyn and see if you can get them to take not Malik Monk to see if you can get them to take Demar Rosen for Terrence man. And you know, I I’ll keep That’s like $10 million almost exactly, right? It’s it’s basically cutting your payroll by 10 million. But again, you have to look at it this way. they owe with the option year with the buyout that they’re they’re going to have to pay tomorrow next year, you owe him roughly 35 million over the next this year and next, right? Where Terrence man makes 15.5 and 16 million. So, you’re committing to more money long term, but you’re spacing it out and you’re saving yourself 10 million, but then you also go out and you get one of those defensive minded guys that this team has been begging for. He’s your small forward backup. And then you start re reconfiguring your lineup however you can. Your small and power forward backup. Kaminga, you know, like all of a sudden you have a rotation of of guys who play defense and can actually do some things. Huh? Huh? Like that that makes sense to me. That makes team building sense to me going like, eh, we’re going to hang on to our guys and see how it plays out. Yeah. Like cool. enjoy that 40-ish wins and then we’ll try it again next year. Yeah. And that’s not me making an argument that that Terrence man is a better player than than Demard Roen. He’s not. No, it’s about it’s about fit. It’s about salary. It’s about everything else. That’s it. If you don’t get that at this point that that’s what we’re talking about, I don’t know. That’s James. I’m Kyle. Uh the San Francisco Giants might be facing a disaster. It might be going that way. We’ll talk about that next. That’s James Ham. I’m Kyle Madson. That’s Joe Brazil. We’re the Insiders. We’re sponsored by Jiffy Lube with ESPN 1320 Sacramento Sports. What is going on, Chatty House? Oh, yeah. Shoot. Thank you for the reminder. Yeah. What’s crazy is there’s one team in the league that can help anybody. Yeah. It’s going to cost you. That’s That’s the tough thing. Yeah. Like I I don’t know, man. I It’s tough for sure. Like it’s tough to take a gamble on a guy, especially if it means giving up a guy like uh like Malik. But yeah, you got to find a way. That’s why, you know, we’ve said this from the beginning. Any deal is going to be extremely difficult. It’s super complicated. But there is a possibility here. And you kind of feel like the Kings have something lined up. Like if they can get the Kaminga deal done, that’s one domino in a in a row of dominoes that will like slowly play out. Domino. Domino. Domino. Domino. H. Uh, some guy responded to the poll on Twitter. Jeff Dominguez. Okay. True story. I got home late from work, turned on Tallaladega night just to kill time before bed because I wasn’t feeling too good. Then hour later ended up in the ER needing gallbladder surgery. Hate that movie. Uh it probably saved your life. Just got to be honest. The laughing. Yeah. I you know I don’t know. Tom, I don’t even know how I want to answer this poll. Is Tallaladega Nights a sports movie? It is. It absolutely is. Is NASCAR a sport? Yes. Hey, you know what? And also, I am fresh off of the Speedway on Saturday. Sure. I I want to make this clear. I’m not trying to dunk on NASCAR. I know. I got you. I just don’t when I think it’s a competition like it’s it takes talent and and uh mental toughness and physical strength and stamina like I I Crazy reflex. Yeah. Now it’s a sport. It’s a sport. We just named all the things that it takes to be a good athlete. Yeah. All right. Very good. Yeah. Yeah. Like people who say I don’t know if golf is a sport. It’s more of Golf is a sport. Oh, Golf is definitely a sport. A stick. A ball. Yeah. chaos. My youngest just just took up golf. I need to find golf clubs. If anyone has a decent set of starter golf clubs, uh I might I would Oh, yeah. I remember you mentioning that actually. Yeah. Oh, they’re used. Yeah. You want to start? I I got them for $30 on Facebook Marketplace. It’s a full set of clubs. I got them for $30 on Facebook Marketplace. They’re fine. And then Steiny, Matt Steinmets, gave me his old set of clubs like three weeks later. Oh, nice. You have two full sets of clubs. Oh, I would take them. Okay, bring them in. Yes, now back to the insiders with James Ham and Kyle Madson, brought to you by Jify Lube on ESPN 1320. James is over there. I’m Kyle. Joe Brazil’s there. Matt Baros has covered the 49ers for many, many moons. 300 years. 300 years. He’s been cover he’s covered the 49ers for a long, long time. And he’ll be joining us at 11:30 to talk about what he’s seen out at training camp. He and uh his teammate at the Athletic, Vic Tafer, did a really nice breakdown uh yesterday in the Athletic. So, go check that out. I’m excited to chat with Matt in about 45 minutes here on the Insiders. I’ve been talking about a lot about Jonathan Kaminga today. Now, I want to talk about the Giants and why they may have a little bit of a mess on their hands. Uh, but before we do that, our guy Mitch in New Jersey wants to talk about Jonathan Kamingo. So, we’re going to head out to the phones. Let’s go to the phones. 9169-1320 91691320. It’s Mitch in New Jersey. Go ahead, Mitch. Good afternoon, Kyle. James, thanks for taking my call. What’s going on, Mitch? What’s up, dog? Yeah, you were talking about movies. Um, my go-to movie is uh Bill Cop one or even White Man can’t jump. I haven’t seen Gilmore 2, so I guess that I haven’t seen GMO one. I guess I have to see that movie first. Um, oh yeah, I don’t think the Warriors have a lot of leverage with um Kaminga. So, I definitely want to give our best players or draft choices. And three guys I would love to see and get two of them. You see how the Clippers are making so many moves. Why can’t we? Russell Russell Westbrook. I did it again. Ben Simmons, but he better learn a new position in the front court. Backup of course. And Matu, love to have him back. Chzi Mu, I’d love to have him back. Mitch, I’d love to have you back. Thank you so much for calling. Chamezi Metu mention dude market. Let’s go. Shout out to Chamezi. Checks in the mail. Mezzi, let’s go. Uh, let’s get out to Joe. Uh, Joe in Elgrove. Yep. There is Joe in Elgrove. Clones. What’s up, Mr. Ham? What’s up, Joe? Why do we all Why do we always want to trade Malik Monk? I do not want to trade Malik Monk. Okay. Demar Den is going nowhere. Nobody’s taking that contract. Okay. And why do we want Jonathan Kaminga? You’re out on Kaminga. I’m out on him. Why? I’m not giving up Alice or Monk for him. Why do I want to help the Warriors out? The Warriors want Keon Alice and they say Malik Monk. I’m not giving them Monk and Alice for Jonathan Kamika. Okay, that’s fine. You don’t you don’t have to. Why are you out on Jonathan Kaminga, though? Because I don’t want to give Malik Muk and Keon Ellis up. Oh, okay. Very good. I I I get that. I get that there are going to be people out there who are looking at this and saying, I don’t want to give up this player or that player for Kaminga. Um I I personally I would not give up Keon Ellis. I just I I Yeah, but the other thing I would point out that if you look at the Kings drafts over the last like 5 years, right? Like every player that they draft is 22 23 years old. You’re basically getting a first round draft pick who averages 16 points a game almost guaranteed walking in the door who’s younger than almost every draft pick that you’ve made over the last five years. I mean, that’s where Kaminga Kamingo is so different than any other player because he has four years of of professional NBA experience and he’s younger than your your 2025 NBA draft pick. That’s so crazy, dude. And so when you’re going out and you’re you’re trying to acquire a player like this, you’re like, “Okay, look, there are certain things that we don’t like about him that he needs to work on, that he needs to get better at, but that doesn’t change the fact that he averaged 16 points a game as a 21-year-old in the NBA.” Yeah. And you can’t guarantee that any pick that you’re going to draft in the upcoming draft would actually get to that point. So, I understand the value of him. I also understand that the Warriors want a trade ship like and that’s a tough thing. The Kings don’t have unless it becomes a Demard Rozen thing where you’re trading Demard Rosen to them but then we get into the base year compensation thing right and the Warriors are going to have to send out something else as well and then it’s like okay now this has become a much bigger transaction. Um, the other thing with Kaminga, and we’ve, again, we’ve talked about this before, but this is a guy who played in game two of the playoffs 26 minutes against Houston, played 17 minutes in game three, then didn’t play for three games. Uh, in part one of those, he was inactive. He was sick. Um, so didn’t play for three games. played seven minutes in a blowout win in game seven. He played in game seven. I have no recollection of Jonathan Gabinga game seven minutes, but he didn’t play well. Um then game one against Minnesota, plays 13 minutes a game that Steph got hurt. And then he does this against Minnesota, who is a very good defensive team. He goes 18, 30, 23, and 26. just came off the bench ostensibly cold against a very good Minnesota team. Uhhuh. And scores 18 points on eight of 11, 30 points on 11 of 18, 23 points on six of 13, and 26 points on 11 of 23. It’s like that’s where that’s that’s why this is enticing and that’s why when you hear people talk about getting more the the the Warriors wanting to get more for Jonathan Kaminga, it’s like he doesn’t suck. He’s not some player who’s gone out and and scored three points a night and they’re trying to get some like No, there’s there’s reason to believe there’s upside here. Yeah. But again, and I think we talk about this with Demar Rozan all the time. I think a lot of it is fit related. If Steph Curry retired tomorrow and Draymond Green retired with him and Jimmy Butler retired with him, I think you see the Warriors conversations and feelings about Jonathan Ka probably change a lot. But Golden State is trying to build a very specific type of winner around Steph Curry, Draymond Green, and now Jimmy Butler. Yeah. Which takes a very specific type of player to do these very specific things. And Jonathan Kaminga is not that there’s room for him, but it’s as an Aaron Gordon type defender, knock down a corner three, hustle plays, play the dunker spot. You’re not going to be a primary option on most nights. And he wants to be a primary option who doesn’t want to do those things. So, the upside is there. It’s not It’s not like we’re talking about the Kings trying to go get some player that’s just been terrible for four years. Like, no, he’s not a bad player. and just what he wants and what Golden State wants are are fundamentally at odds with one another. Well, that’s that’s the the crux of this, too, is that Golden State and Kaminga are at odds with who they want him to be. Yes. When he goes somewhere else, they might not want him to be what Golden State wanted him to be. And so you go from, hey, we’re trying to force you into being an Aaron Gordon type player to, hey, we’re gonna open the door and say, like, who are you? Like, what can you be? Let we’ll give you a leash to to show us what you can be. We might pull that back here and there and say, “No, no, that’s too much.” But we also were going to allow the possibility for you to become the star that you think you are. And if you are the star that we that you think you are, then all of a sudden we stumbled onto a gold mine. Exactly. If you’re like if we’re still fighting this whole time and you’re not playing doing the basics we’re asking you to do, then we’re going to be in the same situation the Warriors are as far as like the Kings or the Suns or anyone else. But there’s potential for him to get a new opportunity, which is why the Kings pitched him an opportunity, right? Like they pitched him a different vision for himself. And it’s like, okay, like I I think I can be that guy. And like I don’t think that they’re it’s a stretch to imagine that Jonathan Kaminga could join the Sacramento Kings this season and average 22 points per game. I don’t think that’s out of the realm of possibility. I don’t know that that I mean in their current uh like way that they’re built that might be a little bit tough, but I also see an avenue where that could be the case. And I also see an avenue where he could be that type of player, but that type of player that also takes two or three less shots per game than what you’re currently starting and give those two or three shots per game to Ke Murray. And now all of a sudden you have two guys that are rising up together and becoming something or the Kings at this point they have one and he’s really being like held back as to what he can be as a player. And I would say like the Kaminga situation I really don’t think is that much different than the Ke Murray situation except for Keegan Murray has been a willing accepting uh partner with the Kangs where Kaminga is like fighting it the entire time and saying I don’t want to be that. Kagan feels probably the same exact way. I don’t want to be what they have me being right now. But I’m willing to wait it out and see what happens. Right. Um, eventually you could get to the same point with Keegan where he’s like, “Look, this is not what I signed up for.” Sure. And I I feel like you are putting me in the same situation that Kaminga is is in and Golden State where I’m just not getting the opportunity to the to be the player I think I can be. Yeah. And so it’s it’s a really interesting thing. I just think at this point Keegan has proven to be a much better team player. Yes. Than Kaminga. Yeah. And you know, so but different different skill sets with those opportunities too. I I think play plays into it a little bit. But yeah, man. I have some bad news real quick. We’ll we’ll get to the Giants thing in a little bit. I have some bad news about your golf clubs. Oh, no. I forgot that I’ve given those away already. You already gave I immediately got a text message from somebody who I have promised those clubs to was like, “What the hell?” That’s fine. It was Kenny. Oh, I rem I’m pretty sure you promised him on the air. On air. That happened. I just completely forgot. That is hilarious. He just got his his whole set of golf clubs burning a hole in my pocket, I guess. That’s funny. That’s my bad, man. Uh Facebook Marketplace if you’re looking for clubs. Get him. Where the chatty house? The chatty house. Somebody’s going to come through. Chatt house guy. Chatty house. Somebody will come through. Clubs for you. Hell yeah. Uh 916909 1320. 91691320. Matt Barrows from the Athletic going to join us for to talk 49ers in about math 34 minutes. Matt Barrows from The Athletic is going to join us. We’ll talk some 49ers training camp. We’ll keep talk talking Jonathan Kaminga. Uh but we got to get to the to the San Francisco Giants. They’re a little bit of a disaster right now and uh I think they’re heading down a very very dark path. We’ll talk about it next. That’s James. I’m Kyle. He’s Joe. Worthy insider sponsored by Jiffy Lubani, ESPN 1320 at Sacramento Sports Center. How are we doing with the poll? Oh man, it’s a personal question. Wow. 119 votes, 81.5% say Tallaladega Nights is a sports movie. It’s one of the great oneliner movies of all time. It’s really good. No, no, absolutely not. Oh, somebody asked a question earlier and I I wanted to Okay. Is there anything from stopping Kaminga from declining his qualifying offer and signing an MLE somewhere else? Uh, first of all, the qualifying offer isn’t kamingas to I mean, if he wants to sign the qualifying offer, that’s one thing. If a team extends a qualifying offer, it holds it converts a player to a restricted free agent. So, what that means is yes, he can go out and sign an MLE somewhere else, but it’s called an offer sheet. He can’t sign a standard contract. Then the Golden State Warriors would have the opportunity to match that offer sheet, which they would because the MLE is 14.1 million. And they would be like, heck yeah, we just saved a bunch of money. And now we have a player that we don’t really love, but at a 14 to 156 million salary for the next four years and they can trade him at any time. Does that make sense? Uh oh. Is that new? Yeah, he is super about to play on the qualifying offer. I would be rooting so hard for him if he does that. Well, if he does, I really I really want that to work out. You know the dead end though there it’s not good for him to play for the qualifying offer. He takes one bad step and he could never recover any of that money. Oh no, for sure. It’s it’s a it’s a it’s risky. That’s why we written for him. Wouldn’t that be great? What a story. hour number two. That’s James Ham. I’m Kyle Madson. Joe Brazil behind the glass. We are the insiders sponsored by Jiffy Lube. We’re gonna talk about the San Francisco Giants and their current meltdown in a moment, but uh Jonathan Kaminga on Instagram just posted a photo of himself sitting next to his agent um at the Houston Rockets Arena. Uh, this is I I believe this is during the playoffs and it says, “I’ll bet on myself all day.” Then tagged his agent and said, “Hash just no.” No. K. Yeah. Uh, two things on this. One, that super says I’m not signing any long-term contract with the Warriors. Uh, I will be taking the qualifying offer and I will bet on myself. Well, that and he’ll take the qualifying offer when he wants to take the qualifying offer, right? That’s one thing. And October 1st is the deadline for that. Okay. So, he could really drag this out. That’s one thing. Two, I feel like in the current environment, saying, “I’ll bet on myself,” is not that good of a thing to say. Yeah. I think we need a new phrase. Yeah. Until we’re done having athletes literally getting caught betting on themselves or against themselves, I think we need to find something different to say. What if I believe in myself all day? All right, bet. So, yeah, I’m betting on myself all day. # prize pickics # underdog. That’s not betting. That’s daily fantasy. That’s not betting. It’s a skill game. Very different. Very different. Oh man, this is just Yeah. We uh Miss Mack brings this up. Yeah, we are at the at the point in the program. Oh, where Yeah, we got Insta posting. I bet he’s unfollowed Steph Curry on Instagram. Do we think Jonathan Kaminga still follows Steph Curry on Instagram? Oh, no. I can’t confirm that he that he has followed Steph Curry on Instagram. But if he’s not following him, we’re going to say that he unfollowed. Oh, Jonathan Kamingga. There he is. This is turning into Okay, hang on. Apparently, his agent reposted it. What did his agent say? Legends never die is what his agent said. Oh, wow. That’s just incredible stuff. Um, hey, what’s happening here? What’s going on in this photo? What is Okay, maybe they shouldn’t trade for him. I’m out on Jonathan Kaminga. Are those If you’re listening on the radio, he has a photo uh captioned hats low, standards high, which is super a thing I would have posted as a 22-year-old. So, that that makes sense. Uh he’s in a white buttonup uh with only about half the buttons done. Salute. I’m down with that. Three button maximum. What’s up? But then it’s like bellbottom dress pants. Three button. It’s like bell-bottom dress pants and a bedazzled belt and a cowboy hat with rhinestones on it. Oh no. Yikes. I’ve never been to Jonathan Kamega’s Instagram page before, so I don’t know. Let’s see. Is he still following Stephen Curry? Survey says he is. All right. Is he following the Warriors? That’ll be key. Oh, man. He’s still following He’s still following the Warriors. We have We have reached Instagram posting. We haven’t reached passive aggressive Instagram uh following or unfollowing yet in the Jonathan Kaminga saga. I I don’t know what’s happening with this outfit. I gota be It’s insane, right? It’s insane. It’s not I don’t mind the shirt because like I said, three button maximum. That’s fine. I don’t even really mind the hat. No, if you’re gonna go cowboy hat, it’s it’s got rhinestones, but like around the He has another picture of him wearing the cowboy hat, which is perfectly fine. All right, so he’s a big cowboy hat, guys. Salute. Fine with that. Yeah, it’s the bellbottom dress pant things that I’m having a tough time with. Yeah, they’re kind of strange. I don’t know what’s happening there. I I don’t either. He re I’m asking Damian and Kenny about this because I feel like they are much more qualified to talk about fashion than either you or I. That’s going to be the topic of the uh the handoff. Yeah, buckle up. DL and Casey, if you’re listening, check out Jonathan Kabinga’s Instagram and find the bell bottoms. We got to talk about it. Uh the San Francisco Giants, that’s James Hamz. Joe Brazil’s over there. We’re the insider sponsored by Jiffy Lube. I think the Giants might kind of be cooked. Yeah. So, they lost again last night. They lost to the Pittsburgh Pirates, who are not a good team. They’re now 13 and 23 since Raphael Devers debuted and which is the worst record in the MLB. Thank you, Joe. Worst record in MLB in that span. Uh, and then you’ve got Bob Melvin, who I believe has lost the locker room for the Giants. Here he is last night talking after the game audio courtesy of uh the radio home of the Giants. Here’s Bob Melvin talking about Let me make sure everything’s turned up here. Okay, we’re good. The question is included. And this answer to me sounds like a defeated manager. Do you feel the need to address the team of laws tonight? We’ve addressed We’ve had meetings, we had team meetings, we’ve had all kinds of meetings. It’s going on out there and fighting a little harder and winning a game and having a little bit more resolve, which we’ve shown this year. We just have not done it here recently. We’ve had all types of meetings. We’ve had player meetings, team meetings, all types of meetings. It’s just about showing more resolve. Like showing more resolve and trying harder. Like, brother, that’s you. That’s your job. If you’ve got if you’ve got Elliot Ramos not knowing the infield fly rule and running into outs because of it. If you have a group of players that you think are not trying hard enough, like that’s is that not where we talk about in any sport, NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL. Like, hey, that team quit. Yeah, it’s tough. It’s an effort problem. I love Bob Melvin, man. I know you. Yes, but everybody loves Bob Melvin and I think that’s why he gets so much leash and so much benefit of the doubt because like ah, you know what? He’s a good guy, though. Yeah. Yeah. I I don’t know what to say. That really does um like like we went through this last season, right? Yeah. With Mike Brown. Yeah. With Mike Brown and with the Kings, there were players only mo meetings. Mhm. There were coaches meetings. There were uh starter the starters only meeting. You remember that one with that was under uh Doug Christie where he pulled the starters into a room and lambasted them. Yep. I mean crazy that an NBA head coach would would choose to go that route and but hey much needed. I’m not saying but like good for Doug for trying something new. But like the meetings they last like two games. You get like a bounce for like two or three games sometimes. Sometimes. And then a lot of times it’s like the complete opposite. It’s like, “Oh, that was it. We’re done.” Was it the final press conference for Mike where he did the thing with the with the mic cord and made it a circle and is like, “My headphones are stuck.” I was trying to make it. Yes. I’m almost positive it was where either you’re in or you’re out. I literally my headphones are fully stuck under my chair. I have no slack in my headphones right now. There we go. Okay, we’re back. We’re back. Where he made he picked up the mic cord and he made a circle like a better chord than my head. And he’s like, this is not a circle. This is like a a NASCAR track. There you go. Uh and he’s like, you have to be you have to be two feet in. You can’t be one foot in like Yeah. That to me is about is the same thing as being like, yeah, we just need to show more resolve and try harder. Well, he also lambasted De’Arren Fox for making a foul at the end of the game that cost him the game against the win against Detroit. No doubt. Then Dear got him fired. That’s what everybody said. Yeah. And then the next day we have the video of him going over and Right. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But that that answer to me screams manager that doesn’t have answer. And it’s not totally on Bow Mill. And Joe, if you disagree with any of this, let me know. But when I watch the Giants, I don’t watch a team where I’m like, man, there’s just so there’s six allstars on this team. There’s not getting enough out of them. No, I think they just I just don’t think they have the dudes. No, you’re right. I mean, it’s time to move on from some guys. Um there’s We have a lot of fan favorites that have stuck around a little bit too long now, I think. M um and it’s hindering us greatly. Um in Bob Melvin is included in that conversation as well. I was aiming a little more towards players when I said that, but obviously he’s part of that as well. Yeah. Um I know that there’s a ton of problems with the hitting coach. Um and I know that it seems like the players don’t trust the third base coach anymore, which is that’s really tough. He’s run into a bunch of Yeah, he he has. So now you’re starting to see guys run through his signs. Um, and you know, I don’t know if you’ve seen the situations we’ve had with Ramos and Jung Hulu Lee in the outfield. They are completely clashing. They are clashing now at this point. Yeah. Um, and we look completely lost on the base path. So this is boiling down to a managorial issue. No doubt. Uh, there’s no two ways about that. And we do need more from the guys. We do, but we don’t really have much to get out of them. And that’s everything you just said. The third base coach, the manager can fix that. Exactly. Real quick. Mhm. Uh the not knowing what to do on the bases, lack of communication, like these are all things to me that come down to a manager. It they are absolutely. We’re doing a lot of the mental things wrong now. Um, and and I don’t think the GI and like I like I said, I don’t think that this is a San Francisco Giants roster. There should be 20 games over 500 right now or anything. No, they’re right at 500. That would be the point I’d make. They’re they’re much better. Like the A’s are 47 and 63. They were 10 games over 500 when Raphael Devers debuted. Yeah. And it was like, this is the bat they need. This is it. Like they finally got some pop in the middle of their lineup. Here we go. Is he going to DH play first base? I don’t know. We’ll figure that out. He’s happy to be here. D. That was supposed to be the like taking off point. We saw I I heard segments of I heard full radio segments in San Francisco about how like Buster Posey says it’s go time. Yeah. Like that was a whole thing. And the guys in the locker room when Buster says it’s go time. It’s go time. Okay. And they face planning since. And and to to me this isn’t they’ve lost a couple. This is Oh, there’s there’s something wrong here that goes beyond all of the things Joe laid out. And real quick, I do want to say I don’t think Devers is the problem. I really don’t. I don’t either. Um I am starting to already see people on the internet turn on him. Uh that is the internet. But and obviously the record is it’s bad. It’s undeniable what’s happened since he’s got here. Um, but I do want to be fully on record with I am against the Devers hate and I do not think he is the problem at all. No, I think that’s I think that’s an important point. I bring up Raphael Devers because that was supposed to be the turning point for the Giants in the other direction. Exactly. It’s like that was supposed to be that Raphael Devers did not make them a worse team. But I think that there’s been a collective uh trickle down effect that starts with to me Bob Melvin not being effective at his job. I mean, it sucks. I love the guy. Everybody I know who knows him adores him. Yeah. But I’m sorry. Being an 80- win baseball team does not You can’t be a good guy and just especially where we’re at. Especially because they’ve had this same It seems like the Giants have been in the exact same spot for five years. Yeah. We’ve had this same conversation about him. You’re just mediocre. Yeah. Yeah. And I know they just extended him and there’s this whole they just extended Bob Melvin and there’s this whole thing like look I I I think you really run the risk of driving this thing all the way into the ground. And this isn’t even necessarily about this year but let’s say you do play out this year and you do win 80 games and just like man it just just didn’t and then you got to go into next year and feel inspired. I don’t Well, that’s where you have to make changes. Yeah, you have to make change whether it’s like again Bob Melvin or it’s you got to make changes somewhere else. Like you’ve got to you’ve got to get rid of a lot of the the older uh the players that just aren’t effective anymore and just move on. Like what Joe said, the fan favorites and stuff. I think it’s interesting watching him because like look, I thought that Mark Oday uh for the for the A’s when the A’s lost what was it 20 out of 21. I thought there are plenty of times that he was to blame for games. Totally. I was watching I was like, “Oh, this is not good.” I mean, you’re not pulling pitchers. You’re You’re pulling pitchers too quick. You’re not You’re putting guys in the lineup that you’re like, why why are you putting that guy in the lineup again? See, like he’s grasping his trust. Yeah. Even like late inning stuff, you’re like, hey, you know, you got you’re down three to one. You got two guys on base and you’re letting that guy up go up for your your final at bat. No, that’s not the way it goes. Yeah. So, I thought that there was a bunch of mistakes, but then you get to the point where they are now where it’s like, okay, this team is fun. They’re cooking. The problem that they have is that they don’t have enough pitching and everyone can see it. It’s like you can’t address that right now. I mean, the Detroit deadline is what? Tomorrow. Um, but you’re not going to be able to address the real root of what the the problem is there. But like watching the two teams, one team is just like abysmal at 500 and the other one is like fun and hey, this is cool and they’re 16 games under 500. Yeah. And so I I think at some point we got to pull back a little bit and look at the perspective of what’s happening. And if guys are making like literally bonehead mistakes on the base pads or in the outfield, like you got to be better. You’ve been playing baseball since you were a kid. Yeah. You can’t do those things. Not knowing the infield fly rules. the mistakes are starting to snowball, which is terrifying. It seems like the guys are not even trusting themselves. Also, real quick, uh, whatever they’re doing with Jung Hu Lee right now and, uh, trying to tweak his approach in the batters box is completely destroying him as a player. Um, he is he looks like a shell of what I got from even his first uh, last season before he got injured. Yeah. and a little bit this year at the beginning when he started off hot. Uh his eye had was amazing but now it I don’t know what they’re asking him to do. Are they asking him to barrel it more or swing harder or something? But he is swinging at everything and it is ruining him. So and that’s obviously as you mentioned a managorial issue. So yeah, at least it’s it at least it starts there. 232 team batting average. He hit a buck 43 in June. He’s up to 293 in July, but he in June, 231 in May. His approach has changed drastically, though, and that scares me. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. It’s just not a good spot to be in, man. No. Team just fell to 500 and you’ve got your manager going, “We’ve tried meetings. I don’t know.” Like, I got nothing. Like, all right, man. It’s uh not my favorite thing. No. Rooting for Bob Melvin to figure it out. Yeah. We’ll see. Anyways, that’s James Ham. I’m Kyle Madson. That’s Joe Brazil. Matt Barrows covered the 49ers for many, many years. He’s going to join us in about 15 minutes here on the Insider, sponsored by Jiffy Lube. Uh, I had a weird question that uh popped into my head today. Mhm. Because I heard this player’s name mentioned. Okay. And I want to run this question by you and then I got a couple of of questions off of that because I think there’s an NFL player who has had a more impressive career than LeBron James. And I’ll tell you who it is next. That’s James Ham. Kyle Matson. He’s Joe Brazil. Uh, we’re the insiders. Sponsored by Jiffy Lub on ESPN 1320 in Sacramento Sports Leader. I’ll be right back. Sweet. Said that so aggressively. I’ll be right back. Everyone, just calm down. Hey, did you see this? No. Uh, Sir Anthony Dominguez pitched for the Royals in game one of their double header and he got traded to the Blue Jays between games and pitched for the Blue Jays in the second game of the double header. Oh, it’s like the Joel Young Bloodood thing. We talked about this. Is that the catcher? Joel Young Bloodood was a like a utility infielder who played for the Expos and Yeah, he was a Giant. He played for two teams on one day. in one day. Was it Was that the dude that the game was delayed and then he was traded? He was traded and then showed up at he flew to the other park and they were able to get him in the game late. Gotcha. Gotcha. Yeah, that was many, many, many years ago. They had a I think it’s a 82 fleer card with him in both uniforms. former Major League Baseball player. Uh he played for the Mets in a victory over the Cubs and then he was traded to the Expose during the game. Flies to Philadelphia and singles for Montreal to become the first player to have a hit for two different teams on the same day. That’s got to be an 83 fleer. What’s happening, chatty house? Everyone doing all right? Strictly Kevin, have we talked about Kaminga? Yeah, we talked about Kaminga for like an hour plus. Sorry. We do have a segment already up on our YouTube as well, Kevin, if you want to go check it out. Uh, it’s our first segment where we talked about Kaminga. Um, Norm, what’s my favorite burger spot in Auburn? Dang. Um, it used to be Tap and Vine, but Tap and Vine is now gone. Tap and Vine sounds like my kind of place. Yeah. Uh, have you had IKEA? They they got burgers there, right? Oh, yeah. Yeah, that’s supposed to be a great burger spot. That’s over on Force Hill, the like the other side. Um, man, I I did go to Burgers and Cream the other day. I had to get a car smog, so I walked across the street while the car was getting smoged. It’s solid. There used to be a place called Grumpy Burger, which is no longer around. The L House has a good burger. The only problem I’ve ever had with Ale House is it’s really, really loud. Oh, 10 seconds, Kyle. Now, back to The Insiders with James Ham and Kyle Madson, brought to you by Jify Lube on ESPN 1320. I got the same question. What’ you say? Burgers and what? Burgers and cream. Isn’t that like the uh the 49ers uniform? Heritage cream. Heritage. Goodness me, it’s crazy. Um he’s James M. Kyle. Joe Brazil is over yonder. Matt Baros from The Athletic going to join us in 10 minutes. We’ll get his notes from the first week of 49ers training camp. Um, got to ask him about the rookie class. Got a bunch of stuff we can we can talk to Matt about. That’ll be a really fun conversation. Again, that’s coming up in about 10 minutes here on ESPN 1320, Sacramento Sports. So, I I just want to I I I’m going to ask this. Uh oh. And I and I let me make sure I have my proper uh information up here because I heard this name today. Are you familiar with Mercedes Lewis? Of course. Uh longtime Jacksonville Jaguars tendon, first round pick in 2006. UCLA. Uh yes, I believe. Okay. Yeah. UCLA guy. Yep. Uh 40 now 41 years old. Played in 17 games for the Chicago Bears last year. Yeah, it’s just wild. I heard his name today and I kind of wonder is his career more impressive than LeBron’s? And I don’t I don’t mean that for like LeBron is is arguably the best basketball player of all time. Mercedes Lewis is not even he’s a one-time Pro Bowler. This is not to say is Mercedes Lewis better than his sport than LeBron is a basketball. That is not a conversation. I would never entertain that. Okay. But when you consider and and LeBron has had an unbelievable career. I I I’m not trying this is not to slight LeBron. This is about Mercedes Lewis. LeBron to me has had the most impressive NBA career of all time. He was 40 last year and averaged 258 and eight in real minutes. Like he is a a a phenomenal player who’s who’s had the most impressive career I’ve ever seen. But then you go to Mercedes Lewis who played 19 NFL seasons in the modern NFL, 285 games played. He is the active leader in games played since 2020 at age 36. That’s when he was 36. He missed two games that year. The last time he missed it, that was the last time he missed a game. The year before, the time he missed before that, he missed six games in 2016. He missed half a season in 2014. He missed five games in 2013. Uh but prior to that, in 2011, he missed one game. 2009, he missed one game. 2006, he missed one game. Like, he doesn’t miss a ton of time. No, he’s played 19 years at tight end in the NFL. Is he playing a 20th season? Uh, I don’t know. It’ll be a thing when he retires, and I don’t think he’s retired. Okay. But when you go look at leaders in games played, he’s 19th all time. I’m going to remove punters and quarterbacks because I think it’s easier to have longevity at those positions. The only players, non-quarterbacks, non- punters, non-kickers with more games played in NFL history than Mercedes Lewis are Bruce Matthews, offensive lineman, Hall of Fame offensive lineman for the Oilers, who played from 1983 to 2001. Yep. Um, where is he? Jerry Rice, who of course played 303 games. Ah, that’s so many. So crazy. And I guess no, George Bland doesn’t get to play. He’s not in there. He was a quarterback and kicker. Yeah. But he was a kicker forever. Yeah. Forever. Yeah. Jerry Rice and Bruce Matthew. There’s two players in NFL history who have played more games than Mercedes Lewis. And Mercedes Lewis is ostensibly playing a position where he’s playing offensive line and also catching passes. I don’t know if you disagree that it’s a more impressive career than LeBron James. I’m not going to to really uh argue because LeBron’s played going into year 23 in the NBA. Yep. and the physical toll that that takes on on a player’s body is is unbelievable. But I just wanted to shout out Mercedes Lewis because I heard that name today on a on a on a on a podcast I was listening to. I was like, man, we’re still talking about Mercedes Lewis in 2025 and the guy got drafted in 2006. I know when he makes a play, you’re like, wait, he’s still in the league? Yes. He just every year since 2014, Mercedes Lewis has just popped up somewhere. Yeah. like you just I’m just hanging out and then it’s like oh Mercedes Lewis still in the league. Sick. That’s just been he’s been I was 16 years old when Mercedes Lewis made his NFL debut. If you were born the day Mercedes Lewis made his NFL debut, you’re turning 19 years old this year. Oh, that’s wild. That’s insane. Yeah. I I mean it’s crazy. I think he and he’s just around. I believe he’s still on Is he on the Bears or the Bears? Although they did pick up another tight end, right? Yeah, they Well, they drafted Coloulston Love. Yeah. Uh, hang on. Um, I I gotta confirm this real quick. Mercedes Lewis is No. What’s the alphabet? Not on the Bears anymore. I believe he’s a free agent. Okay. Unless he’s hurt. He’s not hurt. Okay. So, it doesn’t sound like he’s going to play a 20th year. Wow. I just wanted to salute Mercedes Lewis because he’s been around forever and played 17 games last year as a 40year-old at tight end. That’s incredible. That’s crazy. It’s in the conversation for me with LeBron. It definitely is one of the most impressive for the NFL by NFL standards. Like it’s that’s pretty that’s pretty crazy. Yeah. It’s just like he didn’t have at age 36 didn’t have a significant injury that he’s like, “All right, I’m done.” and he hasn’t been unvaluable to teams where they’re not having him on their rosters. That’s just amazing. I don’t know that we’ll ever see anything like that ever again. It does look like he’s trying to play a 20th season. Like he said, “This is going to be my last year.” Is he on a team though? I I don’t know. Yeah, Ton’s got to tune to sign him. Niners’s got to sign him just for the bit. Yeah. George KD, for example, has feels like he’s been around forever. Mhm. He would need to play 11 more years this year and then 10 more seasons to get to where Mercedes Lewis is. It’s unbelievable. That’s really crazy. It’s unbelievable. Well, he came in the league as a 24 year old. Yeah, man. And he’s still kicking. Oh, that’s crazy. What a beast. Yep. Hell yeah. Mercedes. Every Jaguars tight end, I was talking to Jesse about this. Every Jaguars tight end is Mercedes loose. That’s just facts. You played tight end for the Jaguars. Your Mercedes loves. Yeah. I can’t even remember a really a different tight end there. Uh I know Luke Ferrell played there. Oh yeah, because he’s now in the 49ers. Yeah. Uh there was a guy uh Evan Ingram was there. Uh uh Matt Shaughnessy. No, that was a Raiders guy. I feel like Dan Shaughnessy. No, that’s a writer. I don’t know. Strange. I think Brenton Strange is there. I think Adonis Hasslam is the Mercedes Lewis of Yes, that’s who it is. It’s Udonis Hasslam. Like almost exact. Yeah. Yeah. Because I don’t think that um the other guy who played forever is Kevin Willis. And I don’t think that uh Mercedes Lewis has reached the the level of player that Kevin Willis was in his prime. Yeah. And that’s just it is like is Vince Carter obviously stuck around forever, but Vince Carter was a far better player. Yeah. Then like like I said, Mercedes is not going to the Hall of Fame or anything. No, he’s been to the Pro Bowl once. He’s been a serviceable player for a long time. I was trying to think if there’s an active player that fits that. Kevin Willis played in the 2006 2007 season after being retired in the 0506 season. He played five games for the Dallas Mavericks at age 44. Holy smokes. Yeah, that’s a shout out to Kevin Wallace. Yeah, he gets to join the conversation. I think it did. Is it Robert Parish that played forever as well? Uh, yes. Yeah, he played from 1977 to 1997. Goodness me. Yeah. So, he was a 43 year old. He played 43 games as a 43 year old. Man, is there an active Is there an active NBA Mercedes Lewis? We got to go. Guy who who’s been around forever? Uh, good player, not great. Still still hanging around. I wanted to say Garrett Temple, but Garrett Temple didn’t play uh like he took him forever to make the league. Garrett Temple’s a great comp, though. Yeah. All right. Boy, that’s tough. There’s no comp for this guy. No. Covers the 49ers for the Athletic. Uh, he’s an author of Muddy the Water, a genuinely good book. I had a I had a genuinely a a really really good time reading Muddy the Water. Go get it wherever you get your finest books. Matt Baros joining us now on the insiders. What’s going on, Matt? Did you enjoy it, Kyle? because uh I I see a very um snide um comment on uh Amazon.com from a Kyle Madson maybe where he he suggests that perhaps it was my co-author that did all of the great writing and that I was just along for the ride. How dare you? I would never. How dare you? I would never. First of all, I’m gonna find this Kyle Madson. I’m gonna stick my finger in his chest and Matt, just for you, I’m gonna give him the who’s who. I’ll give him the what’s what. And I’ll even give him the what for. I’ll do that just for you. Thank you. I really um I I’d appreciate that if if you maybe set the record straight. Um I was the brainchild of the operation. It’s b it’s loose based it’s basically loosed on basically loos it’s loosely based on my on my life me short of me killing a bunch of people we’re going to need to talk to you about all the people that might that might be happening that might be happening soon stay tuned is is all I can say you’re telegraphing Muddy water too the reckoning it’s a future biography it’s a great title That is a great title. Uh really really good book. Really enjoyed it and uh enjoyed it almost as much as I’ve enjoyed all your work covering the 49ers for uh for the athletic. Um and of course the Sacramento be before that. Salute to the B. Um I feel like at Niners training camp there hasn’t been a lot of Brock Party stuff. Just we hear how he did in a day. It hasn’t been anything spectacular. It hasn’t felt like it’s been anything catastrophic. Do you feel like that’s a good or bad thing at this point? Well, he missed one day for the birth of his daughter. So, um there was a there there was one Brock Purdy list practice, but um to me the the story of training camp so far has been that the defense looks good or at least looks really energetic and looks Robert Salah like I I would think that Salah has to be and he’s never going to admit to being happy with with practices. there’s always something to work on, but I think that the um the atmosphere, like I said, the energy level, the aggression is where you want it. Um I think that two of the best players in training camp have been defensive players, and that’s Nick Bosa and D. Winters, um which I think a lot of people on the on the team love to see. D Winters is um in line at least to take over that Dre Green Law role. So, you want somebody who’s active, who’s aggressive. And the other part is that um Brock Birdie hasn’t had four out of his top five receivers for big chunks of camp. And now we’re talking Brandon Aayuk, Jawan Jennings, Ricky Pearl came back the other day. He’s he’s not even close to being full go yet. Um and um Jacob Cowing would be number five. He had a really good off season back in the spring. did a lot of work with Perie in Pearl in in um in Florida and in their native Arizona as well. He was somebody that was coming on and sort of in in in a in a place where he could take over a bigger role and now he’s sort of um on the sideline, probably won’t be back until mid August or so. So, um you know, he’s thrown to a lot of young inexperienced uh receivers or or guys who just arrived in camp. You know, Matt, the receiving room is it looks like it’s a huge problem for this team. Well, just just where are you with the level of concern uh whether it’s for Jennings or, you know, whether Aayuk will ever be back or whether any of these these other guys can step up and actually be functional and be part of what’s going on for this season. Yeah, I agree. It’s it’s the position of of biggest concern right now because of everything I just mentioned. And one of the things I didn’t mention is that Demarcus Robinson, um, who’s looked good and and who, uh, M. Jones and and Brock Perie throw to a lot, um, probably is going to be suspended for x amount of games to begin the season. So, you’re looking at a scenario where at best it’s Jawan Jennings, Ricky Pierol, and you’re looking for somebody to kind of step up there um into that third, fourth, even the fifth role for that opener September 7 in Seattle. So, um there are some guys who are competing. Um you know, Jordan Watkins looks better than um you would expect for a uh a rookie receiver. Um, uh, Russell Gage is a name that probably not a lot of 49ers fans are, uh, familiar with, but, among the veterans, he’s he’s stood out as well. Um, those two guys to me are have have stood out more than any others from that pack of guys who are sort of competing for um, playing time um, and important playing time to to begin the season. Talking with Matt Barrows, covers the 49ers for the athletic. You mentioned D. Winters earlier. That was a player going in that I thought might just kind of be playing for a roster spot at this point. Is the starting well linebacker spot his to lose now given how well he’s played? I I agree with you. I thought that um he didn’t he wasn’t consistent last year. I think think that they were waiting for him to kind of take over from Devandre Campbell who was terrible. Um but uh Winters never could because he could never string together enough day uh games where he was healthy enough to do that. And so he he’d been a disappointment over his uh first two years, no doubt about it. And then they use a third round pick, early third round pick on on Nick Martin, a um prototypical weak side linebacker. And you thought, okay, the the handwriting’s on the wall for for for D Winters. And then he comes back and he’s the best player in the spring. Um and he’s been one of the best players in the summer so far, too. And sort of the question going into the summer was, okay, this the spring is fine, but that’s sort of like a passing camp. And so guys who who are fast like Winters, um, you know, it’s not going to be a lot of running plays, you’re not going to get suckered by play action. He’s going to do he’s going to do well in the spring practices. In the summer, you know, running plays go on, more pads, more hitting. How is a finesse quote unquote finesse player going to do? He’s done really well. Um he’s he’s he’s looked good against the run. He’s looked good against the pass. He’s he’s looked good. Uh so yeah, I think at this point it’s a a pretty clear uh line between him and and Nick Martin with everything else. He just has to stay healthy and um I I think if he does, then the job is his. You are listening to the insiders here on ESPN 1320. Joining us today, Matt Barrows from the Athletic. Matt, um we do have a kicker battle. Where are we at with this kicker battle? because uh to me um watching Jake Moody finish out the year last year was tough. Uh Greg Joseph is in camp. Um do you have any update? Do you have any idea who’s going to win this? Yeah, not a lot of Jake Moody jerseys being sold in the uh in the in the Bay Area in Northern California, I wouldn’t think. Um right well right now they’re they’re locked. It’s um we we’ve been charting the the field goals and the 49ers are trying to make this as intense uh competition as possible when these guys kick. Um you know, Kyle Shanahan is out there. You know, arms folded, he’s watching from a short ways away. John Lynch, Nick Bosa, uh Fred Warner, everybody’s watching. So, they’re trying to crank up the intensity of it and they’re making these guys kick back and forth. So, um, Greg Joseph will attempt a kick and then immediately, um, Moody will attempt one from the same spot. So, um, so far both are 14 of 16, um, on those. So, um, they’re they’re they’re locked in. It’s a tie right now. I to me I I feel like preseason games, everybody kind of slusts them off as unimportant, but this will be a good a good test of that. Um, the final preseason game is in Las Vegas. If you remember, Jake Moody was 0 for two in the preeason, uh, his rookie year in Vegas to to begin. I think that was the first game of the preseason. And then in the Super Bowl, of course, he he was brilliant as a as a field goal kicker, but missed an extra point in a game that went to overtime. Um, so that it could come down to to Vegas. Um maybe it’s a reason to still be watching late in the fourth quarter of the third preseason game in u in Las Vegas there. So um I think that I think that the preseason games are going to go a long way towards dictating who wins. Talking about Matt Barrows of the Athletic covers the 49ers there. Matt, real quick. Uh first of all, I’m locked into the fourth quarter of those preseason games because I’m trying to figure out practice squad offensive linemen. All right. Love it. You can watch the kickers. I’m gonna be finding out what Austin Pleasants is up to. Um, real quick though, speaking of offensive lineman, do our guy Alfonso in the in the chat here asked a good question. Do you feel like that we’ve heard a lot of Nick Bosa looks great, Trent Williams looks washed. Um, do do you get that that kind of vibe? Like, how’s that how’s that head-to-head battle been going? Uh, it’s been pretty um uh one-sided towards Bosa. We haven’t we haven’t seen a ton of it. Um, that’s one of the reasons why Brock Perie has quote unquote struggled. He’s had to deal with Nick Bosa. There was a practice, I guess it was, um, Monday’s practice and they were doing a move the ball period. So, you know, as close to real football as you can get. And Bosa just kept beating Trent Williams. and Williams came came off the field um at one point and kind of slapped his thigh and you could tell that he was frustrated with with everything. Um to me I I sort of saw that as positive. I I think that that um you know Trent Williams hasn’t always been somebody that um how do I put this delicately? Um you know he can sort of rest on his laurels. Um he didn’t he wasn’t in training camp last year. Um, but I just feel like that that I hate to go to the iron sharpens iron cliche, but I mean I feel like that’s gonna happen throughout August this year is that Williams is going to get so peed off at losing to Bossha that he’s going to be on his game and that both guys are going to be better for it by the time they go up to Seattle in in early September. Brick by brick. I’m hearing you just got you just got to keep stacking days is is what that’s Matt Barrows. He covers the 49ers over the over at the athletic uh one of the legends doing it. Matt, we really appreciate your time, man. Thank you so much. Thanks for having me on and um thanks for reading the book, Kyle. I I do appreciate that. I’ll go I’ll go find the other guy and have him amend his his review is your book. What a joke. Appreciate you, Matt. See you, buddy. It’s Matt Barrows. Uh Muddy the Water, legitimately good book. Uh, now that Matt is not in the stream, I’m telling everybody it’s really good. Go check it out. Easy read. Yeah, get it wherever you get your books. I need a book. I’m going to pick pick it up. I will bring I will bring my copy for you. Okay. I’m just going to need it back cuz I’m I’m weird like that. But you can have my copy. That’s fine. You can borrow my copy. Yeah, since you can’t have my copy. You didn’t already lend it out to Speaking of Kenny DL and Casey coming in next for the handoff. That’s James and Kyle. Joe Brazil’s over there. Insiders Jiffy Lube. ESPN 13. Oh boy. Former NBA star Gilbert Arenas and suspected Israeli crime figure were arrested today on federal indict on a federal indictment alleging they operated illegal gambling business in which highstakes poker games were played at inino mansion arena’s owns. Oh, wait. And suspected Israeli crime figure. Uh, no. Joe, leave it rolling and he can just send it to me. Yeah, me neither. Yeah, me neither. Um, yeah, but definitely just keep rolling. Yep. But also send me man. Um, send me our one as well. Yes. Okay, perfect. Yeah, do that. Hey, Damian Barling. Hey, man. Mic on. Mute. My bad. We are all going. Uh I had a I I’m trying something different today because obviously this setup is a little bit different. Um and how we’re doing this. I pulled your wine bottles out. Okay. So, it should be easier to just slide over to where you need them to be. Oh, very nice. Thank you. Yeah, it’s very good. So, just I wanted you in case you were looking like where the hell did my wine go? It’s right here. I appreciate. Thank you. I see it. That was beautiful. Thanks. Terrific. I appreciate it. Um I added you to the rundown. I don’t Did you see that? Uh no. Okay. So you Yeah, obviously you don’t have to do anything with it now. Um but I uh I added you to the show rundown just so you can see what I lay out. Okay. In advance. And Sure. this this but but you don’t have to like this doesn’t have to have anything to do with what you do right here but if you want it to it’s it’s there. Okay, great. Excellent. show. He’s got a 15. That’s so That’s so nuts. What’s up, Joe? What’s up, dude? Did you have a good time? I had such a great time and I have to say I cannot thank you guys enough for first of all hooking us up with everything we needed to know and that monorail advice like dude point that saved the whole trip like no doubt because I know I wouldn’t have known to do that so good. Yeah. No, it was I had a great time and um it was just so much fun man. It really was. That was my first time. Uh that was my first time going to Disneyland like on my terms, you know? I’m not doing it for someone else, if you get what I’m saying. I was working, but uh it was fun, dude. I did it did it my way. And it was uh it was a great time. Good, man. That’s great. We tried Dint Taiong. I don’t know if you ended up trying that place. No, we didn’t get to that. Was Kevin’s spot, right? Dyong is It was really good. We door dashed that in Seattle. They uh like uh Kevin um kept saying this, you gotta go. You gotta go. And we just didn’t have the just didn’t have the time. Yeah, I feel that. It was we we got really lucky. There was no wait by the time we got there. But Oh, good. It was um dude, it was even better than I was expecting because sometimes with viral stuff like that, you never really know. But and the killer was too. We had one bad dinner there. Like it was just trash. I was so upset at at Disney. Yeah. And it was like, oh, where’d you go? Unless you don’t want to say. Uh, yeah. Oh, yeah. It was It was Yeah. No, it was trash. I’ll text it. Pretty sure they gave Katie a shrimp that was still alive. Oh, no. Yeah, it was terrible. It was. It was awesome. Some people call that fresh. Well, that that thing was fresh. Wow. Trader Sam’s goats. That’s a great great little spot. Oh, yeah. Now, back to the insiders brought to you by Jiffy Lube on ESPN 1320. That was wild. That picture is fantastic. Uh, this is the handoff. DLO and Casey coming up next. I’m comats and that’s James Ham. DLO and Casey are both here. Yeah, we got to get that mic fixed. Yeah. So, that’s definitely Well, it’s there’s a lot of things that play with the mic. Like, one, I don’t think it’s great. Two, Kenny requires a certain level of processing. Sure. And that mic is not processed, right? So, but it was definitely cutting out like Oh, yeah. Yeah. No, it’s absolutely cutting out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, we’ll figure that out. I’ll go I’ll go talk to Seth. The most uh I don’t know if unique is the right word, but the the voice that needs the most the most high maintenance. Infuriating is the word that you’re looking for. Frustrating. Well, would be another word. Hey, I I meant to do this during the the break, but I’m just going to ask this production note now and then we can start talking about Jonathan Kaminga. Okay. Uh, do we like this screen or this screen? First one. Really? Why? Yeah. Well, because it covers up too much of Kenny and James. Yeah. Oh, I see. Down here. Oh, okay. I was only looking at Stop focusing on yourself. Well, okay. Stop focusing on yourself. And like there right there. Okay, that’s better. All right. Now, I get why you don’t like it with the black bars around it and all that. Like, I get that, but Well, and like it takes some of the focus off, of course. Obviously. And that’s and that’s and that’s really what that’s really what matters. Just do should do the one big picture and then stack us on the side. All right. You could do that, huh? With that one right over there. But you could stack try that one. There it is. There we go. This is what I’m talking about. There we go. Welcome into the handoff. Screw you, C. This is a This is a very visual bit right here for those that want to go see it later. This is Please go check it out at youtube.combn1320. Twitch.tv/ ESPN1320 as well. Uh Jonathan Kaminga news sort of came out today. We got some I don’t want to say news. We got some additional details about what’s going on with the Jonathan Kaminga stuff to me. It what? I’m not I’m sorry. I’m just Yeah, I got some thoughts if I was trying to think. Yeah, like it’s it’s a mess. But I I from the King’s perspective just talking about that that angle of it. If I’m Scott Perry right now, it’s you have to decide, do you want Jonathan Kaminga on your team or not? Because it’s really clear the offer you made isn’t going to work. The Warriors would rather have him play on the qualifying offer than make that deal. So, are you going to try and negotiate? And I don’t think the Warriors want that either, though. I think that this is I I want you to like run with this, but the idea that the Warriors are just okay with him playing on the qualifying offer, I think it’s crazy. I don’t think they’re okay with it, but I think they would rather go, “Okay, we’ll figure it out. We’ll kick the can, I guess, and he’ll do that.” The Warriors are probably as frustrated as every restricted free agent in the league right now because they feel like they have, again, I hate to keep using an asset. Yes. That they can’t maximize right now because of what the market looks like and they’re staring at a reality of where they’re not they’re not going to be able to get anything for them. That’s why that like I I I I I have thoughts on this too, but go ahead. I want you to I mean I agree with you. I feel like if I’m the Warriors, I’ve tried to think about the scenarios of what would be worse and there’s a lot of bad just bad on top of bad. But what’s the worst case scenario? And if I’m the Warriors, having him sign on the qualifying offer is disastrous. that that is a waste of time, a waste of an asset, and quite honestly, probably a waste of a season for your team. Like that would be everything with that would be bad because he’s not coming back. Um, who knows what type of buying you’re going to get from him and this whole time you’ve been fighting to get a better offer and now you’re getting absolutely nothing. Mhm. Like because you’re not And that’s why I agree with Kaminga’s team for telling the Warriors to get get this two like all you’re trying to do is snatch my my my free agent. You’re you’re trying to control where I go. Yes. By offering me a fake second year. Like everyone knows that second year isn’t real. Like that’s like like and and like you know Slater wrote this pretty specifically. They’re essentially just trying to eliminate his no his that the built-in no trade clause. Yeah. And if I’m coming to 25 or or whatever the dollar figure was or not, hell no. I’m not taking that. You’re not going to you’re not going to send me to Washington. There’s one there’s one scenario where the Warriors pick up that team option. And in that scenario, Jonathan Kaminga is now horribly underpaid. Yeah. Right. Right. And he’s probably gonna leave you the next year anyway. Yeah. He’s I would That’s what I was laughing. I mean, look, if I’m Jonathan Kaminga, I’m almost Bryce Harper in this situation. I’m going to Mike Dunlevy. Dun Levy Jr. I’m going to say if you’re here to talk about waving that nose, Trey Claus, get the f out of my face. Yeah. Are you crazy? You guys, you want me to trust you guys? Yeah. That you’re gonna do the right thing. that you’re going to have a nice landing spot for me, that you’re going to, you know, the second year, second, we might pick it up. Now, it’s a $40 million. You want me to trust you guy. There may not be an entity or a group of people since Kaminga has become a professional that is less trustworthy than that conglomerate in Golden State. That has nothing to do with the fact that they’ve done great things in the past. They’ve won championships. They’ve made great move. I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about the way Kaminga looks at that whole entity over there. Yeah. There’s no way in hell I would trust you with dinner, let alone my career. Yeah. You know what the funniest thing about it is to me, James, is the oldest team in the league is getting rid of a 24year-old player who most people believe have like a bright future in the league. They’re just like, “Nah, we don’t really have any room for you, bro. We’ve got other things going on over here.” Not to nitpick, 22-y old. He’s 22. Sorry. And that’s that’s kind of the point where I’m at. Like you’re getting a player who if you’re the Kings, like why not? He’s younger than any player you’ve drafted outside of Reol. Uh but every year, if you look at the Kings drafts every year, he’s basically younger than them and he’s got four years experience in the league. you know, he’s going to walk in. Like when you’re drafting, it doesn’t matter where you’re drafting in the NBA, you don’t know if you’re getting, you know, De’aran Fox or you’re getting Josh Jackson. You don’t. One of those guys was number four and one was number five. One of them hasn’t been in the league for five years and he was the fourth pick in the draft or three years, whatever it is. You don’t know what you’re getting. You know what Kaminga is and he’s 22. He’s younger than like a year and a half younger than Nate Clifford. He’s he’s younger, like way younger than any player that you draft, but you already know what he is. At least you already know what the the floor is. Now you get to check and see what the ceiling is. So, I get the risk. Same time, man. I I don’t the Warriors if I’m if I’m coming right now. I’m saying, “Okay, like look, I’m going to play for the qualifying offer, but I’m not signing until October 1st. So then you can’t even come to me and try to trade me during the season. Can’t even attempt to.” Yeah. I’m I’ll just be here. Yeah. Yeah. I’m I’m Yeah, I’m with you. I’m with you. You don’t have control over anything. I’ll play this out and I’ll leave and free. But to what you were saying, Hammer, the every second contract, with very few exceptions, is a risk. Like because most most second contracts, especially for for picks that high, you’re you’re you’re pretty much the max, right? And then you have these the allNBAs and the and the and the and you now get the NFL reporting of so and so signed a contract worth up to y you know they have to hit two or three you know markers in that second contract to actually hit that number. But still like there’s there is a level of risk when it comes to signing that second contract. It’s why for the last year and some change even till today the Keegan Murray conversation has been so fascinating because we thought Keegan after year one was due for a max extension at this time of you know this time in his contract and now we’re like I don’t know I don’t know what I don’t know what Keegan’s dollar figure is. I was gonna No, go ahead. No, that that’s it. Like it’s the point was there’s just there’s there’s always a risk and I think to to what Hammer was saying with Kaminga is you get a feel for a player’s floor and now you’re trying to figure out what their ceiling is. The Warriors obviously have no interest in figuring out what this is and if it was just a normal year I think there’d be double digit teams who want to know what what type of ceiling Jonathan Kaminga has. Sure. But I don’t know if it’s the 7% cap increase. I don’t know if it’s the first apron, the second apron, these restrictions starting to come into play with the CBA. I don’t know what it is, but this this 2025 market is very different. Yeah. I don’t even think next year’s market is going to be all that much better. And then look at all those even if it goes up 10% next year. Well, it’s going up 7% next year, right? But look at all this group of restrictive free agents. If you’re looking at Cam Thomas and Kaminga, if they play for the qualifying offer, uh, Giddy and who’s the last Grimes, Quinn Grimes, if they just sit out, they all say, “Hey, let’s just, you know, collude here and we’re all just going to play for the qualifying offer.” You get to next off season, there’s already another restricted free agent class. There’s also on top of that an entire free agent class that you’re dealing with and there’s still no money. The money just went from 10% the cap going up 10% to 7%. That’s a big chunk of change when you’re talking about 170 something million dollar cap. That’s a lot of money that just went away. And so I don’t even know if next year is going to be better for these guys. It’ll be easier without the baseear compensation involved though. Like I think that’s a a significant part of this because you’re acquiring and we we talk about it here from the Sacramento perspective, but if you’re a team um that that may I’m just going to I’m picking a team. I’m not saying this team would do it, but if you’re the Hawks and you’re like, man, we could get we could go get Jonathan Kaminga, but it’s going to put us up at the second apron. Like that’s not he’s not enough of an asset like of a known quantity. That’s it. To be willing to do that. Yeah. I don’t think you can take risks when you’re at the apron. Right. Right. Put you up in that like aprons. Aprons have to be. Now, you could take chemistry risks. Sure. With a sure thing player. You could take a chemistry risk, but I don’t think you can take a talent risk when you’re talking about apron one or apron two. Like I I I don’t think you could do that, right? Yeah. It’s tough, man. There. And the other problem is the Kings. if they do somehow figure out this deal, they have to come up with the next deal to clear at least 10 million in luxury tax dollar. So, what’s next? And and what does that cost? Because that might not be free. So, if you’re going to go out and get a Kaminga, number one, you’re at the you’re hard capped at 188 million. You might not even have the pure cap space here unless you have a certain amount of players included in that trade. But on top of it, like what how are you going to clear up that other 10 10 million to get you back under the luxury tax? And but why do you have to be under the luxury tax? Because they’re not paying they’re not going to do it for a team that that right now Vegas has at 35 and a half wins. They’re not paying the luxury tax. Yeah, where we at? What’s going on? Huh? Who’s listening to what? Well, I’m listening to you guys right now, but you, everybody listening to this is listening to KFM, West Sacramento, KRXQ HD2 Sacramento, ESPN 1320, Sacramento Sports Leader, always free on the Odyssey app, the Hour app, the TuneIn app. Just threw us out. Yeah, I switched to banners and it just threw us out. I hated them. Oh, wow. That’s great. You’re listening to me. That’s right. That’s right. Yes. So, first of all, thing I was going to say, one of the things I was going to say was, uh, Kawakami told you Kaminga was 24, didn’t he? He did. Yeah. Damn Kakami. He keeps coming off this bad information, getting people crazy. Inside joke yesterday, you know, Kawakami said Brock Party was 24 years old and I brought it on the radio and he’s 25. Oh. Huh. Turning 26 at the end of this year. So, he’s like comfortably off the Year and a half. But when Kenny gets it wrong, it’s always funny. I’m having a I’m having a tough time with this for two reasons. One, Tim Kakcomi, avid Candlestick Chronicles listener. Two, I got the score I got the score of the A’s game wrong in my sports update today. Oh, no. Oh, the one that airs on six radio stations. Yeah. The thing that you literally like just don’t get this detail wrong. Yeah. Yeah. Because I I’m sitting here today because they play over the our we have speakers that rotate at all the stations except ours and it rotates through them and I hear the update sometimes and I’m sitting there and it’s just on in the background and I said three to one. I’m like that was not the final score. When did it get three to one? No idea where I got three to one. It happens. No idea why I said it. You just keep on moving like nobody even whatever. You haven’t moving to the next day. This is a true story. You haven’t truly lived until you’re, you know, filling up your water bottle and Abee’s show cycles through the the loudspeaker out there. Mhm. Anything could be happening. Like you you you like if you if the if the wakeup call pops up, Kevin’s calling someone a Like that’s certainly what’s happening. Uh in a in typically in a complimentary way, probably sometimes. Yeah. Yeah. Per P perhaps you’re listening to DLO and Casey on KSM we’re talking music tickets like whatever Abe show comes on you don’t know what like someone could be screaming like for help someone could be maybe at a certain type of a massage parlor in the city like you just you’re never really sure what’s going to happen when Dave show pops on the the loud speaker. It is so funny because this is what happens when he goes on Instagram live. It is because he just goes on Instagram live during his show. Like if I just did an Instagram live the camera like up here. Yeah. So he’s he’s like look he’s always looking up. It’s it’s like and it’s so true cuz you’ll be listening and it’ll just be like Yeah. It’s the head cannon show. We’re giving away a dog. What? Yeah. I got to I got to deal with a dog with a dog guy. I’m giving away a dog. Where did you give a Where did you get dog? Is that in find you a dog? Where did you get Where did you get a dog? Can you come in here right now? What’s your Are you the guy who was singing anybody in the bathroom? The dog’s yours. Oh, whatever, man. It’s a wild show. I want to ask you guys or bring something up now on the flip side. RP. Um, I actually asked you this. I asked you this yesterday. I want to get James to talk because James was just breaking down a lot of the reasons why, hey, man, you go after uh Kaminga, you go get it done. I know a lot of the talk has been, you know, we’re not we’re not including Keon Ellis or whatever. And I’ll ask James’ scenario. If the Utah Jazz, and it’s not apples to apples, I understand that there’s money involved in all this other stuff. But if the Utah Jazz were like, “Hey, we miscalculated this Ace Bailey thing. He really doesn’t want to be here. Um, uh, Sacramento Kings, we want to trade you Ace Bailey for Keon Ellis.” Would you make that move? Ace Bailey for Keon Ellis. Yeah. Yeah. Tough eye pick for Keon Ellis. Yeah. You wouldn’t even think about it, right? What’s the difference outside of money, but you talked about how young the guy is. What’s the difference between Jonathan Kaminga being part of that deal? The biggest, by the way, I think I have an answer to that, but go ahead, Hammer. The biggest difference is it’s a four-year contract. You have no idea what it is. Like, it’s money. It is. It comes down to money. Like a second contract in the NBA is way more expensive. But also like look, we can think we know what uh he’s going to look like, what as a player, we think we Kaminga, what a ceiling could be and stuff. We have no idea with Ace Bailey. It’s a bigger risk for sure with Bailey, but there’s still like unlimited potential. He could still be a bonafide superstar. We don’t know about that. I mean, Kaminga, we know that there’s more, but like taking looking at him as a player and saying, “Oh, well, there’s still a possibility that he’s Blake Griffin.” We’re like, “Wait, no, not really.” Like, we kind of we see an outline of the player he can be, and he can average 22, we can average 25. Hey, there could even be a season where you’re bad and you’re just like, “Feed the guy and he’s averaging 30 points a game.” But there’s like an unknown about a player like Ace Bailey. And like if you’re gonna trade him, um teams around the league would have given up like multiple first round picks for him. No one is giving up multiple first round picks for Keon Ellis right now. They would probably give up multiple first round picks for Ace Bailey, which is kind of wild. Like we never seen him play. He could be Josh Jackson, right? They’re like, “Oh, we haven’t seen him play, so let’s give up everything, right?” You know what I mean? You know, it’s just it’s just a weird dynamic. Side unseen is a fascinating thing to the mind and that’s essentially what Ace Bailey is. We talk about numbers before attaching names to them. Like we were talking about that yesterday when you talk about the third pick versus Ace Bailey. Same exact thing. Just one’s a number and one’s a name, right? It’s all about potential and upside. I think the RIP upside did up upside too. That’s not fair. No, I I think with Kaminga though, I think there’s a lot of people in front offices around the league who probably view it like, and this is why it differs a little bit from Ace Bailey, say, say, let’s say, take the contracts out of it. I think there are a lot of front office people who look and go, he couldn’t figure out how to play there in four years. Like, just not a winning player. I I and again I I know that’s overly simplistic, but I think there’s probably a lot of people that look at the situation like that. Ace Bailey, I have no idea what it looks like in the NBA. That’s a really talented cat. We think we can get him in here and and produce a produce a a winner. With Kaminga going, he played for the Warriors for four years. Golden State badly needs a player just like him. Badly needs that guy. They just they’re ready to punt. And I think there’s probably a lot of teams that look at the reasons the Warriors want to punt and go, “That’s why we’re not getting involved.” Yeah. I I think it’s a really interesting like like experiment here that the Kings are venturing into because Kaminga because he came into the league so young, we still have no idea. I mean, we have a little bit of an idea of who he is, but again, like I brought up JJ Hixon earlier, he could easily turn into JJ Hixon and you’re like, “Oh boy.” Right? you know, like going into year four, all a sudden he’s just not that guy and then you’re fighting the whole time to like, okay, do we need to move on from him? What? So, you’re hoping that that’s not the case, but like there is a certain degree of, hey, like look, this guy is fighting being a role player at the NBA level. He does not want to be a role player. And we all know like what what’s your line? Learn your role. Learn your role. Change your life. Change your life. Yeah. he refuses to to play the role they want. And now you’re looking at the Kings like, “Okay, if it’s a different role, maybe he will excel. Maybe he will become the player that he thinks he can be.” But that’s a big what if. You know, we’re banking on not just like four years of tape. We’re banking on what’s inside someone’s head and what they think they can be. Yeah. And that’s a whole different story. Yeah. I have a not I have a Jonathan question that’s not related to basketball. Okay. How do we all How do we How do we all feel about this outfit here? Fire. These pants work. Fire. The bell bottom. Yeah, that’s not for me. Fire. That’s not for me. I like the hat. I like the open shirt that that all It’s the bell bottom like slacks that I’m having a tough time with. Like it’s like I I I think right on that. I think I think slacks are kind of all over the place right now. Some are some, you know, some people are still rocking with the slim, some are rocking with the baggie. Uh, I didn’t know the bell bottoms were back, but not a not a big fan of that. But I I do like the hat and I like the I like I certainly like the open shirt. You want to become a cowboy hat guy? Uh there’s there’s there’s been long long discussions about getting getting the proper hats for SAK State football games. Moves are being made. Are being made. We’re going to Sacramento. We’re going to go. We’re going to support our our coach. I love this. Uh for Sak State football. So, yeah. No, there’s a good there’s a good chance that uh DLo and Casey are pulling up in in in cowboy hats to to Sak State football game. Can I Can we make content out of you guys going to Boot Barn, please? Oh, yeah. Shut up. Shout out Boot Barn right there on Delta Shores. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, it’s a great spot. Can we some Austria skin boots to go with it? Oh, see that’s not me. Kenny. Kenny will do it. Kenny Kenny Kenny’s got the full C. Kenny’s been preparing. Kenny’s been preparing for this for over a year. You’re gearing up to go to professional bull riding. I’m definitely going next year. He’s got the full denim top, bottom, belt buckle playing with the boots. With the with the boots. He’s got the whole thing. Shout out Bruce Brown for I’m going to dress as just a version of me but with the with the cowboy hat. If you could get a giant belt buckle with the stinger, that would Oh, that’d be fun. We were we were this close. Okay. Hey, we do have a small amount in line here. We do have a small amount of breaking news. Sacramento Kings have added Daycoin Plowen with their second two-way Oh, with their third two-way contract. So, I thought actually he played extremely well in the summer league and to be honest with you, he did everything that we kept asking Isaiah Crawford to do. Well, he actually took that tip. He was aggressive defensively. He took big shots. Um, so did that one dunk. Shout out to Daqu. Yeah, it was one of them summer league dunks. Yeah, that is confirmed. Uh, Michael Scodto was first with the news, but that is confirmed. That’s That’s It’s three, right? That’s all three. That’s all three. Okay. I love I love this. Warriors may cut off sign and trade talks. All right. Great. We’ll do it. Go ahead, guys. No, you hang up. No. No, you hang up. Yeah. I love that Kaminga for some reason on that graphic is placed between Steph and Jimmy Butler. Like, what? Like, that’s how we’re marketing the Golden State Warriors is Steph, Jimmy, and Jonathan Kaminga front and center. You hoes is crazy. You prefer Brandon Pajki. Yeah, I about to say who who’s next? Oh, you know, stop it. Like it or not, you you’re marketing 23. Well, to be fair, that’s all. Well, that but that’s what I mean. Like, don’t like like that’s fine. He should have been up there that exactly. Why is Stephan Jimmy beside him? Uh maybe the conversation was about the dynamics of the Warriors trading for Jimmy Butler because they couldn’t get those things out of Jonathan Kam. How much of all of this could be avoided if you didn’t sign Draymond Green to a$und00 million deal? All of it. But talk about the ripple effect there. Wow. Just like it it feels like you could it feels like you could at least try. And if you’re wrong, then then you could trade. You signed him to a four-year contract and if you’re wrong or you don’t like it or whatever, you could trade him. Again, 22 years old, you could trade him. But you had to sign Draymond to that hund00 million deal. And now you’re just you’re stuck. Where are you on this team? That team right there. Everybody simultaneously looks at the TV. Jesus Christ, you don’t know who I’m talking about. Where are you on this Golden State Warrior is over the left shoulder of Steph. Um, yeah. I think Oh my god. Hey, the Sparks mascot name is Sparky. You got to do better. You got to be better. Spark. Oh, that is tough. That is concussion protocol right there. Oh man, I’m gonna get stuck because they’re about to throw mascot mishaps. But um uh I I just they’re they are at best a second round exit. I think that they’re good enough that if they sneak in and get uh get the right matchup in the first round, they can win in the first round. But I’m trying not to watch the mask. got missing. I know you’re doing so. Didn’t Didn’t they drop Rocky from the sky and he passed out? Yeah. Yeah, he was passed out when he got down there. Oh. Oh, this is terrible. Jeez. Was that Doc McStuffins that was there? Oh, he got it. Oh my god. Oh, that was a bank shot for sure. That was a bank shot for Oh my god. The the mascot getting hit. This is terrible. The mascot getting getting hit in the Oh, this is a classic. The raptors. The inflatable raptor. Uh, two things. One, on the inflatable raptor, whose idea was like, “Hey, we’re going to put you in an inflatable raptor costume and then you’re going to wear rollerblades.” And they’re like, “Okay, I’ve seen Slamson do that. Roller blade around.” And they’re like, “No, you’re going to rollerblade down the stairs.” Like, what? What’s the worst that could happen? They’re probably thinking, “Look, you’re inflatable. Like it’s not gonna hurt. I I think Slamson was hurt. I think either he ripped out a shoulder or tore an ACL on the rollerblades downstairs. Yeah. Yeah. That’s a regular mascot thing is rollerblading. It’s part of mascot tryyouts. Like, “Hey man, we’re going to need you to rollerblade down section 114 real quick.” That’s nice. You can rollerblade across the floor, but can you rollerblade down the stairs? Also, we’re going to drop you from the ceiling. Do mascots have health insurance? That did. No chance. That’s a part-time employee. No, they make a ton of money and they are taped together. Oh, yeah. They raised slams into the ceiling. That was crazy. He almost fell. Dude, that was terrible. Was that the playoffs? Yeah, it was the playoffs. Oh, the scoreboard. He came propelling down from the scoreboard and something went wrong and he almost fell. Ridiculous. I told I told Damen in this uh this story one time, but one time I was talking to So, one of the security guards, um, I think, yeah, it was my boy Dale. I was talking to him and we were just talking, talking, talking. Then this guy walks by and he goes, “You know who that was?” No, I don’t know. No, it was just a guy. What are you talking about? Said that was Slamson. He’s a good dude. I said, “Oh, Slamson is a real But I would not I never met him before. I never I never met the guy.” Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, I didn’t recognize I if he walked in here right now, I wouldn’t know who he is. But the guy just walks by and he Hey, what’s up, man? All right, man. Have a good night. You know who that was? So, no, that was Lson. The the Denver Nuggets mascot makes 625,000 a year. Out of town. This is from LinkedIn. Um Harry the Hawk, the Hawks mascot, makes 600,000. Benny the Bull, 400,000. Gritty, shout out to the Flyers, 250. And then the Philly Fanatic, it’s 200,000. Those are the highest paid. They also have to sign waiverss that say if they accidentally die, it’s just when I die, they’re like, “We’re going to have to rollerblade off the jumbotron.” I think this is only the second lion, too. They had a lion in the beginning who is not very good at all. And I actually sat in the stands next to his sister while we were bagging on him the whole time. And she’s like, “Hey, that is my brother.” I’m like, “He is horrible. He is not good at his job.” Then the new they they got a new slams and we’re talking like he’s been slamming for over 20 years. He’s the same dude. Like you can watch. When is he? Are we going to pocket watch him on Slamson? Probably. When does start? September 1st. Mid to late 40s. Wow. Yeah. Wow. I’m going to guess, but he’s been slamin for a long time. More impressive career. Current slamson or Mercedes Lewis. Let’s talk about it. I heard about that. Mercedes Lewis still. Mercedes Lewis still around is crazy. Mercedes Lewis has had a career on par with how impressive LeBron James career is. He’s a tight end in the NFL for 19 years. Did he play longer than Frank Gore? Uh, yes. Frank Gore was cuz Gore was the ‘ 05 draft. Well, Mercedes loses 06 actually. Yeah. And Gore was no Gore. Gore Gore retired what 20 21 or something like that. Yeah. Talking 19 years. years as a tight end. Played 17 games for the Bears last year. That’s crazy. He was 40 years old. He was 40 years old all last year and played 17 games. He caught the ball. I was like, “What in the world? He is still around.” Is slam the LeBron James of mascots? [Music] Oh, we got to find out how long Rocky’s been. Rocky’s been around. Rocky, the original um Phoenix Suns gorilla. He Oh, yeah. That was Yeah. Do you know how that all started? Why the Phoenix Suns mascot’s a gorilla? I’m afraid. Yeah. I don’t think we want to know, do we? It’s It’s fine. It’s just a guy just showed up one day and it’s like I’m the mascot now. And this is the 70s, I think. And the NBA in the 70s was just like you do whatever, right? And so this guy just showed up in a gorilla costume and was like, I’m the mascot. Who appointed him the mascot? Bobby Heaton. I have no idea. It’s literally the office episode where Nelly walks in. She’s like, I’m the manager now. And everyone’s like, yep, she’s the manager. Hey, maybe that’s Jimstro. That’s the way to go. take, you know, control of the the the market right there and say, “Look, I’m here. I’m the master.” They put a little warm-up jacket on them. They was like, “Yes, it’s good to go.” Who wants to go walk into Aaron Miller’s office right now? Well, we are the vice presidents of Yeah. sports and entertainment. The vice president of sports and entertainment. Nice. I wouldn’t want to see Slamson. I was just thinking through that. I wouldn’t want to see Slamson. It’s like I don’t want to see like those people who try to see the Disney characters out of I don’t want to see Mickey with his I don’t even want to see I don’t even want to see a there’s nothing worse than walking out of Disneyland for the day. You spent the whole day there and you’re interacting with people and everybody’s so great and you’re walking and then you’re walking back across because we stay at the hotels ac not on not a Disney hotel but across the street on the opposite side of Downtown Disney. So, we walk back to our hotel and you’re standing on the corner and you see somebody in their like undone like cars outfit from operating a ride and they’re just sitting there with their backpack on their phone going to their crappy apartment. They’re just like, “Oh man, no. You live in Radiator Springs. No. Oh, it’s the worst. Just the worst.” Back home to Downey apartment in Downey. with a Arby’s sandwich in his hand just keep it moving. Shout out the local guy. Give you a turkey leg, man. Uh what do you guys got coming up on D Long them turkey legs are crazy. It’s wild. My man, we were at the parade of lights. My man had one of those. He was going I was like, man, I am that is bro that’s one of them that is one of them John Madden turkey legs. It is. It’s It’s comically large. And I think the bit is not even I don’t think I don’t think anyone actually likes the turkey. Like like it’s fine, but you get two bites in and it’s kind of like all right, I’ve had enough like in life or No, like at the park like like it’s good. You have a couple bites and it’s like this and then it’s just a bit novelty. Yeah. It’s like when you get one of those big freakish milkshakes that they sell. It’s like you really just want a couple of bites of it. Now you’re left with $17 worth of ice cream and cookies and like what the hell am I gonna do with this? You’re talking about it’s not salt and straw. No, the other black. Is it black top? Black something. I didn’t go in Disney, but I went in Las Vegas and Right. You get done with your shake and then you’re like, “Oh, now I have this huge slice of cake I have to navigate.” Yeah. I didn’t want this. I wanted a photo for Instagram. That’s it. That’s it. You just bring me a fake one. This was a $19 photo. I just I literally have that on my Instagram. me with his I believe it giant Oreo cookie shake. It was nuts. Uh hey, live, man. Live. More Kaminga stuff. Yeah, I imagine. Yeah, Kaminga. We’ve got uh I I I I we haven’t talked um a lot of football since together. We haven’t talked a lot of football together since training camp has got underway. So, uh couple of things there. The NFC West is interesting cuz I think the favorite is in a lot of trouble. Like I feel like we’ve been through this before and everybody like downplayed it and it’s like no I think you guys got a problem. Oh my. So we’ll talk about that. Can’t wait. Do and Casey don’t go anywhere. It’s starting right now. That’s James Ham. I’m Kyle Madson for Joe Brazil and Jesse Topia. We’re the insider sponsored by Jiffy Lube. Uh, DLO and KC starts. Uh, drink water, be nice to people. DLO and Casey starts right now. [Music] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We got them screaming d. We got them screaming d. [Music] We your number one spy. We your number one spot for some sports. Huh? Got the city going crazy when we work. Huh. We too, but we ain’t two. We in first. Huh? And when you need the real, we is who you search. Huh? D. [Music] We your number one spot. Let’s go, baby. Let’s go. Let’s go. Get your headphones plugged in. Hey, [Music] one more time. We welcome you in here to the Wednesday, July 30th edition of DLO and KC. I’m Damian Bart, the ultimate needle mover in Don Bone himself. He’s Kenny Carowway. Yes, sir. Acknowledge me, man. We are live. What are you doing with him? Keep that drop alive. Yeah, this this changeover is tough. You know, this changeover is tough. It’s a grind. Hammer Hammer. We’ll see you. It’s a grind. 3:00. Uh we’ll talk Kings basketball with James when he returns us with us later on in the show. And yeah, of course, like you know, we’ll pick up right where we left off. Uh some news came out regarding Jonathan Kaminga today. I I I guess really I feels like the Warriors are just talking to anyone who will listen and nobody’s listening and the Warriors are trying to Well, what I mean what and and I mean our brother Anthony and and and Sam and you know these different people who are doing a great job of reporting on this like those those are those are Warriors reporters. Yeah. which would also lead which will also lead if I was Jonathan Kaminga to the distrust that I have for this organization. Mhm. You’re out here we’re negotiating. We’re putting out terms. You’ve already done the the situation before where you said turn down $30 million a year or something like that. Like at every turn, if I’m Jonathan Kaming, this this how I feel with them. Not saying that’s how everybody should feel or how I feel, but at every turn, you show how distrustful you are. You show how you continue to try to make me look bad by the things that you talk to the reporters about and make sure that they get out in the public the the public uh contract negotiations. like there’s no and then you want me to wave my no trade clause and you want me to accept some type of deal where there’s a team option with you guys. And and to be clear, it’s a figurative wave of the no trade clause with on a on a qualifying offer, uh you can’t be traded. And if he were to sign that two-year deal with the team option the second year, it’s a contract. It’s not the qualifying offer. It’s a contract which is why there’s a that increase in pay and the option the second year and Kaminga’s people see through it. Literally everyone sees through it. It’s just an opportunity one to prolong this a little bit and give a team an opportunity to acquire Jonathan Kaminga in February for a year and a half because it’s a team option. And so they can pick up that second year to see what they have with Jonathan Kaminga. And now all of a sudden he loses control of his future, right? and he’s compensated for it in the short term, but he loses control of his future, right? And I don’t blame uh Kaminga. I don’t blame Kaminga’s team for just flat out saying no. And now this stuff, well, the Warriors might cut off signing trade talk. All right, bro. Cut them off. Go ahead, do it. Cuz the other scenario is just as bad for you. So, we could we could play. And that’s and that’s what’s so dumb about this posturing is everyone knows you’re full of crap. This that’s that’s all we’re that’s all we’re witnessing from the Golden State Warriors right now is public posturing because they’re in the defensive mode. And I don’t understand why. If if y’all are this comfortable with your team and you’re this comfortable with letting this 22-y old kid go, yo, stick your chest out. You had no problem sticking your chest out when you was talking about him last year. Stick your chest out and just say, “Hey, play on the qualifying. We don’t care what you do. Do it.” But all of this all of this fake ass, oh, we’re going to cut the fam. Go ahead, do it. Because clearly to go to what you said earlier, I don’t think the Kings are budging. Like Scott Perry, like clearly the Kings like Jonathan Kaminga. Clearly the Kings would like to do something with Jonathan Kaminga and have him on this team and see what they could do with him moving forward. But they’re not falling all over themselves to get this done. and talking about the Warriors want Keon Ellis. You don’t get an asset you want for one that you don’t like. Let’s just call it what it is. We don’t want these two guys. So, you can have him and you send us the guy that you don’t want and we’ll part friends. Until then, keep it moving. Drew down in the chat talks about uh sarcastically uh with his Warriors colored glasses. I don’t know why they haven’t trade traded him for Carter and Sarge either. Number one, we understand what type of trade package that is. We’re not saying it’s the greatest one ever. Also, you’re talking about draft picks in that situation, draft compensation. Also, would you rather have that and some draft capital or absolutely nothing? And if they’re cool with having absolutely nothing because let’s be perfectly clear, Jonathan Kaminga is not coming back to the Warriors. And if he signs a qualifying offer, it’s going to be a no trade clause. You’re not going to be able to trade anything for him. So, like you talk about signature, if you’re the second he signs that paper, you’re done. You get nothing. And and Kaminga would be ridiculous to sign any contract with him that waved a no trade clause situation. So, unless it’s a four-year contract for the amount of money that he wants, then do what you want. I’m getting my money either way. But the the notion that you’ll just sign so you’ll be able to trade it, bro. Stop. Like, if you’re gonna be good with just letting him walk for nothing, be good with that. But don’t act like um like that’s not the reality of the situation. Yeah. Yeah. We will uh we’ll come back. Um we’re just getting started. We’re thrilled that you’re here with us. There’s much more on this. Uh ESPN had an interesting an interesting list of the teams that missed the playoffs last year. And as at odds as we can be with national media, when you read between the lines, they actually think a lot like DLO and Casey do. We’ll explain what we’re talking about when we return here on Sacramento Sports Leader ESPN 1320. Uh, give me that one more time. Yeah. Oh, I got you. I got you. I got you. Uh, that’s a good idea. That’s a good idea. Uh, yeah, let’s try it. Let’s try it today. Let’s go 58 today and see see how it feels. You guys see Gilbert Arena spoiler? I James was reading that story when I walked in. I didn’t see what happened here. He got arrested, I think, with four others. Um, don’t gambling ring. A gambling ring. One of the guys is a pretty bad dude, I’m assuming. And the way he was labeled, I think it was like a I got to double check it, but yeah, Gilbert’s in some trouble. Not to sound like uh Kanan, but he did that Guilty as Yeah. Yeah. That checks out what what I think is uh how he moves. Yeah. Chris H tweeted, “Former NBA star Gilbert Arenas and a suspected Israeli crime figure were arrested today.” Jesus. Yeah. Yeah. They were playing the games at his house. I think it’s Zabbo’s birthday. Happy birthday, Zabbo. Z. Happy birthday, boy. Damn. Taylor. Okay. Didn’t see that either. Not going to lie. I saw that tweet in this. Oh my god, we’re getting sued. I was like, because he is we talking about like Troy Taylor really? Like it’s got to be us. And I was like, wait, I forgot that about that one story. Hey. Um, I’m about to So you can pull it up. Interesting news day. Go ahead. No, my bad. My bad. No, I just saw the Shannon Sharp stuff. Not not that not that the Shannon was Well, I mean, the hell have I been out? Well, it’s it’s Shannon was fired. That’s not I don’t think that’s terribly unexpected, but Shannon was let go at ESPN. So, that that’s the story. Yeah, he had been on leave suspension. I’m not exactly sure which which one. Uh but yeah, he’s um he’s out at ESPN. So, all right. Let’s see what’s next for Shannon. Uh Gilbert Arenus, he’s out too, just in a very different way. Gilbert and five other defendants, including a suspected high-level member of an Israeli transnational organized crime group, were arrested today on a federal indictment alleging they operated an illegal gambling business in which highstakes poker games were played at an Encino mansion arena’s own. Wow, Kanan. Yeah, look it up. Anytime I read a news story with uh Israeli transnational organized crime group, high level member, cool. I don’t want nothing to do with it. Not my not my job. Yeah, shout out. Not my job. Good luck to everybody involved. And we’ll leave it at that. Um I did just come across something. Uh it was actually our brother Bonte posted it. It was it was something from a a um Warriors uh news thing like the Kings Beats like Warriors talk or something like that that kind of had a breakdown of um uh Sham’s report that I have not read or heard, but apparently the offers now I don’t know if they’re combining the two teams or um you know they’re they’re in the same vicinity enough to where They could be lumped together, but again, according to Shams, there’s substantial money offers out there from both Sacramento and Phoenix. I don’t know how that works with Sacramento. I don’t I don’t know how I We’ll ask James when he comes back in a couple of hours because I’m just too I’m just too stupid to understand what you can and can’t do. But it seems like there are financial offers out there for him. Good, you know, something a lot closer uh to what he’s looking for. It’s just the Warriors can’t seem to get what they want in trade return, right? I’m not sure. This was something that I asked earlier as well. What the Warriors need to sit down and figure out what does this outcome look like for us? What are we trying to get out of this? Are we trying to get the greatest um trade package of all time? Or are we trying to get something back in return in a market that has devalued a guy like Jonathan Kaminga and his trade value and get ourselves together to try and make a championship run? I thought that’s what this was all about. I thought all of this stuff getting Jimmy Butler and trying to get everything in a row was we’re trying to get number five for Steph Curry, this whole charade that you’re going through with Jonathan Kaminga and even threatening to bring him back into that locker room. You think that’s going to get you closer to where you want to be? Like I I think they need to have a what are we doing here moment? Like we got kind of lost in the sauce with not trying to get pushed around and get best. What are we doing here? What are we really trying to do here with this franchise? Every time anybody talks about it, it’s win a championship. All right. Is messing around with Jonathan Kaminga the best way to stay focused on winning a championship right now? I would say no. Yeah. Let’s stop with the charade and whatever you do, whether it’s the Kings or the Suns or whatever, let’s stop playing around and get this done so we can get back to the goal that we have for this franchise. I was able to find the actual uh Sham’s report here that I was referring to a minute ago. Uh and it reads as such. Kaminga uh and his agent Aaron Turner have used July to explore their sign and trades off uh offers. The most significant negotiations have been with the Sacramento Kings and Phoenix Suns getting proposals plural getting proposals up to four years approaching $90 million in total including a player option for the final season. uh sources said uh Phoenix has made the most lucrative push via sign and trade. That tells me that tells me a couple of things the approaching $90 million offer was clearly from Phoenix and not from Phoenix and Sacramento. How close was Sacramento’s offer to what Phoenix has offered financially? to if it’s in the vicinity and we’ll say vicinity being 15 million within we we’ll say 75 million from from s 75 million I feel like is in the vicinity feels like it maybe the king’s interest in Jonathan Kaminga is a little bit more serious than we thought if if we’re if we’re talking numbers approaching you know 75 $80 million that is significant interest the game we’re playing now is, and I’m sure Sacramento is looking at Phoenix going, they have nothing to give, right? And so, you may want this player, this play, you may want something from us, you’re not going to be able to get that from them. And if we’re the two teams making these financial, you’ve got a choice to make. A little bit or nothing. And that’s what we were talking about before the commercial break a minute ago. You want a little bit or you want nothing? Um, our guy, the Hall of Famer Mark Spears is on NBA TV today actually a little while ago and was just kind of breaking down a little bit more of what’s going on behind the scenes with Kaminga and the Kings and the Warriors and all this other stuff. Uh, I suggest you got that clip, man. We we could we could run that. Yeah, this this this quote’s all over the chat right now. Um here is uh uh Mark Spears from NBA today. The Hall of Fame. He wants to go. He wants to go. He wants to go. Uh and the Kings are offering a starting spot. Okay. Uh power forward next to Keegan Murray, next to Sabonis. He’s talked on a on a Zoom call with Scott Perry, as you know, the GM. Work that out for me. Let’s work this out in real time. Mhm. He’s offering a starting spot alongside Keegan Murray. Mhm. Who’s out? Dear probably Zack to two, Keegan to three. Dear gone. Dear to the bench. On the bench. Yep. Yep. Kaminga four. Okay. Sorry, Jesse. Thank you. Go ahead. Call with Scott Perry as you know, the GM. Uh BJ Armstrong, the assistant GM, and and also with their head coach. Okay. Uh so he’s in, right? He wants to go there, but I think that first the Warriors don’t like the first. And then the Suns, I heard they’re like offering Royce O’Neal in four seconds and Nick Richards. That’s just not pretty enough. Correct. He wants to go. He wants to go. All right. A couple things going on there. You thought you didn’t like Sacramento’s offer? You got to be kidding me. Royce O’Neal and for Hey, Drew down. you Devin Carter and like it pal. We look bless we just took SK off the table. We just took Mario off the table. You know what? You don’t get him. You don’t get him anymore. So, one of the things that a lot of people are also talking about in the in the Shams report there because there’s a lot with what the Hall of Famer said. Yeah. and combining that with what with what Sham’s report where do we want to start? Let’s start with let’s start with start with Mark where we just let’s let’s start with Mark and go from there because that is prevalent for so many reasons there that that a that would be a that’s a pretty sizable shift if Jonathan Kaminga is brought in for the dollars that we were talking about right there. That’s a pretty sizable shift right there. Putting Kaminga uh at the four spot. Now Keegan moves to the three. You got Zack Lavine at two, Shruder at one. Of course, uh Domas at five. And I guess you have a situation where now Demar De Rozan is coming off your bench and until further notice, you’ve got Malik Monk on the bench and you’ve got, you know, you’ve you’ve got that that crew leading your second unit and that’s I still believe there’s another point guard signing by the way. Uhhuh. Uhhuh. Leave it at that. Yeah. And that’s I misspoke. I thought he was out of the country yesterday. He’s not. He was at the Aces game. He’s going out of the country in August. Yeah. That’s also I want to say assuming but just factoring in that Demar’s still here. Maybe maybe Demar as much as they they want to I think Scott Perry wants him around. I think Scott Perry it’s not like it all costs but he likes Demar De Rozan in the building more than Kings fans seem to like him in the building. But he gets this deal done with Jonathan Kaminga and that may mean that Demar is expendable a little bit or you know he’s coming off the bench but he may give him the option to kind of fill out what he wants to do with that. Do you want to be here be a sixman or do you want to go to Miami? You know do you want to go somewhere where you can start? And with a guy like Jonathan Kaminga coming in that and and also looking at the landscape of the NBA where there might not be contenders that would want Demar right now. Maybe Demar is a little bit more open to coming off the bench in that particular situation. He wouldn’t have been like, “What are you benching me for Nick Clifford for?” Like I’m not interested in doing that. Can’t even mention Nick Clifford in that. Yeah. Like kind of thing. Not interested in that. But, you know, you get a guy like Aminga, maybe I’m a little bit more open to that as well. So, um, you talk about a seismic shift in how we look at some things. There’s also the the seismic shift in some respects about where the king stance might be. The kings have laid out a situation where, hey, we want you. We’re planning for you. We want to give you everything that you’re looking for in basketball terms. This is they’re not going to overextend themselves, but this doesn’t necessarily to me feel like ah if it happens, it happens. Mhm. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Right. No, we we want you. We kind of got plans for you. If we can make this happen. Now, the money that they’re trying to give him that that may be something that that they got to work through as well. But everything that we’ve heard in the last week and even reiterating today from hearing from Mark Spears and everything is that interaction and that meeting went pretty well and everybody came away from that Kings Front Office and Jonathan Kaminga like, “Hey, I’m I’m Let’s see if we can make this happen.” Mhm. So, uh, Jesse, can we hear because I know you wanted to talk about the Shams report. Let’s hear from Shams here real quick. Uh, here’s Ant-Man and Shams, uh, on that same NBA today show. I’m going to start with you. What is the latest with Kaminga and his contract negotiations here with Golden State? Malikica, this is turning into a battle of control over the short and long-term future of Jonathan Kaminga as a Warrior. I’m told the Warriors presented Jonathan Kaminga with a 2-year $45 million offer that contained a team option in the second season as well as him forfeiting a built-in no trade clause as part of the deal. So far, Jonathan Kaminga has declined all the Warriors offers. He has said no. And the theme for the Warriors right now is Jonathan Kaminga appears to want to control his destiny moving forward with two routes here. One being the qualifying offer that we see right there. He’s saying he could bet on himself all day that has an October one deadline, one year, $7.9 million. And if his mindset is about continuing to get power over his future and controlling his future, that would allow him to have a no trade clause next season, it would also give him access to unrestricted free agency in the summer of 2026. The other route for Jonathan Kaminga is signing trades. The Phoenix Suns and Sacramento Kings have both had interest in him, have given him offers up to about four years, $90 million, have given him a player option as well, have also promised him a starting role, guaranteed minutes, and control over his future with that player option. But clearly, the Warriors as of right now have shunned all sign and trade offers. So right now what we see is a stalemate between both sides is both sides at a crossroads for a player that clearly believes that he has not been given the full amount of opportunity in Golden State. Clearly he has a high level of self-belief right now. Yeah, I mean that we saw that in that social media post. There’s a lot of options here is what I’m hearing that’s on the table for Jonathan Kaminga. So Anthony, you’ve been around this team throughout Kaminga’s entire tenure, his entire time with this roster. Do the Warriors because I hear confidence coming from Kaminga. Do the Warriors feel confident that they will eventually reach a deal here? Yeah, for sure. They’ve been pretty firm in the last few days saying, you know, there’s a reason why it’s called restricted free agency and not unrestricted free agency. They kind of, you know, hold the leverage on his future and their preferred path clearly is the offer they put on the table. It’s short-term. It’s tradable. That’s how they p they pitched it to Kaminga even. Um, you know, because it’s something they can maybe trade in January at full value. But they say regardless their stance is that as of right now they’re shutting down sign and trade talks. They found nothing appealing there. Uh and you know they they believe he’s going to be on the roster. Their stance is he will be on the roster to start next season. And if that’s the qualifying offer, that’s what it is. Uh the concern there, the flip side of that is the messiness of this. It’s already as as you know you all can attest become kind of a messy restrictive agency. How about when this gets to training camp? How about when the veterans are around looking around saying is this going to be a distraction? in one of Steph Curry, Jimmy Butler, and Draymond Green’s final contention seasons. I think where that’s where there’s a potential, you know, pivot point, breaking point in this, but as of now, as Shams mentioned, it it’s a stalemate and it’s continues to be messy. But right now, the Warriors are saying they’re shutting down those signin trades talks. So, if they are looking to re-engage for the Warriors here at some point, Shams, what would a potential signin trade eventually look like? Because they’re saying right now they expect him to be on the roster. Malikica, the Warriors have been defiant. They want a good player. They also want an unprotected first round pick, a good first round pick. The Sacramento Kings, I’m told, have actually offered a firstround pick in those conversations. Who’s been a conditional first round pick as well as a potential rotation player as well, but the Warriors have wanted the Sacramento Kings to give them an unprotected fully first round pick. The Suns, on the other hand, do not have a first round pick to trade. So their deal would likely look at one or two rotation players and second round draft compensation. The Warriors though do not want bad salary in return. They don’t want players that they feel ass. The Suns are offering you ass. Here Fleming have the value moving forward that Jonathan Kaminga could have. So clearly their asking price has not been met in these potential offers. There’s still about a month and a half, two months left before Jonathan Kaminga has a real decision to make with that October one qualifying offer. Okay. So, it sounds like there is a whole lot still on the table that Jonathan Kaminga, the Golden State Warriors need to come to an agreement. We’re good. Thanks, Jesse. The the the Warriors, that is laughable. Look, man, people are going to get upset with this. Drew Down’s going to get upset with this or whatever. The Warriors look dumb. They look they look absolutely dumb. Now, now hold on. They they’re playing a game too. Now the whole shutting down sign and trade that like settle down and sign them back on the qualifying offer. I have a take I don’t think fans are going to like what you talk what what you got. We have said and we’ll we’ll get to what ESPN wrote in a in a couple of minutes. But no matter no matter Kaminga or not, Russ or not, if this is the squad that takes the floor in a couple months, so be it. They’re not awful. Like I I know you’re frustrated. I know you don’t like the future. Separate discussions in 2026. They’re not awful. Mhm. You want an unprotected first round pick on the same page. I’ I’d give it real early. Yeah. You want an unprotected first round pick? No. No. You can have 2026 unprotected. Look, I it look if y’all want to be upset over 13. Okay. You you if if what we’re talking about is unprotected, you could have 2026, bro. 100%. 100%. That’s the same thing I was thinking when when I saw all that when they talking about give them 2026. If you don’t want to do that, maybe 2027, but I ain’t going past 2027 cuz I don’t know what the hell going on after that. I could be awful n in two years. Awful with everybody off the books. You’re not getting one of those. You can get one of these next two years and we could do it that way. But yeah, like you said, there’s there’s real potential that hey, what what was what would this year have been? 14 13 something like that. Like you said, lost in a plane and all this other stuff. Yeah. Yeah. All right. The Hawks traded it. That was the Was that the I think it was 14. Yeah. Okay. I think it was 14. Yeah. Sure. Sure. We could do that. I want like I want it. I hope I don’t have to give it up. Once again, that’s not that’s to me. And also hearing the things that came out of meeting with Jonathan Kaminga and what they potentially are offering and all this other stuff, that’s not going to stop me from making this deal. Uh, everyone in the chatty house is a draft expert and they said 2026 is too strong of a class fine. You could have 2027, bro. You can’t you just can’t have anything beyond that. Yeah, people got to stop. People got to Hey, no, you know what? I still give up 2026. But look, you know why people got to stop this? You know what I mean? And I I’m I’m watching I’m not saying they’re not, but I’m watching college basketball. I’m watching EBL, high school, all this other stuff. Didn’t they say the same damn thing about this year’s draft? Same thing for years. Oh no, that Cooper flag draft, bro. It is stacked. And all we all we found out was after six people, it was like, ah, there’s not really here anything here. They change their mind so fast on that. They say this every time there’s a good draft like like and we could have good ball players but like literally there’s there’s 22 can’t miss prospects like stop bro stop everybody for like for like three years people were were circling this draft for like three years y and then we got to the draft I’m like well you know it’s really about five guys deep and then what happened and then in Yeah. No, they caught it. They caught it. They caught it. Hey, no, the umpire caught it. The umpire caught it. Official stepped away. Umpire caught it. I just stepped in right in time for that. I did hear that. Yep. Jesse’s back and rul ruling ruling from the official. Yeah, that’s a flag. The traffic was You weren’t even walking. I walked in. I walked in as soon as you said that. That’s the first thing I heard. You got ridiculous. You got flagged by the side judge and the official. I go I go to hit on my lunch. I go to hit on my lunch. You think you can act however. You didn’t see it. Oh, I saw it. No, he I heard it. Come on. Anyways, if Michigan wasn’t blocked, he would say something. Well, he’s not blocked anymore, but weren’t there weren’t there like a dozen trades after the 10th pick last like last month? Yes, 100%. This was the can’t miss draft and everyone was like, “Ah.” And by the way, we were one of them. Yes. No, that Cooper Flag draft class about to be crazy. And everybody’s gearing up. You ain’t get no first round picks in this draft. None. No trades will be made. All right. So, that’s all I’m saying. 2026. Yes. They got some really good ball players in there. Uh the monster Boozers. Um Arenas. They got some good ball players. Now, if you don’t want to give up the unprotected out of fear of landing one of those guys, fair enough. This is Sacramento. It’s happened once and we got Pervvis Ellison. That’s it. always nervous purpose. I mean, it actually happened twice and we messed up, but at least we made the pick. Um, yeah, I the And here’s why I think Can I Can I go ahead? No, no, I was just going to say and here’s why I think the Warriors sound ridiculous and are moving in a real dumb fashion. Yeah. You’re doing all of this because you don’t like the trade proposals that are on the table. But according to Anthony Slater, our guy Anthony Slater, you’re willing to sign him on the qualifying offer, which essentially there is no no trade. There’s a no trade call, excuse me, and he’s not coming back. So, you’re like, “No, we ain’t doing we’ll just have him sign a qualifying offer and get nothing. That is dumb. As the guy once said that went viral and said, “Hide your wife, hide your kids.” Are you dumb? Hide your wife. Hide your kids. That’s stupid. That That doesn’t make any sense to me. If you ranked great internet moments of all time, would that be one of them? Yeah, it’s it’s it’s one of them. It’s one of the first two It would Twitter era. That’d be up there. Yeah, that that that would be up. your wife. That’d be up there. Does it feel This could all be fake posturing. Does it feel like business is picking up a little bit? Mhm. It does. Like cuz Ant-Man asked the question and I don’t think he asked it not knowing the answer. I think he asked the question knowing exactly what the answer is when he said, “Yo, what’s it going to be like when the veterans come around?” Like, is this going to be a distraction? Yes, it’s going to be a distraction. Imagine being Steph Curry entering, you know, one of I I I still think he has many left, one of your final training camps with a pretty decent team. And all of the questions on that first day are going to be about Jonathan Kaminga. You’re Steph Effing Curry and they’re going to be asking you about a 22-y old kid. The reporters are going to be swarming his locker. They’re going to run to Draymond Green to see if Draymond Green says something disrespectful. Then he will at some point. Of course he will. The book has been written. We’ve seen this. Hell, we’re at the point where they’re going to be disrespectful to this kid no matter what happens. If a trade is done in five minutes, they’re gonna trash him that first week in camp. He He I won’t say they. He and and and their and their and their sources. Let them lose. They’re going to trash him. Let them lose five or six. Well, you know, guys back here in the locker room who weren’t bought in. That’s why we not winning, bro. This this is And once again, like I said, is this getting you closer to your goal? That’s what the Warriors should be asking themselves. Is bringing Kaminga back in this situation getting you closer to winning a championship? If it’s not, stop wasting your time and everybody else’s time and this young guy’s time. We’ll come back, man. There’s the there’s there’s a lot. I didn’t think there was, but after listening to uh Aunt Shams and most importantly Mark Spears, there’s there’s stuff to discuss with this and and we will continue to do that. We’ll also open up the phone lines. Where are y’all at with this Kaminga starter? I don’t know the dollar figure, but let’s say somewhere between 70 and 80. Where’s everybody at on that, man? 9169-1320. Haven’t heard from y’all except for TC and Lazy uh in weeks, man. Hit us up. Uh we’ll come back. A lot more to discuss on this situation on Sacramento Sports Leader ESPN 1320. Drew, sure. Like I think you like Mike Dunley, but you stuck on the wrong thing, bro. you stuck on the wrong thing. Does Does no player help you? Like you’re not getting nothing back if he signs on a qualifying line again. You’re getting nothing back. Does that help you get closer? I could even say at the very least if you think the Kings are so so awful and so um desolate as a franchise, get in an unprotected first round pick absolutely will help you. Maybe not this year obviously, but it will help you moving forward because the Kings are going to be sorry according to the Warriors and everybody else. So like you can you can get stuck on Devin Carter and Sar all you want, but and maybe you do believe that getting nothing from um from a Jonathan Kaminga contract situation is better than those two players, but that’s fine. Just be prepared for that to be the case. Don’t look surprised and don’t be like, “Man, we really messed this up.” If you make the evaluation that you know what, if we lose JK for absolutely nothing and he’s this massive distraction this upcoming season and then he walks away for absolutely nothing and that’s better than what that trade package is or the Suns trade package is or whatever, then that’s then live with that. Be cool with that. I know this is random. It always trips me out when like the streaming shows that start out as that way like end up hitting TV after. I was at some Mexican restaurant the other day and Ballers was on. Oh yeah. Yeah. It was on like True TV or something like that. That’s crazy. That’s a trip. Drew, I’ll ask you the question. And if it’s about maximizing the next two years, what is losing him for nothing at the end of next year do for for the second year? I would say I would say moving on from Jonathan Kaminga, even if you’re not getting the best trade package in return, I think Vime’s coming into play a little bit. What does maximizing the next two years of Kaminga look like? He Golden State. Yeah, I think he’s talking about maximizing the next two years of just the Warriors in general. I get that, but like how does Kaminga help that? like he doesn’t fit. He doesn’t. They said they told us like how are you going to like I don’t know. I guess you maximize Golden Go State, but how are you going to do that with Kaminga there? Like it doesn’t work. The the biggest game of the season at the the last game of the regular season to keep you out of the playing. He got a DMP CD. There’s no scenario like oh yeah, we’re all happy and Kaming is going to make it work. Like that’s not that doesn’t exist. Virtually all of his DMPs were CDs. Yeah. They have shown in every scenario they don’t want him or don’t want to play him. Okay. If TC brings up Kyle Shanahan or Robert Salam, just hang up. 916909320. What’s up, TC? What’s up with my two brothers? TC. What’s up, boy? Hey, man. just vibing, man. So, look at this point, right? So, they they they pushed in the bushes, right? When I’m talking about the Warriors, we got to listen. We got to listen to Mark Spears when he’s talking cuz when he you got to listen to him because when he’s talking how he’s talking, something is brewing. That’s how he was talking with that Demar De Rozan. And then what happened a couple hours later? He was a king. So, check it out, bro. That that that old that four second round, man, cut it out. Listen, Dario and the boy Devin and that first round pick protected, bro, is more than enough for that dude. I’m remember when I jumped on talking about Keon and all that. I still stand on that, but at the point where we at now, I’m like, bro, we in a win-win situation. It’s either y’all gonna take the deal or we gonna sign a dude next year, bro, when he a free agent because he gonna come here anyway. That’s where I’m at, DLO. Hey, Warriors, Leica, take the deal right now and send him up to 80. Actually, we can drive all the parties straight up the freeway. It’s only an hour and a half. I I’ll be the chauffeur. I’ll drive him to the Warriors, Devin and Sarge, and I’ll bring back Kaminga. Call me. I’m going, bro. Call me. Call me. Are you getting pushed in the bushes? Cuz have you ever seen someone get pushed in some bushes before? It’s like a special for that guy. You said the Warriors getting pushed in the bushes. That is a classic. I ain’t going to lie. You ever been pushed in the bushes? Like, pick yourself up, please. Pushed in the bushes sounds for like street slang for something like I get it. I get it. But I like I’ve seen people get pushed in the bushes. Pushed in the bushes. That is That’s a good one right there. That sounds like something that happens on prison TV shows. Like I’m not feeling I’m not feeling TC with that one at all. But all right. Oh man. All right. Pol says I ain’t even Y’all are wild. Oh, what did he say? Don’t bring it up. Be scared. Everybody said don’t be scared. What are you scared for? That’s crazy. That’s a tough one right there. Y’all are bugging out here. Shout out. Shout out Reggie. Did you know Kim Kardashian is pregnant? I did not know that. What? Yeah. I I don’t know. I don’t think I did. I saw Did you get Chatty House? No, it might have been a old pick or whatever, but somebody somebody told me she was, but it might have been an old pick, but I saw her pregnant the other day and I was like, if she’s not currently, that counts. Well, no, I’m just I asked Well, you just wanted to show like, did you know? Yeah. Did you know? I asked I asked the question cuz I thought you were letting us know like, hey, did you guys know this? I know this. Did you guys know? I wasn’t I saw it and I was like, I heard this. Okay, we’re good. Do you guys know she’s pregnant? Fair enough. Yeah. I thought you like, oh, did you guys know this? Cuz I know this. No, Kim Kardashian is not pregnant. Okay. It was a question. I don’t think I’m trying to make the Yeah, I don’t know. Run the tape back. Like the logic to Yeah, it was kind of like, do you guys know this? Ask if she was pregnant. I said, do you guys know if Kim Kardashian was pregnant? Run the tape back. That’s not what you said. That’s what That’s I’m pulling up the YouTube right now on my phone. Hold on. That’s what I meant. I don’t I didn’t see nothing about her being pregnant, but I saw a video of her pregnant. I said, “What? I feel like I would have heard about this.” I don’t know. I found an article from two weeks ago that says Courtney Kardashian slams follower who asked if she’s pregnant in vacation pick. Oh no. Not nice. Oh no. That’s all bad all the way around. I’m trying to She’s not pregnant. Who? Courtney. Yeah. I haven’t seen Courtney a long time. That show’s not on anymore, is it? It was on Peacock for a while, wasn’t it? So, I don’t know. I don’t know if it kept going or not. I don’t know. Peacock is the Love Island network, and it just raised its prices. They didn’t kick They didn’t kick uh any other reality show to the to the curb. Love Island cooking right now. Um yeah, the the the Warriors getting pushed in the bushes is hilarious. And TC’s right. Nah, bro. No, thank you. Thank you. Exactly what I thought. You said, “Did you guys know that Kim Kardashian is pregnant?” But like you heard it and like that’s a fact and like you’re like asking if we know like you know. Well, I’m I was asking as a question. I was asking it as a question. That is not a question. I’m telling you, I’m asking it as a question. Shut out. Did you know Kim Kardashian is pregnant? Yeah. Come on, man. No, no, no. Definitely. You brought it to this show. You know this show is recorded. That’s not a chatty house. I’m asking. Did you know Kim Carter? No, we didn’t. Exactly. Yeah, I didn’t know that. Casey, I’m asking. Two straight days. God. Well, that damn Kim C Tim Kawakami. Ah, that guy he he can leave me blocked. Are you the most inaccurate radio show host in history? I don’t think so. There’s got to be somebody more inaccurate. It’s got to be. There has to be. Poor Kim Kardashian just minding her own her own business. The video I saw was like it was a it was a she was pregnant. Well, from what I hear, there’s LeBron James pregnancy video. Now that I that Yeah, cease and desist for sure with that. That’s disturbing. That is disturbing. AI is terrible. It’s terrifying in one sense. In another sense, Kevin showed me a trick to where I could put that photo of us in front of the uh uh castle, the Disneyland castle in in my iPhone. I didn’t know how to do this. You you you could hit like a button and it takes the people away. Oh, so it looks like So, if you look at the picture, it’s just us. There’s people behind us. Like, I couldn’t remove them. Yeah. But there’s 20 people on each side of us. I was able to remove all of them. That’s uh and and you know, I’m team iPhone all day. But that’s a that’s a old feature of the Androids. I remember Magic Johnson in that one of those commercials. They somebody was in the background of the picture and he taps a button and they’re gone. He goes, “Magic?” Yeah, right. Like Magic was using an Android. I really got to upgrade my iPhone X because I didn’t even know that technology existed on these iPhones. iPhones do a lot right now. I just learned that you can program an emo. I think Sean Cunningham showed me this like on accident that you can you can type in what type of like emoji you want and it’ll create it. Like like I didn’t know that one. I I for you know Katie’s got this thing with raccoons. So I wrote like show me a like sad raccoon. A raccoon crying popped up. Oh my goodness. As an emoji. As an emoji. Oh, it’s amazing. Oh. Then I saw I had no idea that was going Then I saw what was it? It was I think it I don’t know if it was just a a feature on an Instagram account or if it was the actual Instagram account, but it’s like uh uh what is it called? rewriting history and they show Jordan’s last shot in Chicago except the whistle blows because they say he pushes off Russell and he misses the shot and he turns around to yell at the ref. It looks like game footage. That’s ridiculous. It does. It looks That is crazy. It Yo, you’ve got to see. You said it’s a Twitter uh account. No, I saw it on Instagram. Oh, that’s rewriting history. They showed they showed uh Yeah. Jordan does the pushoff and the whistle blows. He gets the shot up. He misses, but he turns to yell at the official and then the video cuts off. I got to see this. It’s crazy. It’s like, oh, he missed. I got to remember when um didn’t Gator It wasn’t as like sophisticated, but Gatorade did the same thing when with like Jordan’s shots and he like missed the shot on Elo. Well, remember when they did it with Paul George’s shots, but he made them? Damn. Why? Why? Paul George is minding. They just had a new podcast. He did one with Isaiah Hardenstein. They were talking about the troubles of AU basketball. He’s not minding anybody or bothering anybody. Why would you do that? Paul George hit one buzzer beater in his life up to then and it was in that commercial. What did he say? Game time or I called games. I don’t know. Whatever it was, it was bad. Damn. It was bad. Were you talking about the commercial? Yeah. Oh, he said ball game. Oh man, Paul Pierce. If somebody finds this Michael Jordan thing, please send it to me. Wait, they I a Victor says they AI LeBron choking out Jr. after the buzzer. I need to see that video. I need to see that video. I absolutely need to see that. Um, all right. So, there’s there’s there’s stuff to talk about. We’re gonna we’re gonna break right here and get and get back on track. Jesse. Yeah. Okay. So, we’ll come back. Mark Spears has said Jonathan Kaminga wants to come to Sacramento. There have been significant financial offers put out there uh for Jonathan Kaminga and his team. Jonathan Kaminga has turned down a 2-year, second-year player option contract with the Golden State Warriors. All of this stuff has developed throughout the morning. What does it mean? It could mean absolutely nothing. Uh but conversations are obviously being had. Pieces are being put in place. What does this mean for your Sacramento Kings? We’re going to talk more about that when deal and Casey return here on Sacramento Sports Leader ESPN 1320. Ball game. See if I can find that. Uh, you ever hear the story uh Jeff Tal about told about CJ Miles, I think, showing him that commercial after Paul George missed a gamewinner or something like that. I don’t think I heard they I think Yeah, Jeff T was talking about they were in the playoffs or something like that. CJ Miles took a game winner missed and Paul George after that was like, “Oh no, I need those shots.” One thing led to another. Yeah, he played the commercial for Jeff Teague after that. Hey guys, let’s try something real quick. Let’s let’s let’s try something there. We’ll do this during the commercial breaks. There’s these random stories that come across that I found. We’ll just read them during the breaks. The Guardians bullpen is wild. As part of MLB’s sports betting investigation, Guardians relief pitcher Emanuel Case was placed on nondisciplinary leave Monday through released August 31st. Case is the second Guardians pitcher to be sidelined due to gambling investigation. Jesus as his teammate Luis Ortiz was placed on the same leave on July 3rd. Imagine there’s got to be one more they’re looking for. Got to be. What is this? What do you do if your entire bullpen is like on this gambling conspiracy or whatever though? You might have to fold the team. What the hell is that all about? That’s what I mean. At that point, it’s like, okay, no, the entire Guardians bullpen was like actively like working against us or whatever. It’s like that’s different. Oh, here was an interesting one, and I’ll explain it all at the end. Mario Lemieux is trying to reacquire the Penguins four years after selling them. Mario Lemieux was known for many on ice miracles during his Super Mario days as a player. Now long retired, Lemieux is trying to achieve perhaps his greatest hockey feat. Lemieux, previously the Penguins majority owner and still minority partner in NHL team are making heightened push to regain controlling interest. According multiple reports, Fenway Sports Group, which acquired the Penguins in late 2021 for $900 million, then a league record, and has been insistent about not wanting to sell, has said it is interested only in bringing in a small passive minority partner. Only bring this up. Number one, you sold the team four years ago. Now you’re trying to buy back. That’s hilarious. But do you know who is working with Lemieux to also regain control? Uh, no. Regain or just work? Yeah, regain. So, I left a name out when I was reading this. Lemieux and his third angle. Josh Harris. Lemieux and his partner are trying to regain the Penguins. Not sure. We got five seconds though. Ron Burkel. Oh, yeah. Good luck, bro. Master I was trying to find that that video about where Jordan misses the shot. I’m looking to see if I was smart enough to save it. It doesn’t appear that I was. Uh I thought it might be on YouTube. Somebody might I can’t find it. I I I’ll keep trying to find it. I was I must have watched it 10 times. I don’t know how more of these haven’t popped up in my algorithm. You know, when you see something and you watch it like over and over and over, you just start getting getting those type of videos. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I’ll keep looking for it. But it was uh AI is wild, man. It really is. Uh okay, so if you’re just tuning in uh or you’re tuning in because you heard. Yeah, it appears there are some things going on. And the Kings are definitely in the news right now as stories continue to center around Jonathan Kaminga. What will the Golden State Warriors do? It seems like their two top suitors uh are the Phoenix Suns and the Sacramento Kings. They don’t consider they being the Golden State Warriors. Don’t consider either of them uh top suitors is they don’t like the potential returns uh for Jonathan Kaminga in any sign and trade situation. The Kings to this point have offered. We don’t know what the Kings have offered. What we do know is this really important piece in Sham Shirania’s article. Kaminga and his agent Aaron Turner. They’ve used July to explore their sign and trade options. The most significant negotiations have been with the Sacramento Kings and the Phoenix Suns getting proposals plural getting proposals up to four years approaching $90 million including a player option for the final season. Important final note in that Phoenix has made the most lucrative push via sign and trade. So he says he Sham Shirania it says proposals up to four years approaching $90 million. It’s clear based on the last sentence the four years approaching $90 million has come from Phoenix. for him to lump Sacramento in this conversation leads me to believe that Sacramento is at least in the vicinity of what Phoenix has offered whether it be uh we we put the number at 75. We we we feel there’s probably an offer of 75 million plus there just to be in the conversation. If it wasn’t in the vicinity, I assume Sacramento would be kept separate. Phoenix making the most lucrative offer with Sacramento also making a push but not as strong as Phoenix’s. Um Mark Spears said on ESPN television today on NBA today that Kaminga prefers Sacramento. He wants to go to Sacramento. Mark Spears went as far to say that Sacramento has told him he would be a starter here. he would get the minutes that he so desperately has been wanting to get in Golden State and he would have a very defined role for this team moving forward. We worked out for ourselves. Kaminga would be at the four. Obviously, Domas would be at the five. Keegan would be at the three. Zack Lavine would move to the two. You’d have Dennis Shruder at one. And until further notice, Demar De Rozan would be coming off the bench along with Malik Monk and uh Nick Clifford and and and Keon and however else this is filled out. Um all of these feels like all of these feel like very newsworthy developments. When the reporting on the Jonathan Kaminga situation started, uh, I think spearheaded by our buddy Matt George, I thought, well, this is cute. Like, it’s cool. Like, we had been asked for weeks like, what do you think the Kings chances are with Kaminga? And I won’t speak for you. I know. I was like, I don’t see a path. Like, it just doesn’t make sense. I don’t see a way that this can get done. So, there isn’t one. Mhm. Uh clearly there is and then it’s kind of, you know, sat around for the last month like all right, like they’re dabbling in the water. Like I don’t know how serious they are. This write up from Shams and those words from Mark Spears leads me to believe that the Sacramento Kings aren’t dabbling in the Jonathan Kaminga business. They want in on it. They just don’t want to make a trade with Golden State that hurts them in the long run, potentially makes their, you know, I80 rival better. And they don’t they don’t want to make an offer. They don’t have to. And I think that’s what we’re we we speculated on this earlier before we saw what Phoenix’s potential offer could be. We kept saying Phoenix doesn’t have anything to offer. Then we saw ESPN break down what Phoenix has. Like they really don’t have anything to offer. And if Golden State were to take Phoenix’s offer over Sacramento, they would be doing it just to be spiteful. That would be the only reason that they’re doing it. So these all feel like now whether this goes anywhere. Warriors are threatening to do this, they’re threatening to do that. Pull out of conversations and signing TRA. That’s great. Qualifying offers don’t have to be signed till October 1st. So you could do whatever you want to with that. This feels like something significant right here. Mhm. What what the reports that we got today from all parties that we just mentioned, this feels like a significant development. Yeah. And the other aspect, Kings, Kings Beam asked an an interesting question here. He said they I think he meant to say the Warriors, they can’t take the Suns offer without Kaming Kaminga sign it. If the Suns are offering more money, Yeah. But Kaminga really believes in what Scott Perry and BJ Armstrong have going on. There is an option and I don’t know it’s maybe the best option because now it’s going to put him in a different situation. But he could say, “Look, Phoenix or excuse me, Golden State. I know you like Phoenix’s offer a little bit more. I’m not I’m not signing that deal to make that happen. I want to go to Sacramento.” Once again, they could turn around and be like, “Well, you’re just gonna plan on a qualifying offer then or whatever.” Like, because we’re not gonna we think this is the best deal that helps our team and we’re trying to make that happen and see you get paid. We’re not necessarily in the business of take putting you exactly where you want to go. But that is that is an option. I would think once again the Warriors kind of need to be looking at this thing in my opinion of like let’s let’s move on with our off seasonason. We’re still trying to get guys like Al Horford. We’re we’re trying to get um Melton. Um, let’s worry about making sure our team is the best that it can be with this Jonathan Kaminga thing kind of being done at this point. Also, and they they don’t once again they don’t have an obligation for this, but the guy he said he wants to go to Sacramento. They’re willing to pay him. We’ll get some compensation back. Just just do that. Just do it. because this this situation is just it’s a it’s a loss all the way around if I’m the Warriors. I I’m I’ve lost at every turn in this particular situation. Let’s make the best of a bad situation. And yeah, that’s that’s kind of what I would be looking at right now if I was the Warriors. But they also could be saying, “Hey, we’ll just we’ll we’ll all go to hell together.” I have a Yeah, I I got I got another note I want to bring to your attention. Let’s see what Vince is talking about here. Uh hit us on the Elkrove Kia talk line 91691320. What’s up, Vince? Hey, two things. Um first thing is kudos to Scott Perry because he doesn’t have a gun to his head, so he might as well drive the best bargain he can. But one of you guys already said it. current state of the Kings roster is not terrible. So that means if you’re basically a 500 club and you make a risky move and blow it, you you can go backwards. It’s not like a 25 win team that can only go up, right? Yep. Yeah. No, great point. So, but you mentioned it, but no one’s really talking about that. You know, this isn’t this isn’t Charlotte. This is a team that’s not a contender, but they’re also not terrible. Yeah. Which is And then about Yeah. Go ahead, Vince. No, then I was going to say I had a comment about Keon Ellis. If if unless Yeah. Go ahead. Go ahead. So, here’s the thing. Keon Ellis is an asset. And if you can trade that asset, a 6-3 athletic guy who, let’s face it, we all love, but has some limited skill set for a for a two guard, including the fact that he’s a little small, and you can trade that and upgrade for a starter. Ellis is a bench guy. If you can get a starter who fills a need we’ve had for years, who’s just as athletic but five in bigger, I mean, I think that’s a no-brainer. if you end up having to throw him in. Now, Perry doesn’t have to do it. So, he’s waiting and waiting, but if Elvis goes, yeah, we’ll miss him. But how do you not say, “Let’s take a starter with that athleticism.” Yeah. Over a bench guy. I hear you, Vincent. I I I think I know why. If you’re moving on from Devin, you probably want that defender in the back court. You You don’t want to lose that. I’m guessing. Yeah. But that I mean I’m certainly, you know, playing fantasy GM here. Like that’s that’s I think that’s how I would be looking at it. Absolutely. I in my opinion any trade scenario is involving either or Deon or Keon because whoever is going that other person is going to step into that role and be that perimeter defender uh defense first type of guy. Um, I it it’s it’s perfectly fine that people look at Keon and don’t want to move on from him and understand the value that a player like Keon Ellis brings to the table. I if push came to shove, I would not make Keon Ellis untradeable in this situation. I wouldn’t like if if I really was locked in on Kaminga like I want this guy to be here in in Sacramento. And there’s also an aspect I believe of how I say Warriors like get on with your off seasonason and start getting your team together to do what you guys need to do next year. Kind of feel that way to a certain degree with the Kings. like what if maybe you just don’t care about the season, but if you do, like let’s let’s figure out how we can finish this up and and start moving forward with what we need to do. Like you said, another point guard signing may be being held up because of all this. Like there is still things that they need to take care of. The point guard signing being held up because of all of this. There are things that they need to take care of and let’s start moving towards getting this done so they can handle the other stuff. But I would not I just I Keon Ellis wouldn’t stop this deal for me. He He wouldn’t He wouldn’t stop this deal. Yeah. I want Keon here. I really do. But he wouldn’t stop. Let me Let me ask you this. This isn’t always the best way to go about it. Mhm. for their NBA career, who would you put your money on at the the better NBA career, the more productive NBA career numbers-wise? All this other stuff. Jonathan Kaminga or Keon Ellis? Uh, probably Jonathan Kaminga. I would too. Doesn’t mean it’s going to happen. Doesn’t mean Keon doesn’t play a Bruce Bowen type role on a championship team. I’m not saying that. But we’re talking about trading a player. I don’t I don’t know why that happened. About to say, what did the trade just happen? Did it plugging in my computer? I don’t know. I got so excited, too. Yeah, I guess. I said, well, wait. Of all the the buttons for the cursor to be on, and it was the air horns one. Sorry. At least it wasn’t on the OJS joint. No, it’s gotten enough run. Um, I I I still I still feel like you need players like Keon Ellis. Absolutely. Like we could talk about more productive players. Better or worse, I still feel like you really need players like Keon Ellis. Casey, would you move on from Keon if I guess put yourself in Scott Perry’s shoes like you think of him as a starter on your team next year after this season? If you think of Keon as a starter on your team? Yeah. like we’ll get off of Lavine and all that and Kos are starting to Would you still move off of Keon? I probably would just I mean I just look at I I look at what your the situation that you have in in Kaminga, a young guy um super high potential has already shown flashes of being a guy that given the opportunity can be a 20 plus per game scorer in this league. And I kind of feel like super versatile, super athletic. I kind of feel like that is a little bit more difficult to find than a guy like Keon Ellis. And I don’t mean that with any disrespect, but Keon’s, you know, scrappy guy that gets in there and plays defense. He plays at a super high level, but I feel like I feel like I can find that type of guy easier than I can find a Jonathan Kaminga. Mhm. So because of that, I I got this opportunity at a kaminga. I’m I’mma jump on that. I think another big part of of this this is all hypothetical obviously. Um not not what guys like Mark Spears, Anthony Slater, Shan Shauny, that’s what they said. That’s not hypothetical. Some of these scenarios that we’re laying out are are hypotheticals. And I think one thing that got Kings fans attention this morning was Mark Spears going on ESPN television and saying that Jonathan Kaminga prefers to play in Sacramento and that they have had extended conversations. They the Sacramento Kings have had extended conversations with Jonathan Kaminga and his agent about what his role will be here in Sacramento. And I know I think everyone knows, you know, Drew Down, Uncle Lon, the Warriors fans know Kyle Matson, everyone knows part of his frustration and goal to say is his role there. Uh he does not have a clearly defined role. I think one thing that is commonly known and understood regardless of how the owner feels about him by the way, no one is talking about ownership interfering in in in in players moves out there in Golden State. But we seem to know how the regardless of how the ownership feels about him, we sure as hell seem to know how the coach feels about him. And it’s, you know, you look at that and it’s like, all right, you’ve got this situation now where there’s a scenario where he wants to play in Sacramento. You’ve had extended conversations about his role. Part of it it again, Mark Spears did not stutter when he said this. It was like they have told him he can start here at the four spot alongside Domomas alongside Keegan at the three. We move Zack. We’re just working this out in our head and it seems that you move Zack Lavine to the two, you got Dennis at the one. Got it. That in this current incarnation moves Demar De Rozan to the bench. that obviously can can change and I do wonder if there is some sort of domino effect with a Jonathan Kaminga deal and things that happen next with Sacramento. I will not get off the fact that I think Russell Westbrook is going to sign here. But Demar De Rozan has played 16 years in the NBA. Demar De Rozan is one of the most respected players in the entire league. Mar Rozan was seen yesterday with Russell Westbrook at the Aces game. I don’t know. Demar De Rozan has played 1,187 games in his career. Do you know how many times he’s come off the bench in those 1,187 games? Three times. I don’t expect you to know. The answer is 12. I knew it was some like crazy little number. All 12 of them were 15 years ago in his rookie season. Wow. Wow. So, I just I just I just want and and let’s all let’s let’s also take a look. Demar D Rozan at 35 years old, 22 points per game. Uh Demar De Rozan at at at 34 years old, 24 points per game. Let’s move backwards. 24.5. Uh 24.5. 27.9. 21.6. this man’s production is not declining. So, I just I just want everybody to fully wrap their head around what we’re talking about when we talk about moving Demar D Rozan to the bench. Something that he has not done since 2009, not for a single game since 2009 of players whose skill set has not declined one bit. you’re going to go to that man and say, “Hey, you’re coming off the bench.” And and and and before you maybe you are, I just I think sometimes we say things so flippantly without any real purpose to what we’re saying. And I just want you to have full context for what we’re talking about when we just casually say, “Oh, you moved Demar De Rozan to the bench.” After 15 years of starting with no decline in play and being one of the most respected players in the league, you’re telling him you’re now coming off the bench. Jesse, I think you move him to a different team. And and and see that’s I think that’s the that’s the domino effect. I wonder is if that’s something that happens. Should something get done with Jonathan K coming to the Golden State Warriors and the Sacramento Kings, is is there something ahead for Demar De Rozan if he no longer fits in the starting lineup of the Sacramento Kings team? I I wonder that as well. I think that’s the most likely scenario. I would also I would also bring bring this to the table and I know a lot of the times talk about my negotiating skills and how I get cutthroat and all this other stuff. starting to punch him in the face. No, I’m not going to. Look, I’m not going to push the Rosen in the bushes. I’m not going to do that. Do you You’re going to push him somewhere. It sounds No, I’m saying and I only bring that up because I’m going to say this in the nicest way possible. I’m having a conversation with Demar. If I go to Demar and I said, “Look, we got this Jonathan Kaminga situation taken care of. Um, you know, he’s coming here. We want him to start. We want you to stay here in Sacramento and be a part of what we’re doing. and being a part of what we’re building and teaching these young guys. We think it’s extremely valuable. We want you here to be fair to you. I want to be real and say, “Look, we’re not going to have you in the starting lineup. We want you to come off the bench.” Now, Demar De Rozan at that point says, “I don’t want to come off the bench. I’ve only come off the bench 12 times in my NBA career.” I heard DLo talking about that on the show, and that’s when I realized, damn, I really have only been off the bench 12 times. I don’t want to do that. I would say understandable. Demar, I’ll allow you and your agent to find a trade partner and find a trade partner that will start you and you want to play there. So, for instance, you probably could start in New Orleans. If starting is what matters the most to you, you can start probably start in New Orleans. Maybe you could start in Miami. you want to move cross country and le in Florida, you could start there and we’ll we’ll work out a deal. You could start in um Philadelphia maybe if you want to go there and we can work out a deal. Cool. But what Demar is thinking about potentially of Yeah. Send me to uh send me to the Clippers so I can start there and try and win a championship. I don’t know if that’s available, Lamar. Right. So, if it’s just about starting, we can find somewhere for you to go start. And I or you and your agent, I’m sure, can just find somewhere for you to start. But you probably not going to be in California. I can get close to LA. I’m not saying we’re going to be playing meaningful basketball, but you probably won’t be playing meaningful basketball. But you will be able to start. I don’t know. On the bar, that east is looking pretty weak. Maybe me, Bam, and Hero can do something. Maybe. Maybe. If you want to go and start, we can let’s let’s get Pat Riley on the phone. Have him take a break from uh searching for all the memorabilia they lost. And one of the biggest heists in sports history, I think they called it. He can pause from that and talk to us about a deal. Well, maybe if he just stopped throwing things on tables during negotiations, stuff wouldn’t get stolen. Miami seems like a scenario where I think it could help the Kings and also DeMar um situation if he wanted to go somewhere else. Maybe you can get like a high May Hawk here and I don’t know what the salary looks like otherwise back figure it out but give up a pick for Jonathan Kaminga which we are adamant you can you can give up a first round pick for Jonathan Kaminga especially if it’s next year get it back for Miami. Norm brings up a good point too. They got they got Norm Powell though too. So I mean if you’re selling it to Demar like it’s a better I don’t think you have to sell not sell it but she’s a decent situation he’s going to it’s like it’s not like starting that’s the case but here’s the thing Dear starts in Miami I think so too. Yeah but I also Dear is a guy and this this is this this is what we’re talking about like we haven’t deviated from this. I think Dear especially since it’s you know only been a year things kind of went the way that they went last year. Demar’s also a guy you don’t just trade. Like, hey man, we got a first round pick from Washington. You have It’s like, hey, let’s work together. What do you want to do here? Like, give us, you know, the I hate that. Give us the old proverbial list. Who do you want us to call? Who do you want us to talk to? And let’s try to work together. One, let’s one, let’s work together. I don’t know who his agent is, whoever it is. Um, is it Jeff? Good one. Oh. Oh, yeah. Aaron, good one. Uh, have Aaron contact whoever like you you we could we could all work together. You have our permission to to seek trades and we’ll we’ll we’ll try to get something done. We can’t, you know, we can’t die trying to get this deal done, but we’ll we’ll work with whoever you want us to work with to try to get this done. And and remember, tomorrow, we want you here. We’re not trading you because we want to just, you know, take you out the pasture or something like that. like we want you to be here, but you’ve expressed the importance of starting somewhere and that’s not something that we’re able to provide for you right now. Would you guys do Tara Roser and Himez for tomorrow? Terry is probably not going to be playing much for you, but he’s an expiring deal this year. Uh, I would I would. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. I once again take a chance on Jame Hawz and say maybe Yeah, I guess there’s money that has to match. You can’t just trade them for You’re bringing in Terry, but like I said, Terry seems like he’s got some Gilbert and Reena’s problems. Well, that works for Yeah, Kings might be able to get that voided. Kings get that Kings get the deal done. All of a sudden, the investigation gets a little stronger. Start calling in some people. Hey, look into this acquisition we just made. We We really don’t want to We really don’t want to deal with this. So, let’s try to get it done. I was trying to get So I I hear what you’re saying, man, and I agree. Like you I think people talk about Demar and in a real flippant way out here. And um that’s a damn good ball player who’s still very very productive. And regardless of what people think, I think he can still help help you win games, whether he’s with the Kings or somewhere else. Mhm. So, uh, Elro Kia talk line if y’all want to talk. 916991320. Uh, we’ll continue to dissect all of this new information that we got, uh, courtesy of Mark Spear, Sham Shirani, and Anthony Slater regarding the situation involving Jonathan Kaminga, the Golden State Warriors, the Sacramento Kings, and the Phoenix Suns. James Ham will be with us uh, a little bit over an hour from now. It’s the KC here on Sacramento Sports Leader ESPN 1320. I finished watching the show on Netflix. It was pretty underwhelming for what I thought it was going to be. I saw the last episode, maybe the last two episodes and it just just kind of ended like it was they had the little twist and I was like six out of 10 show five out of 10 shows five. It’s a It seemed like it was a lot of shows to get to that type of conclusion. What was it? Eight. Eight episodes. Something like that. Eight or seven. I think could have been four. That was a little bit of a twist though. That was Yeah. I tried watching this, too, but I just realized I just do not care about these guys personal lives. I started watching Unreal yesterday. I didn’t finish. Is that the WWE show? Yeah. Okay. How was that? Pretty good. It was It was pretty good. It was pretty good. I I struggle a little bit with, you know, pulling the curtain so far back. You know, I obviously all know what it is, but sometimes I I don’t want to see how the sauce is made. Like I don’t need to know everything. Every ingredient that you have. I love chicken nuggets, but I don’t want to see how you make them. They’re fire. Uh forks over knives shows you. It’s pretty bad. Oh, how they do it? Yeah. Yeah. Like it exists. I know that footage is out there, but whatever. Yeah. I’ll take a 20 piece, two sweet sour, and a medium fry, please. I don’t want to know. And I’ve actively tried not to find out my entire life. I’ve accepted my fate. But it so I didn’t I didn’t get a chance to finish because it just got late. I was dozing off just because I was tired, not because it was bad. But um yeah, it was it was cool. Yeah, I’m going to watch that today probably. I’m starting to learn why you stay up late to watch shows. Why is that? Oh, cuz you don’t get a chance to during Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, here’s more news with KC. Yeah, Jesse, you might know. Is it real news or like KC news? Like, is your like the National Inquirer? I’m assuming this is real news. You want to like fact check this? Maybe. Every assumption is that it’s real news. Look at Jerry. Oh boy. Tell that boy. Oh Um, MLS suspends Lionel Messi and Jordy Alba for skipping the Allstar game. Oh yeah, that’s real. Go ahead and do whatever you want, MLS. Like, even the biggest scars in Major League Soccer aren’t immune from league discipline. Whatever. Wow. You put your foot down. Great. Like, just be grateful he’s there. I asked the question like, has that worked out? Um, because I haven’t heard anything from the MLS. Exactly what I said would be when it started. Messi like it’s going to be cool because he’s there now. People will watch. Once Messi’s gone, it’ll go back to what the MLS was. Did you see that? They And I think this is a failure. I got to read more into this. I’m not in the soccer world, so I don’t know. But they’re they want to move towards the traditional schedule of fall to spring. Well, yeah, they should. I think in America that is a bad idea. Well, I think that’s why they don’t, but it’s just you want to be on par with these other leagues around the world and stuff like that makes playing in these tournaments like I guess I don’t know if it’s still called Conquer Cap Champions League, but things like that, the club tournaments cuz MLS teams, they struggle in that tournament. I think it’s just their excuses that the way the schedules are and stuff like that, but it’ll help you with those things. So you like you said the weather would be bad probably. Well just you you sacrifice that so you can get on board with everyone else the rest of the world like they should be doing but they would die in America. Yeah, there’s that. But I think attendance. So I didn’t want to read this during the commercial break for a couple of reasons. I don’t know if this is a talking thing or not, but I’m also just convinced I’m I’m an idiot and can’t read this correctly. Does Logan Webb have 10 strikeouts right now? It’s the fourth inning and I have the box score already then. Yeah, I have the box score pulled up and I’m like, it says he struck out 10. Like, that can’t be right. I have the game on in front of me. I haven’t really been that tapped into it, but yeah, I guess we check out we don’t have to read about the latest Michael Parsons issue at training camp. We can turn the game on. Yeah, you you can turn the game on and ruin it if you want to because they all right. No, I’ll leave it off. It’s fine. No, it’s fine. I won’t watch Giants baseball anymore. This is what I was going to say. Turn it on. Do whatever you want. The season’s over. Who cares? Who gives a damn? The fact that these guys stink now. The fact that they’re a 500 team is crazy. Come on. They’re the bad news Bears right now. Like you watch baseball the mistake. They’re the bad news Bears. Uh what what Shaq always be telling them? Play the Washington General sound, Kenny. I mean, they’re they’re running on infield fly rules. They’re they’re dropping uh fly balls in center field between the left fielder and the center. It is a comedy of errors. It feels like we’re getting two tweets a game now about Ramos at this point. Oh my gosh, man. This is ridiculous. This this is this is disappointing. I can understand not being ready to uh compete for the NLS championship. I understand that this was something that Farhon did so much damage. It may take a year or two to be able to compete with the Dodgers and the Padres’s in that respect. But the way that they’re going out just like a comedy of errors. He’s got 10 strikeouts through four. That’s crazy. Rocklin’s finest. That is crazy. Somebody please help him out. Well, they got a run on Giants fighting for their lives against the Pittsburgh Pirates. Pirates, bro. Paulsky’s not even pitching this year. Oh, they’re about to get swept or potentially get swept by the the the Pirates at home. That would mean in the last two months you got swept by the Marlins and Pirates at the crib. Come on. Yeah, they lost seven straight at home. Come on, man. Come on. And they’ve and off the top of my head they’ve lost nine of 10 because they’ve lost seven straight then went two or three against the uh the Dodgers lost nine of 10 at home. Quite imagine they traded for de at least that’s a bright spot though. A lot of L’s three seven the trade for de they’ve lost 10 of 12 overall. They just have fallen apart mentally. That’s the killer. the mental errors, the the lack of communication, the lack of paying attention to detail is it’s embarrassing. There’s no other way to put it. You think it’s a team or it’s a manager that’s lost his team? Could be. Could be. I mean, because if you got like it’s it’s like we joke about the tweets and stuff, but it really is kind of embarrassing just the way they’re playing right now and all the mistakes making. It’s not basic baseball and to me it’s like I wonder how much of that not locked in. M don’t have them locked in. And even if it is a locker room that um the manager has lost, have some personal pride. What are you doing, Elio Ramos? That’s my boy, too. That’s my boy. He can go. But how many base running errors are you going to have in a week? How how many uh Jung Hu Lee, when are you going to take command of center field and make sure what happened in Atlanta last week never happens again? It’s just like we said a comedy air that’s disappointing because there’s there was that calls yesterday you got to pull Ramos out. He just doesn’t have he’s not mentally there or whatever playing the game or whatever. You got to pull him out and Bob Melvin or leaves him in and all that. Like how how does that affect I guess like other guys playing hard and stuff like that. They’re seeing these mistakes but it’s like there’s no accountability. Well, by the way, we turned the game on in here and Web is starting to get rocked. I’m just going to go back to I thought you changed it back. No, I didn’t. Kenny said I could turn it on. It doesn’t matter. No, it’s fine. It doesn’t matter. It’s fine. I want to watch Michael Parsons. Oh, yeah. Dude’s jogging to the jogging to the dugout right now. No, it’s fine. She’s going to watch NFL live for the seventh goddamn time. Solid contact, too, right there on that. Logan Web was like the immaculate inning for the first three innings. And then we turned it on here and they just back. Well, we turned it on. We We turned it on. We We were on the game for less than five minutes. Pittsburgh Pirates. It was one zero San Francisco. Now it’s 1-1. Just forget it. I’m never watching Giants baseball again. Ever. Yeah. I look, man, it’s it’s disappointing the way they’re losing. That’s that’s the frust. They can’t That’s bad. And they just can’t pay attention to detail. And that’s that’s upsetting. They just got the lead runner out right now. They did. No, that really got it all right. Shout out to Zo Change. Hey, you’re really bad luck, bro. Nice little ground ball to short stuff. Nice heads up play by William Thomas. Some good fundamental baseball by the San Francisco Giants. You know what? It’s fine. I’ll just go back to watching my Mariners. It’s fine. Give me the Give me the baseball pass log in. Hey, MLB TV is That’s good stuff right there. It’s lit. It’s lit. And the condensed game and that you can TV the network is really good. That’s the best. Yeah. ML or not MLB TV network, MLB the network is really really good. That’s the best uh that’s the best sports league station and it’s not even really close. It’s not even really close. NFL Network is just the PR channel for the league. Well, it is. It’s owned by the like that. It’s it’s staterun media. That’s what it is. While we’re here, just two seconds. Any thoughts on people talking about this potential deal with ESPN, Disney, buying NFL Network and and Red Zone? Uh, it makes sense. Um, yeah, it makes sense. I feel like the NFL Network has always had valuable properties. Good Morning Football is a fantastic show. It’s one of the best shows on in the morning. May be the best show on in the morning. Um, of course it’s only football, so like, you know, if you’re trying to you’re not going to get any Clifford highlights over there, but you don’t get those on Sports Center anyway, so what’s it matter? Um, I’m sure there’s something wrong with it, but I truthfully don’t care. like it’s going I have a bigger issue with it being owned by the NFL than I do ESPN because like Good Morning Football is not going to cover that collusion story, right? Like they’re not going to discuss this thing like indepthly with the players. You Hell, Chev did it. I don’t even know if SHF ever did it. I don’t even know if he acknowledged it. Yeah. like he might have reported on uh uh how and Troder and those guys being out of of of their positions, but I don’t know that he ever truly discussed what was happening. Like Sher is staterun media, but he’s not. He chooses to be. Ian Rapaort actually is like he’s paid by the NFL to cover the league. So I I don’t really have a problem with it. I know a lot of people were upset with um like, “Oh man, ESPN now going to ruin NFL coverage and all this other stuff.” And one of the things I don’t I I didn’t I still don’t I should say understand is why people get so worked up about ESPN. ESPN is 24 hours of programming. And we can go back and forth about like the merits of this show getting criticized or not or anything, but we’re talking about one show that people look at as ESPN ruining things, right? We’re talking about First Take. The Countdown shows aren’t great either. Which countdown show? NBA. I feel like it’s all just gotten kind of stale. I think the issue with ESPN is just more so like it’s just the only game in town. I mean, FS1 is out there. But let’s be real, nobody watches that. Like ESPN, I feel like this content just got kind of stale and it’s just the same thing over and over and over and I just think people need variety. But I don’t know if it is though. Like we’re talking about one Get Up and First Take are about the same. Do you think NFL Live is like First Take People are watching or NBA today? No. Or like we’re talking we’re talking about one maybe two shows and I don’t even know that that’s what we’re talking about. I think we’re talking about a person. Yeah, I I think we’re talking about a person who if you put Stephen A on first take, it’d be fine. But you don’t. You put Stephen A on first take, then you put him on Countdown, then you put him on like seven different sports centers and it gets to a point where during the basketball season, you can’t turn on your television without seeing Stephen A. Smith. And I think that causes a level of resentment towards him. And and it c I think it causes a level of resentment towards him and it causes a massive level of resentment towards the company because it’s like look if Stephen A is not my bag. I do not enjoy him. I haven’t respected him in a really long time. But I I can’t turn that network on now without seeing him. If I want to watch Scott Vampel, I probably have to watch Stephen A. Smith, too. I could watch NFL Live. I could watch that. I can watch NFL Countdown. That’s all fine. Like those those shows are fine. But NFL uh Sunday Countdown really isn’t all of the There’s to me there’s no morning there’s no Sunday Countdown show that stands out. Not Fox, not CBS. They’re all kind of the same to me. They all follow the a similar formula and it’s not no one none of the personalities, you know, outside Randy Moss. I was happy to read that he’s he’s back. I don’t think it’s like I think Alex Smith is good. Really good, but outside that I I my personal whatever outlook I think the the ESPN show is fantastic. I think they’re the best out of the bunch. That Sunday Countdown, he gets a little stupid sometimes and he probably got like Stephen A type issues that people have with him. But when he really talks about football, I think Rex Ryan is really good. I think he does a really good job on there. Yeah, but he gets bit by the ESPN bug sometimes. He got He did pretty bad last year. I know that last year he had some crazy takes over. You’re right. You’re 100% right. When Rex is talking football, it’s interesting. But then he’ll he’ll he’ll he he’ll want the social media clip where he calls he was calling players trash. Yeah. For Didn’t he say one of the jobs was basically his Giants? I think was it is that what it was? Might have been the Giants. Like the job’s basically mine. What? All right, spoiler alert. It was not. But my I guess my thing is, by the way, uh inning ending double play by Logan Way here to get out of things and you know stays at one. I’m tell you change the channel fundamental play of third. Get him out. Turn two here. We’re good. Like I don’t know what to say at this crazy. Oh yeah. Like like all the mistakes we talking about bad news bears, all that went out the window as soon as you flipped the channel. Oh man. But I think like I said, Lewis Riddick is on right here. They’re seem They seem to be having a sensible conversation about the NFL right now and it just the outlook on ESPN seems to get lumped in with like things that people see on Twitter every now and then. You’re not wrong about NBA Today and NFL Live. I think those are their best two shows by far. But like look at the times that they’re on. Like over here, everyone’s at work. Over on the East Coast, we talked about the other day, like people aren’t really tapped into what’s going on till like later on in the night. Like they do have those two shows, but ESPN don’t even really feature them. I feel I But I feel like they put everything else, the stuff that people are really kind of sick of at the forefront a lot more now. Some people like Pat McAfee. I don’t think he’s I’m not the craziest fan of his. It’s fine. Like I don’t not like it, but he comes through and people people seem to like his stuff. I I don’t know. I just I didn’t think the NFL coverage was going to be or is going to be if this goes through like go down the tubes because it’s on ESPN and everybody Oh, it’s not. Everybody thinks that once you get with ESPN and Disney, they ruin everything. Ah, I don’t see it that way. I do think once we get NBC Sports like doing their basketball stuff and Amazon, that’ll be a lot better, I think, for everyone involved. I was mad NBC Sports Network went away. I wish they might be back. Is that really? No. Yeah, it might be back. That’s that’s facts. Like that’s actually not. Yeah. I I was mad that went away. I I like I like there’s nothing sens. But there’s talk now. Okay. All right. Well, hopefully baseball’s not on it cuz I can’t watch it anymore. Yeah. Giants baseball. You’re done. You’re that you don’t care if they go on strike or not cuz you can’t watch the games. Actually, put the game on real quick. I want to see some. No. No. No. I don’t I for nothing else. I don’t want to do that to my boy Logan Web. Rocklin, stand up. I ain’t gonna do that to my man. Shout out Rockland Thunder. Um, that was another TV note that we had. Jesse put another TV note. What? Trace McGrady going to NBC. Tracy McGrady. That’s what it was. Basketball coverage. That’s what it was. T-Mac. I like hearing T-Mac talk about basketball. I like T-Mac. I don’t think I’ve heard T-Mac in a formal setting before. like he’s done he’s done NBA today but as like a guest I’ve never heard him in a when he does interviews and stuff he talks a little loose like Tak is not like all like buttoned up and full he’s got personality he can be really good he could be you know everybody always gets compared to to Charles so I don’t want to do that but if somebody if somebody doing something he doesn’t like he’ll it feels like he’ll say it I think he might be He’s he’s NBC as a studio guy, right? Or or is it a game analyst? I think he No, I think he’s studio. Okay. Yeah, studio. You know who he kind of might remind me of is like um he might be like Gary Sheffield if you like Gary. Yeah, he was good. Yeah, Gary talked that talk. So, I feel like that might be what Tracy McGrady ends up being like. Tracy Mcgreet, I don’t know the right way to phrase this, but I feel like his legacy has kind of been one like a player like it’s turned up since he retired. I feel like people a lot more now. Like they’ll talk up Tracy McGrady where like I guess not like he wasn’t like this great player or whatever, but like I feel like his legend is starting to grow a little bit more like, oh yeah, like team Mac was one of them like one of those guys for this period of time or whatever. He was like Kobe. He was like so and so. I think every once in a while people need to be reminded Tracy McGrady was really was a top say top five. I was going to say top three player in the league. Led the league in scoring a couple. Yeah, he’s like Tracy was incredible. How Casey says that kids talk about like or players now young players some like Paul George. I feel like that’s how players back then talk about Trace McGrady I guess or just that generation. Well, I was I don’t remember if I was talking or just actually might have just been when you weren’t here and I was talking to myself, but you know, oh, it was I had said something about LeBron being the, you know, the greatest ever. And it I I guess people were listening for the first time ever and didn’t know that I felt that way. And it, you know, started a conversation about LeBron and Mike and and and as I like reflected on that conversation, I I you know, when you talk about the greatest player of all time, I really do I do think you’re talking about those two. And you know, you you start ranking things like uh you know, impact and you know, you you can change different words from you know, greatest of all time to most influential of all time. And as I started to think about influence, it’s like, well, Mike is one, but I think Kobe’s second. I think he is, too. And I want to put LeBron next, but Allan Iverson is staring me dead in my face. And I don’t I don’t know whether to put I don’t I think LeBron’s influences on a business side. Like I’ve I’ve I’ve always maintained my next chapter doesn’t happen if I’m not I’m taking my talents to South Beach doesn’t happen. Like I I think there was a I I think you could make a very fair argument that LeBron James ushered in the player empowerment era, but man, when you look at I mean, even you you start throwing in Steph and what he’s done with like a particular play on a basketball floor, I start to wonder how far down that list LeBron falls. And again, you can make arguments everywhere, but the main thing that stood out to me is Mike is definitively number one because kids who never saw him play rock his logo. That’s influence. I think Kobe’s second. Well, before the tragic ending to his life, I think Kobe is second, right? And that’s where you get into is Steph next? Is AI next? Is LeBron next? like how do you when you talk about influence, LeBron starts to fall a he he could fall a little bit further down that list, but if nothing else, it’s not a twoperson conversation like the greatest of all time might be. Yeah. And I I’m I’m with you on that. I agree with you for sure. Just because of the nature in my opinion, the nature of LeBron’s game. I mean, there’s not it’s it’s a lot of power, brute force, skill for sure, but it’s not there’s not any real defining qualities of of LeBron’s game, at least on the offensive. His most defining quality is probably the chase down block. You know what I mean? That that people might try and replicate um throughout the years. Whereas Kobe has fadeaways, his crossovers, his dunks. Same with Jordan. Same with Iverson. Steph has a three ball and all that other stuff. So when you talk about influence in that way that lives on for for generations, LeBron might trickle trickle down that list just a little bit. I don’t think he falls out of top 10, but I don’t think he trickles down a little bit. Um, Bmani Jones had an interesting Did you see his his uh comment about if you could if you had to pick a basketball player, he he was he’s ranking the I don’t know. He’s doing something about the this um top 20 players in all the sports or from 2000 something something like that. and he got to talking about Kevin Durant. Mhm. And he said, “If you lined up all the basketball players that ever played and you start picking teams and you take the centers out of it, because that’s just a different equation because they’re centers.” He said is probably Jordan. He’s settled on LeBron, Kevin Durant. Like, that’s who he is as a basketball player. I probably would I might put I might put Kobe and Durant ahead of LeBron. That doesn’t mean I think they’re better players than LeBron, but their skill set Kobe keep on that sticks with me when somebody said one time like 05 to08 Kobe. Yeah, there might not have been a better player that ever played. More complete player. He could do everything. He was like a 99 club type player. One MVP is absurd. Yeah, it’s absolutely absurd. He could do everything. And that always sticks in my head cuz that person was right. Like he could do everything. Mike couldn’t even shoot the three ball like Kobe could shoot the three ball at that particular time. But Kevin Durant, like I got him in my top 10 list, but man, should he be hired one day? Kevin Durant is insane. He’s 10 right now. Go get another ring. Damn. [Music] He’s 10. I mean, that’s good. Would you in that scenario taking the centers out of the equation, would it would he be like a top three pick that you would make like trying to pick a team? Kevin Durant. Yeah. Yeah. He’s one of the greatest scorers of all time if not I think so. It might just be Mike. He’s one of the most unique players the league has ever seen. Like Steph is one of the most skilled players we’ve ever seen. LeBron’s probably the most complete player we’ve ever seen. Durant, like there’s no comp. There isn’t. And when Durant came out of Texas, there was there was no he’s like it was just like, “Hey, this kid out of Texas.” Well, I don’t even you can point out a player that plays now. I was like, “Oh, yeah, that’s Kevin Durant right there.” No, there the way there’s nobody that plays like him. Even the guys that are tall that can move that we see like even somebody like somebody’s mentioned Wimby in there. Wimby’s tall and can move. He’s not like Kevin Durant though. Kevin Durant is 61 almost 7 foot and moves like Kyrie damn near like that. That’s we ain’t never seen nothing like that. The fir I remember the first time I saw Kevin Durant in person. It was his rookie year at the All-Star game. he came to the Nike suite. It was the first time I looked at a basketball player and thought he’s really awkward. Like because he’s he he’s just so long. Like his arms go on forever and he wore a shirt that barely it was like a graphic tealightike shirt that barely went to his waist with like skinny jeans. You know, this is rookie year Durant. This isn’t, you know, half a billion dollars later. Kevin Durant. Not that his style has changed much, but still like he’s what a he’s just a awkward looking guy. If he gets his two rings with a completely different team, I think he’s higher on that all time list. If he gets to four, he’s one of the greatest players of all time. He’s absolutely punished by winning rings with the Warriors. Like he’s absolutely punished, which is it’s such a it’s just it’s not real. Like the it’s it’s acting like Steph would have four rings without Kevin Durant is insane. He’s a 15 time all-star, 11 time all NBA rookie of the year MVP, two-time finals MVP, two-time All-Star MVP, top 75, four time scoring champ and those other years he wasn’t a scoring champ. He’s probably top three a lot of those years. And he’s one of those guys that where he goes, it shifts the balance of power in the league that or at least Phoenix is probably the one place it didn’t, right? But he goes to Golden State. It’s just it changes everything. He goes to Brooklyn, instant title contenders. Does he get that ring if his foot’s not on the line? I think for that one shot, man, there’s a good argument for it. And if he does get that ring, what are we talking about today? Yeah. Not this. Yeah, we’re not talking about this. Where would he Okay, so let me ask you this. Because that’s his team. Like he they won’t acknowledge that that that Warriors that that that Warriors team was Stephss, but he was the best player on it. That Brooklyn team was his. To me, it doesn’t play a factor, right? Like I got him at 10 all time. I don’t I don’t move him ahead of Steph or anything else like that, but I also don’t knock him for having the two titles with the Warriors. Like, he’s a two-time NBA champion and he’s a top 10 player because of that. For others, do you think say they have him at 10 as well? If he wins that one, is he above Kobe? He’d be a top five player all time. He’d be top five. Honestly, I if he got that ring in Brooklyn, like I got him top 10, too. If he had the ring in Brooklyn, I’d have him top five. thing. Like if you go to his like just his basketball reference page and just look at his numbers and just everything. It’s it’s insane. Like if he had that ring and that’s what he needed to if he were to get that ring with Brooklyn, that would have shut everyone up about the Warriors. That would have answered everyone’s questions. All right, KD can do it. Blah blah blah. He’s the bus driver, not the bus rider, whatever they call it. Like that would have answered everything because he has he has all everything you need right now. That’s that’s your list. So, I can’t speak, but that that can’t get him ahead of Kobe and Steph and Shaq if he’s the greatest scorer of all time. I wonder about Shaq. That feels disrespectful. They’re similar players in the regards of like Shaq Durant was dominant in a different way. You couldn’t guard him. Hell, I don’t know that you can guard him today. Right. Right. Like, who do you guard him with? Like, how do you He’s gonna get whatever. What are you doing? Shaq’s dominant in a different way. Sha Shaq’s just just once again. Yeah. Like Shaq is just a most dominant damn near athlete I think I’ve seen in my lifetime. Not for as long as a period as I think he could have been, but but certainly for a stretch to where I will never forget watching Shaquille O’Neal play basketball. Uh we’ll come back. I guess that was our break from the Sacramento Kings. James is going to join us at the top of the 3:00 hour. Uh I I don’t know if things have been happening today, but people have certainly been talking uh including our buddy the Hall of Famer Mark Spear saying Jonathan Kaminga wants to come and play in Sacramento. There’s very specific reasons why. We’ll talk about that. It’s Steel with KC brought to you by Sky River Casino on Sacramento Sports Leader ESPN 1320. Shout out WCW. Almost got lost in that group text. I know. I got to get caught up. Sean Shawn Michaels is Magic Johnson, by the way. He a little out of pocket a couple times, but hold on, man. Hold on, bro. That is not who Kobe is. Yeah, I let him I I let that one be like, no, I let that one be. Yeah. Yeah. Sean is definitely Magic Johnson, though. Steph is Rollins calling Luca Otises. That’s That’s nasty. That’s not very nice. Hey, um next week 13th round, we’ll be back. So, we’ll kick it over with Casey. Is Twitter down or is it just me or is it just the app on on here? Let’s let’s try something different. Let’s go to the news, too. H okay. Eagles turn to their fans as they consider future stadium plans. Amid an accelerating stadium boom in the NFL, the defending Super Bowl champion Eagles are taking further steps to determine their own facilities future. Quote, “I love outdoor football. I love cold games,” Lorie said in February. On the other hand, Philadelphia deserves to host a Super Bowl, NCAA Final Four, and lots of great events. It’s an incredible sports city. Does it deserve it? Yes. So, we have to balance all those things out. End quote. I like outdoor football. I don’t want I don’t want the entire league. If you play If you play in an area where elements can give you an advantage, I don’t like putting a dome there. No, I don’t want the I I don’t want all of football going to to do. I don’t want that. It’s going to be It’s going to be a little boring. Not going to be worse. I’m not going to say that. It’ll be a little boring. Well, the Bills are building their new stadium. They they elected not to have the the roof. They’re stupid. Well, they have a covering over the over the uh some of this the seats, so it’s not going to be like it was, but the field it’s outdoor stadium still, but they can never have the NCAA men’s basketball. True. They’ll stick with the first and second rounds. They get those. What you need, Charlie? Need something for me or you just chilling? I would actually go talk to you and deal. So, keep talking. Charlie in the house. Charlie. Oh, here we go. We’re coming right back. Is this a short break? Yeah, we’re back. Oh, wait. I’ll leave. I’ll come back. Sorry, Charlie. I’ll come back later. Okay. Charlie clearly waiting to speak to us. He’s like, “Is this a short break?” Yeah, we’re back. Oh, all right. Um, God, it it’s been an eventful day with just words. That’s it. Like nothing’s actually happened, but it feels like a lot has happened. I’ll say this, one thing that has absolutely happened from a personal perspective, I guess my opinion on what the Sacramento Kings are doing in this Jonathan Kaminga conversation is completely changed. I I thought they were looking at a situation where they were like, “Hey, maybe we could take advantage of this. Hey, we like him. He’s a good young player. Like they don’t want him. Maybe we could do something here.” Mhm. That’s how I felt going and and then I also felt like look, they don’t have a problem walking away from this, right? I don’t feel that way anymore. I don’t think Scott Perry is interested in doing something that he considers a bad move or a bad step for the franchise. But I think my true understanding of the Sacramento Kings interest in Jonathan Kaminga um was put on display today. I did not real like to me it is very clear the Sacramento Kings aren’t just on the outskirts interested in Jonathan Kaminga. They want Jonathan Kaminga to be a part of this basketball team and they have a very specific role for him and they want to use him as a piece to build out post Demar Lavine, you know, some of these guys like they want to take a step to perhaps building the next chapter of their future right now and they want to do that with Jonathan Kaminga. Does, you know, feeling this way about it now, does it change how aggressive you think they should be to to get a deal done? It’s a little different. It’s a little different because I feel like the king publicly we know the Kings and the Suns. If there’s a third team or a fourth team or a fifth team, but who side are they on? The Kings have to know that. Yeah. The kings have to know who that is and they have to weigh themselves against them. They also have to weigh Kaminga’s interest in them. Mark Spear said on television today that Jonathan Kaminga wants to come to the Sacramento Kings. Okay. In the same conversation, we looked at what Phoenix has to offer. the Golden State. Dear Warriors talk, Dubs world. You think Carter and Sich is bad? Go take a look at what Phoenix can throw your direction. You want a bunch of second round picks. Hey, salute. But you could get a young rookie player that really is, and I and I’ve tried to take this mentality with him. don’t know exactly what Devin Carter is in the league. I’m not a fan. You were a little bit more of a fan at the end of the year than I was. Like you see the game a little bit different. So I I’ll lean on you for that. But eh, I don’t know. But if I’m Golden State, I’m like, man, this a kid he could defend. Like he’s there’s probably some things we could do with him. We started talking about picks and like, oh, Golden State, they don’t want a protected first round pick. They want a unprotected first round pick. Fine, bro. Take it. Not in 2028, not 2029, not in 2030. But if y’all want 2026 or 2020, hey, go ahead. Also, you can’t have two. To be clear, you can have one, right? And if you want a second round pick just to make you feel like you did something, fine. Yeah. But in terms of and and I wasn’t here for the original discussion, but I you you have made me aware of it. In terms of being aggressive and taking Devon out and putting Keon in, I’m not interested in. I feel like I believe more in who Keon is as a basketball player than I do Devin Carter. And I don’t want the Kings to lose Keon Ellis. Yeah, I don’t either. Uh I I don’t either. The other interesting thing to me that I I’d like to know more about if there is more to talk about is we know Jonathan Kaminga met with the Kings front office. Scott Perry, BJ Armstrong, they laid out how they view Jonathan Kaminga and what they would do if he was on the Kings. Has Jonathan Kaminga talked to Phoenix at all? and does he have an idea of how they look at him? I would assume he’d get an opportunity to start and do a whole lot of things because they don’t have a whole lot on the roster. Um, so I think it would it would probably be about the same opportunity, but I don’t we don’t even know if they’ve talked at this point the way we know the Kings and Kamika have talked. So, are there potential plans to talk? I don’t know. That’s that’s something that uh maybe we’ll find out in the in the coming days. Yeah, that will be I mean I have to assume they’ve talked because with a list or not a list but with a group of teams that small and to a degree parties seeming to work together meaning Jonathan Kaminga’s team and the Golden State Warriors. I have to imagine that Jonathan Kaminga has talked to the Phoenix Suns. Mark Spears made the remark about Kaminga’s interest in Sacramento today. I have to assume that conversation has done been happened. It happened last whenever summer league was. Mhm. So we we we got um Slater said it last week on here. What was that? Thursday or Friday? He talked about it. He said they met in Vegas, the the front office in Kaminga. So our front office or theirs? Ours. Kings and Kaminga had contact. Okay. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So that but that was the first time to anybody’s knowledge that they had they had spoke. Sure. So it was a little noteworthy and they talked about it and I don’t I I don’t think it’s outrageous to say he probably met with Phoenix the same day or same time frame. Could be. Yeah, for sure. For sure it could be. just I only ask and I speculate because we haven’t heard anything about that. Sure. So, sure. Well, well, let’s Matt Matt will be here tomorrow. Locked on Phoenix. Let’s see if we can find out. Um uh let’s let Manny get his uh get his promo off. 916909320 talk line. What’s up, Manny? What’s up, man? Thank god you’re back, man. It got a little crazy. It’s good. It’s good, man. It’s good. We here. Uh, I got a question for you about biggest fan here. Oh, wow. Um, do you think any of this is Do you think any of this is him use trying to get leverage, right? He doesn’t want to sign there. He doesn’t want anything to do with going Stay as far as we know, regardless of what the offer is. And at this point, him and his side wanting to like I don’t even know who has leverage anymore, right? but he wants out and for him to get out he’s going to have to keep pushing buttons it feels like. So does any do you think he’s using the Kings at all as leverage and it’s not necessarily the Kings that he wants to go to? No that that doesn’t I mean what’s the endgame? Like the endgame is getting out of Golden State but what if you wind up in Sacramento? No I think See I think I I wonder if it’s just I think he’d be happy in Sacramento. I do think that that’s one of the destinations he’d like to get to. Um, but I also just wonder if like if it’s not Sack, right? Because there’s so many things Sack has to do too to make all this work even if they get him. So, but good thing is good thing is we do have Matt on tonight at the time where he’s going to join us for a little half hour excursion and we’ll ask him a couple of these questions and uh we’ll see we’ll we’ll dive into some of his uh Lord of the Rings lore too and let him get his get his stuff off on that. So, don’t forget to join us tonight 8:00 PM ESPN 1320 YouTube, Twitch, even on uh on X. So, good stuff, man. There you go. Good stuff, man. That’s good timing right there. Appreciate you, Manny. That’s good timing, man, to have Matt George on. Matt’s Matt’s done a uh a great job on this story over the last few weeks. I actually just pulled up his account, his Twitter account to see what he might have said over the course of the last few hours. And it it here’s here’s what Matt most recently wrote. Uh, if the Kings and Kaminga feel this is good about a future partnership, it makes even more sense for the Kings to stand firm with their low sign and trade offer. Sure, a lot can change in a year, but the Kings have the time to wait until next season to just sign Kaminga as an unrestricted free agent. Sack can afford to be more patient than the Warriors who are trying to maximize their window with Steph and Jimmy. Uh, that’s what Matt George wrote most recently on uh Twitter. I don’t think I agree with him, though. the Kings have the time to wait. I never agree with that. I never agree with that. I don’t know what’s gonna happen. Yeah. Like, and I understand like Matt’s point, but what what could what could change next year? Also, you’re removing players from your roster. Mhm. And perhaps in this case, more importantly, you’re moving s removing salary from your books, right? signing outright. That’s a completely different proposition. And I know part of Demar’s salary changes next year. Uh but Lavine is still here. And I don’t even know how partially guaranteed contracts work. I don’t know if they have to cut him by a certain day before it becomes guaranteed. I I I I remember Chris Paul I remember Chris Paul once had a contract where it was like, well, he’s either going to be due like 10 million or he’s going to be due 30 million. It depends on if they cut him or not. I assume that’s what the case is with Demard Rosen, but I’m not I’m not entirely sure. The outgoing dollars and in this case, the outgoing players I think are important to the to the equation as well. So, I disagree with Matt a little bit in the sense that you could just wait until next season. I don’t feel like you could do that. Um, but at the same time, I agree with Matt. I’m not wavering too much from my offer. Like we can find a way to salt. And you’ve got the you’ve got the fillet in front of you. We can find a way to, you know, salt. Maybe maybe we throw a little onion powder in addition to the salt and pepper. But you ain’t getting the mashed potatoes. I don’t know why that was. I don’t know. Don’t wear that in. That’s a bar right there. It’s a bar. Clearly, I’m hungry. Sitting around drinking protein shakes isn’t doing it for you, boy. Um, man, for me, it starts to become a a fine line between being shrewd and making sure you’re not um negotiating against yourself. And I don’t really want them that bad. Like I’m I’m the type of person, this probably why I have so many tennis shoes, right? Like what do I always tell you? If you want it, go get it. You’re not going to You are like a horrible influencer. If you want it, go get it. Literally everybody’s worst friend. If you want it, if you want what you’re trying to get that bad, go do what you got to do, get it, right? Because at the end of the day, if it’s everything that you hoped it would be or expected it to be, you’re not going to miss what you gave up to get it because you’ll be just enjoying what you had. Whether that’s retail or sometimes whether that’s basketball players, right? It’s starting. There’s a fine line. I I want to I want to make sure I’m not giving up too much. I want to make sure that I’m not overpaying for in this trade situation where there’s not a whole lot of options, but at the same time, like how do you how do you if the Kings really want Jonathan Kaminga? They really want it. How do you think they would feel or how should they feel if they miss out on him? Uh like if it’s a shrug of the shoulders, then you didn’t really want him that bad to begin with. What if what if the idea is, yeah, no, we we we want Jonathan Kaminga. We don’t want him at the expense of multiple first round picks or we don’t want him at the expense of Keon Ellis. We want him in addition to the draft capital that we have moving forward. This is why I have a lot of respect for the stance that Scott Perry is taking right now. And it’s we’re for the maybe the first time in this franchise’s history. We’re looking past next season. We’re trying to look ahead. Yes, we want Jonathan Kaminga here with this team right now, but we also want to use the acquisition of Jonathan Kaminga to help build out what we can do moving forward when the likes of Zack Lavine and Demar De Rozan are gone, right? We need that draft capital to do that. We need a young ball stopper, a tenacious defender like Keon Ellis to do that. We need Keegan Murray to do that. And that’s why I’m like I one can’t come at the expense of the other. So if you really want Jonathan Kaminga, you have to find a way to do it in the realm of still being able to do what you’re trying to to establish moving forward. sustainable winner is the phrase that uh Scott Perry used in that introductory press conference, right? And and I I’m I’m with all that, but it it also comes down to like I don’t I and what a lot of people are saying is I don’t want Jonathan Kaminga. If I had to pick between the two, I’m picking Keon Ellis. It’s maybe oversimplifying it a little bit, but people are saying like if I I got to pick right now between these two, I’m gonna take Keon Ellis. I don’t want Jonathan Kaminga that bad. And there and there’s levels to everything, right? Like, yeah, you know, you want Jonathan Kaminga, but I wouldn’t trade I don’t know who Kings players really love on this team right now, but I wouldn’t trade Sabonis for him, you know? I don’t love him that bad. You know what I mean? So there’s there’s definitely levels to it, but that to me there becomes a fine line between being shrewd and like I don’t really want him that bad. I’d like to have him, but I don’t really want him that bad. I I’m with you. I love having I do not think that’s how the Kings feel. I don’t think it’s I don’t really want him that bad. I don’t think it it again we don’t know what the financial offer is but we have to believe it’s competitive with Phoenix or we wouldn’t even be having a conversation in my mind if it wasn’t competitive with Phoenix. It sounds like just putting two pieces of the Sham Shirania puzzle together that the Phoenix offer is in the vicinity of four years approaching $90 million. That’s not a oh we kind of want him offer. That’s a that’s a offer, right? That’s a That’s a That’s a That’s a piece of our franchise offer. It also makes the Keegan Murray conversation interesting because you’re starting to set a price for Keegan, which we admittedly don’t know what it is, like what we we we can’t figure out what Keegan Murray’s contract extension should be. But if if you pull off this Kaminga deal, at the very least, you’ve established the the the floor, right? And I think we all had him above 90. So I don’t think it’s really a big deal, but it’s it’s it’s something you have definitely put in place, right? Yeah. And I much like you, I’m I’m happy that the the Kings have a p a person in in power and in this position that has the ability to be shrewd, has the ability to, like you mentioned, look a couple years forward, but also have an understanding of the league and the market. This goes all the way back to what we said at the first initial reports of all this is and it stood out to me immediately. There’s a reason why this was the offer. You know what I mean? There’s a re Scott Perry. It’s it was so random and it was so low that it had to be for a reason in my opinion. It had to come from a position of understanding the marketplace, understanding what was going on around the league and what his market was around the league. And I think he still understands that right now to this day. And it’s just good to have a person like that in in a position of power, in a position to make these moves. Had this story, and I’m serious, had this story not broke, if Matt had tucked this this scoop away and things had qu, you know, no one in Detroit really talked about it, like if this thing had just gotten quiet and the Warriors fan base didn’t have the opportunity to react the way that they did to the news, do you think this deal would already be done? It might be. Okay. I’ve been kind of holding on dead serious. I’ve been holding on to this question because I don’t know if it was kind of like, oh no, let him do that. But I’ve been wondering how much of the Warriors pride is just keeping this deal from happening. Damn near. No, I I I think that’s a perfectly fair question. We said that we said that when it uh when it started Joe don’t want to let go. I was going to say it wasn’t the Pride that was holding on to it. It was the owner. We can talk about like the return for like old Carter and Sar whatever you want, but like the Warriors clearly have no wins here or whatever. And it’s just it I don’t know. Like I said, they’ve been talking just how much of it is just pride at this point why they haven’t taken the deal and misinformation and misunderstanding of the market. They’re holding on to this notion that they can get something drastically better than Devin Carter Sarge and in a first round pick when who knows what might happen. You may you you may come across a better deal um in a week or so. Maybe maybe the Bulls say, “Hey, let’s let’s get into sweep stakes right now and you could get, you know, I don’t know, just a random marginally better player than Devin Carter.” Maybe it happens. But they think they could get starters than a young player. Like, are you guys, Mike Dunle Jr., are you not paying attention to um are you not paying attention to what’s going on in the league right now? Yeah, I’m sorry I got distracted. Yas just made an unreal catch. I I I’d love to know, but I’m not allowed to watch it. Yeah, go ahead and send this one out, big bro. Yaz would have flipped over and dropped the ball, but see he’s right field line. Oh, he jumped into the netting and caught him. Land jumps over the wall into the netting. What a catch. Can I at least get a score update or one? Boy, this would be a real seven to one. This be a real fun game to watch in the studio, bud. Put the game on for five seconds. I just want to see what happens. Let’s do it. We look. We might as well. This team stinks. They’re not going anywhere. Out is out. Okay. If Logan’s out, I’ll do it. I didn’t want to do I didn’t want to do my man. It’s 1-1 in the top of the eighth. One out. And from this moment on, we’ll see what happens with this game. This league pitch is about to lose it right now. He’s not gonna be able to find the strike zone. Just just to be clear, Giants fans. Oh, what a catch. They two already over here. Yeah, we’re done. We’re at 500. We were two games back like a month and a half ago. Now we’re nine. It’s over. Um Yeah, I don’t think the Warriors though um read the market well at all. I don’t know if they still are reading the market well. Yeah, I it it’s just a like I understand the game. Like I know what we’re doing, but at some point you got to understand the the pieces that are on the board. You don’t have the pieces to pull the Yeah, we’re going to cut the sign and trade talks off. Bro, you don’t h No one believes you. You can’t afford to do it. Again, do you want a little or do you want nothing? Because it’s not like Scott Perry’s clearly Scott Perry has not called them and went, “No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Mike, Mike, no, no, no, no. Hey, come on, man. Come on, my man. It’s me. No man. Okay. If I’m Scott P.” Yeah. Go ahead. Go ahead. We got a Because again, Royce O’Neal, we got to run in real quick. Matt George on the phone lines. Okay. Oh, all right. Well, man, we we we cooking. Matt George, Matt, I just want to be clear. This does not supplement your appearance tomorrow. We’ll see you tomorrow at 3:15. What’s up, Matt? Did I ruin Jonathan Kaminga to Sacramento? Is it my fault? So, I think it’s a I think Let me let me ask you the question that I just asked these guys. If if if that story had not bubbled and and and you were at the forefront of that and I know your you know, your friends in, you know, on once upon a time Detroit was a part of this. your buddies in Detroit jumped on this and uh you know, hey, all of those people saying there’s no substantial talk between Sacramento and Golden State, them hoes have fallen real quiet recently. Um do you think that if the Warriors fan base had not had the opportunity to react to Devin Carter and Dario Saridge that this deal with Jonathan Kaminga would be done? I feel like it would be a lot further along than it is right now at least because that’s where I was feeling confident in saying when it first came out that these talks were pretty advanced and as soon as that ter that word advanced came out that’s when there was a oh no no no no no on both sides that that came out very very quickly right so look maybe you know Kings Reddit’s right I’m the problem I was my fault I I I got one little scoop and I I put it out there and I killed Jonathan Kaminga to Sacramento. Here’s what I’ve learned. Stay off Reddit. That is a dark web over there, man. You got to stay off Reddit, Matt. Uh, two, you did a great job. You covered this story. I love I love Anthony Slater. He is our guy. He is on this. He was one of them people who said, “Nah, this there’s there’s nothing here.” Ant was just on television talking about this story for his new network at ESPN. So Matt, you’ve been ahead of this story from day one. Um I just wonder that if maybe it started on day two instead of day one, what would the reaction be? Because the reaction from Warriors fans was crazy. Then their media jumped in on Bonte waited nine days to go on the radio and laugh about it when it seems like there’s there’s the the this thing is very very real. And then when you compare it against Phoenix, man, Sacramento looks like they’ve got the golden ticket offer. I I just I it’s the same position I feel the Kings have been in for weeks. It’s this is what it is. We’re comfortable walking away. Something I texted you, DLO, before I called was I know for a fact the Kings really want Kaminga. Casey, you’ve been talking about like I don’t think it’s a case of a shrug the shoulders thing at all. Like like you said, the Kings and I’m not saying you said, I mean like you you’re wondering if that’s what it was. The Kings really want Kaminga and I don’t think that’s just the front office. I think Doug Christie really likes the idea of having Jonathan Kaminga in Sacramento. This is an opportunity that’s there. The Kings are just not in a position where they feel they need to be the ones to fold or budge. They they feel like patience is on their side, time is on their side, which is kind of what I alluded to in the in the tweet that you read out earlier, DLO. It’s just Sacramento’s in the spot that they’re in. And they’re not a Jonathan Kamingo away next year from competing for a championship. And the only team worried about a championship window right now is the team in Golden State. So, the team is San Francisco. Yeah. So, that’s kind of the position that we’re in and and it’s fun, but I’ll I’ll take the blame. I ruined the Kaminga trade. It’s okay. I I’ll happily uh take that on and put that on my resume. Well, you didn’t ruin it because it’s it’s it’s it’s clearly, you know, there’s something happening like there’s there’s this this this thing is is is still bubbling. Uh but you’re doing a great job, Matt. Uh keep covering the story. Yes, sir. Uh we’ll be watching you tonight on on on the Chatty House afterparty and we’re really really looking forward to our conversation uh tomorrow in the 3:00 hour. Thank god you’re back. These two tired of trying to trade Keon. See no see look how look how uh Leezy George is doing just he hears what he wants to hear. Appreciate you Matt. I’m here. I will I will calm everything down. Uh we’ll come back. Uh, we’ll talk to Buddha uh in just a heartbeat. Uh, and we’ll talk to James Ham. He’ll be with us at the top of the 3:00 hour here on Sacramento Sports Leader, ESPN 1320. Did I miss any bubbles? I didn’t I keep glancing over him. I didn’t see him. Okay, real quick. Since you’ve changed the game on um four pitch walk, Giants unable to turn two, and then a stolen base. Crazy. See what happens here. When I come back, they they might they might be all all done. Gonna be 3-1. 3-1 when Kenny comes back. Okay. Shout out Matt George. He’s a P1. Definitely listens on the radio. Yeah. Yeah, that’s cool. Do you have a favor right now? I’m not sure what that means. Bryce, got him. Got him. This dude better not hit. No, we got him. We We out the inning, baby. We out the inning. Rich, what’s up, man? Oh, always. Dr. David, always favorite ride. Do I have a favorite ride? Uh, not really. I know. I I told the guys this I really like the Saurin. Saurinaring over the Earth. I know it’s Did you go on Guardians of the Galaxy? No. Why not? That’s the drop. Yeah, it’s the best one. Uh I I don’t know. Might have been the long might have been the line. I don’t I don’t mind the drop. I know Casey’s anti- drop zone. I don’t know if he doesn’t like that one. The only thing I told Katie I didn’t want to do, and I think there’s only one is I I don’t do I don’t mind roller co. I don’t want to go upside down. Oh, you don’t like that one? Nah. Nah. Like I didn’t mind I don’t mind space mount like it being fast. I just don’t want to go upside down. Before you got here was probably on Monday. Me and Casey were talking about we need to do D and Casey live from Great America. You know what that you know what’s funny is we actually saw that we were watching when you guys were talking about Great America and uh all of that stuff. I did Bryce. Yes. Thank you. Reddit is a weird app. Yeah, it is. It’s a weird place. See what it’s about. A lot of haters. It is a weird weird place. The Superman at Six Flags looks unsafe. I won’t be getting That’s the Magic Mountain one. Yeah. Oh, well, both of them. Or Vallejo. Vallejo. I’ve been on the one Valo that one’s for. What a Magic Mountain looks crazy. I just talked to Damian, by the way. He said he’s down for DL and Casey live from Great America. I don’t think that’s what I said, but I said I heard you say it. Same thing. You didn’t say you hated the second. I don’t hate the idea. Hey, I’m I’m down with it, too. That’s fine. That doesn’t mean I’m getting on any Yeah, I’ll be there. I’ll be there though. First three rides would do Top Gun, the Grizzly, and the Demon. Top Gun. I used to get I used to get on those rides a lot. Like all the time. The only ones I didn’t get on a lot was Drop Zone and Grizzly. Um I used to get on Top Gun all the time, Vortex all the time. Um I was okay with them, but that’s okay. Would you rather do a show from the Everglades or ride all the rides, the roller coasters at Magic Mountain? I might want to go to the Everglades. Damn. All right. Now we know. I don’t know, man. I do not want to ride the Grizzly. Did you say you went to the Everglades? Yeah, I think we talked about that while you were going to doing a show over there as well. Doing a show. Yeah. B, what up, boy? What up? What up? AC was worried about losing an arm or something like that, but I told I told him that there’s someone there already who lost their arm to warn us about what not to do and stuff. So, we’re good. We should probably see what the NBA SK We need to start thinking about what we’re going to do Christmas. I meant to tell you guys that we’re off to it’s Wednesday and Thursday. Oh, for the week. Well, yeah. I think I think that might be the case. Oh, real quick. Another one because Lord knows I’m not leaving by myself anymore. So, another found out we’re doing a show in the Everglades. Well, yeah. My favorite tour destination. What did I just choose instead of Oh, you said you said you chose the Everglades. Yeah, I did trace the Everglades. Yeah. I’m not getting on the Grizzly. D Casey live from the Everglades soon. We’ll talk to sales. Let’s make it happen. While you were away, um the uh Odyssey Day at the Ballpark Yeah. was a day game where the Rivercats were playing and pictures were taken and everybody had such a great time except the sports guys. Non some of the sports guys were there. Oh yeah, that’s for the whole thing. Some people that you thought were on your side. Wait, who was there? Oh, did the insiders show up? No, no, no, it wasn’t. Boss man Charlie was there. Yeah, Joe Brazil was there. People you thought was on your side. Not mind you, Giants number one prospect, Bryce Eldridge. It’s a walk-off home run at the game. Yeah, that was Oh, that would have been great to see. That would have been cool. Even better, a lot of the people left before the walk-off home run. They didn’t leave back here, Casey. No, I didn’t see him come through these doors. It’s fine, though. It’s good. I feel the need to be honest with both of you. Okay, I think you’re going to say, “Yeah, go ahead.” But who side is he on? Wait, we were supposed to go to that game. Okay. Yeah, that’s what we were talking about. You mentioned it like the week before. He’s going to a Rivercast game. I was like, why was why we go to there? We were supposed to go to that game because we were off, but we were here. Uhhuh. So, we were going to go and I told Bill I was like, “Yeah, Katie and I will come.” But I didn’t look at the calendar first. Katie had an appointment that she had been waiting like four months to get. It was at 1:00. There was no way around it. So we I I had I hit up Bill and JC. I was like, “Guys, I’m sorry. That’s my fault. I jumped the gun. We can’t go.” So we wound up not going. You know what? I was like, “That photo op would have been crazy.” Yeah. I was You know what? I was kind of like, “Whatever, you didn’t go. It’s fine.” But now that you were planning on going, now I feel a certain way about it. Now, I remember when the invite went out and I wasn’t like I hadn’t planned to have that time off yet. Yeah. I felt some type of way like, oh, we’re we’re going to the ballpark at noon on a Wednesday. Yeah. Also, um, we were trying to figure out here is Sutter Health Park. Is that like Wrigleyfield of the 80s? No lights, only day games. Cuz if that’s the case, that makes sense why we would do that at 12:30 because they don’t they only play day games. I don’t think that’s true. Oh, they have lights. I believe they do. Oh, they play night games. They played yesterday night actually. That’s That’s right. Yeah. So, we could have all as a company gone through a regular night game. Yeah. But, but you know what the difference is? You know how these people work. You know what the difference is? That’s my personal time. I’m not going to a work event on my personal time. You want me You want me to go to a work event, schedule it during work time. You want me to go to work event schedule time? Thank you. Right on Q. Could you moment can you imagine the moment that would have hit if we were looking through through those pictures and like wait what is that Damian? The show would have stopped. We would not have talked about anything else for the next two hours. That would have been the biggest heel turn on this show of all time. Oh, that would have been amazing. That would have been amazing. I actually hate that we didn’t go now. Joe Joe was even in the comments like, “No, it was actually a good time, guys.” Like you were there. No, Joe was trying to next time we’ll go, guys. Yeah, don’t tell me where the next time. Joe, sit your ass down. You know, been going to the ballpark Disneyland. He’s having a hell of a month. He is, man. July has been his month. Um, Citiz Kaminga and um Kings Warriors Triangle. Let’s get Buddha real quick. Oh, yeah. My bad. My bad. Let’s talk with Buddha real quick before cuz cuz James is going to join us and then you know we’re off and running. 91691320. Buddha, what’s good, man? What’s good, family? How my boys doing? We good, man. How you doing, dog? Hey, man. I’m doing great. I’m doing magnificent, man. I’m hearing my boy JK try and come to sack. I’m glad I’m glad Scott Perry getting respect, man. Cuz when Pascal was on the the Kings radar, he didn’t want to come. So, it’s good to see things changing a little bit. And I think we should get JK by any means to be honest because that’s the uber athletic wing that we’ve been looking for. Like I can see lineups like Dennis, Zack, Keegan, JK, and Sabonis and Dennis throwing lobs the Zack Sabonis and JK. Sabonis, I mean uh Keegan, you feel me? Like it it’ll be a movie out there. I think it’ll be real exciting. I think it’s a good team that can be that could grow to be great cuz JK it would be good uh spacing already cuz he would be replacing Deamar and Dear he he can knock it down but uh JK he can do the same and he add more rim protection than Demar did. So I think he’ll be a real good fit and I don’t think that that Carter deal getting off. So I mean I have to give up Keon because it’s harder to find a wing than a guard to be honest. Buddha, when you say by any means necessary, you’re talking about Keon Ellis. Yeah, because like I said, it’s harder to find a wing than a guard. I got you. Okay. Appreciate you. Shout out Shout out Buddha. Buddha was cooking. Buddha was um he was spend knowledge. I agree with I don’t know about any means necessarily with Jonathan Kaminga, but I agree with a lot of what he said, but I was a little distracted because I was well aware that Buddha has not had one of his breaks today. Did you Did you hear the different tone, the speed of how he was talking? Yeah. He was just like, “Yeah, no. We here. This is what we need to do. We need it.” When Buddhist had one of his break. Yo, I’m telling you what we need to do. We need to go get that boy. Yeah. Buddha. Buddha, I think, has had two of those in like five years. Yeah. Well, well, yeah. One of them was like a couple months ago. was like, “Man, Buddha sound different.” Then he called back. He was like, “Oh, no. There he is. Go ahead, Jesse. We’re just talking stuff. Matt George, please don’t hurt us.” But how how are the Kings just marginally better if they had Kaminga and move off of Keon? Like how how much better would they be at that point? Um because people are so just I guess and like like Casey said it too like probably not moving off of Keon and all that, but everyone’s just so hellbound. No, Keon, not Keon. not Keon. How much better is it making the Kings though if you were to do that deal? Cuz ultimately that’s the end goal here, right? I think yes. I know there’s like context like you don’t need to move off of Keon because the Bories don’t have leverage this this and that. But just purely speaking, how much better are the Kings here? I think and this is why I don’t necessarily understand I understand it because I love Keon and I think Kean is a winning basketball player. I understand it from that standpoint. But Jonathan Kaminga to a certain degree would fill the potentially fill the void and represent everything that all these people are saying they want from the Sacramento Kings. A a future that’s what everybody’s want. That’s what you guys want to tank. You want a tank for a Jonathan Kaminga. Yeah. and you’re you said that’s what they need to be doing the whole time and when it’s like you can do it but you got to give up Keon Ellis like no way like he’s not even a winning player Keon that that’s what once again I understand because I love Keon like everybody else does but I don’t understand how you can how both of those things work um do you add a keyon when You got a guy like Kaminga like meaning the type of player like you having a Keon is nice but you said do you like like I mean like like kind of like like like having Keon is great but if you don’t have like a Kaminga type or even a number one like how much is that helping you? I guess I I agree. I would if you get what I’m saying. not playing terms, but like also like uh yeah, Keon only I don’t want to say Keon only works, but Keon works. You maximize him if you have everything else established and ready to go. Exactly. Like the impact that we talk about with Keon. Do you need everything else to be okay better? I guess I got true impact. I got an example for you. Caruso Caruso and the Bulls didn’t do much of anything for the Bulls, but when he went to OKC and everything was established, it elevated that team and took them to another level. Did it? I think I, you know, I was a little like, hey, it’s not going to do as much. But in the playoffs, he proved me wrong about his impact on what they could what that team could do. But how much of that is Caruso versus how much of that is Oklahoma City versus Chicago? Like Caruso is not going to take Chicago to where Oklahoma City was, but but Caruso can help elevate a really good Oklahoma City team. I think the same can be true for a marginal team like Keon Ellis can help elevate Sacramento up a little. Keon Ellis isn’t your one. M he’s not the guy who makes Sacramento a championship contender, but how many times have we watched someone or discuss something someone did the night before or even watched someone at the Golden One Center in opposing uniform and going, “Man, I’d love to have a such and such on the Sacramento Kings.” That to me, Keon’s one of one of those guys. Yeah, I think you’re right and I think that’s 100% fair. But we talk to people every day. We read things every day. People think we’re a lot and I won’t use OKC. Let’s just say the Clippers. People think the Kings are a lot closer to the Bulls than the Clippers. Like you’re not What you said is 100% correct. A lot of people don’t believe that’s where the Kings are. They’re not a marginal team. They’re not this team that can be elevated to a playoff team by Keon Ellis. They’re closer to the Bulls, this sorry middling team that Caruso was on. I agree with you. I just don’t think people people are talking out of both sides of their mouth now. We we can’t Well, that’s what everybody does. Yeah. We talk so bad about this Kings team and how how sorry they’re gonna be. Well, I mean, we we talk about this all of the time. Kings Twitter will and complain about how bad this team is, but they want Keegan back. They want Keon back. They want all of these players back. And it’s what you really don’t like is Demar De Rozan and Zack Lavine. That’s what you don’t like, right? arguably the team’s two best players whether you like it or not like they are and Domas is in there somewhere like I don’t know where but like that that’s those are the king’s three best players and so I think these conversations there’s always a little bit of talking out of both sides of your mouth and I want Keon on this basketball team I do not want Keon involved in any trade for Jonathan Kaminga. In fact, if the Warriors ask for somebody, I almost immediately am like, “No, we want Mason Jones.” Unless Unless they ask for Deon Carter. Then it’s like, “All right, you’re twisting my arm. You got it. It’s going to cost you a second round pick for us to include him.” I don’t know, man. Um, but I I I agree and I understand what what what Jesse is saying. I don’t know if the Kings are in a position to greatly benefit from the type of player Keon Ellis is. Yeah. It’s not like about Keon’s impact. We all know what he can do and stuff. I hear you. I just that is I don’t even know if the Kings are going to have that the next two seasons to get the most out of Keon, I guess, or just what that can be. And it’s like if you’re going to like is it just worth it to hold on to that when you’re looking for but but to me that’s like saying Keon Ellis players like Keon Ellis can only play on good basketball teams then I think no he’s he’s he’s good with the Kings but still going to be a 39 to 42 win team. Yeah. You feel their impact most I think on those teams like like Caruso went for like 20 I think in the finals and it wasn’t like this massive thing but it’s like oh that like that had a big impact on the game. I think that’s where it’s felt most. I I absolutely understand the point both of you are making. I just don’t see that as a reason to move off from him. That alone is not. But when you factor in you can go get this young piece that you can start to build around, that’s where it’s like, ah, now now you’re weighing the impact of a guy like that in the situation that you’re in compared to kind of jumpstarting your future, which is what every everybody’s I shouldn’t say everybody. A lot of people’s number one complaint with this team right now is they have no future. It’s just this this random group of players that we don’t think will be here in two years, but you’re going to get a guy that you are hoping and have the potential to be here for the next eight years. That’s what you don’t have on this roster right now outside of however you feel about Keegan, those two guys. That’s it. Uh James text me a minute ago. He’s on the way. He’s running a couple minutes behind, but he’ll he’ll be with us here shortly. Um, it goes back like I I guess part of the reason I look at the Keon thing is I can see Keon be a part of something that you’re building for the future. I can’t. And that is I think one of the biggest signals with a potential Jonathan Kaminga acquisition. He’s not a 28-year-old player. He’s not a 30-year-old player. He’s certainly not a 35year-old player. He’s a player that you can get onto your team on his rookie extension. And if if if if I understand if everything goes the way you want to, you now have another building block for 2028 in 2029. Now, you can start, you got to you got to move some of the weeds out of the way, but you could start to have a conversation for the first time about a potential future for this team. Now, there’d be a lot of hyperbole. There’d be a lot of uh hypotheticals and all that, but you could have a discussion right now today. You can’t. At least I don’t believe you can unless you’re a big Devin Carter fan. Right now, today, there’s no conversation to be had about the Sacramento Kings future. We talked about the list that ESPN made about the 14 non-playoff teams. We’ll we’ll we’ll get to that tomorrow, but there’s a difference between 2026, you know, 2025, 2026 in the future. Mhm. And yep, this isn’t a championship contender, but they’re not terrible. You want to have a conversation about their future and it feels like the Zack Lows and all of those different the Bill Simp those guys are having conversations about their future. To me, they’re all right. They’re all right. That conversation can start to shift for the first time with an acquisition of Jonathan Kaminga. You don’t lose anything with the loss of Devin Carter. In my opinion, I feel like you lose a little something with Keon Ellis. It doesn’t mean the conversation still can’t be there. Doesn’t mean you still can’t talk about the future of this team, but I feel like losing Keon Ellis is detrimental. Let me ask you both something. Do you think you know who Keon Ellis is as a basketball player today? Do you think you know the best version of Keon Ellis the basketball player right now? I think I do. Yeah, I think I like I don’t think he’s hit a ceiling yet, but I think I know what that can be. Alex Caruso like that type of player feels right. Better better shooting. That’s pretty good. No. Yeah. Better shooting Alex Caruso. I don’t know if he’s necessarily gonna get there, but I guess what I’m That’s good. Also, you want that. That’s good. Absolutely. Absolutely. But and I’ll I’ll flip the question on you. All right. What is What is What does Kaminga ceiling look like? Just we’ll go best case scenario. I’m not saying he’s going to reach that, but what do you envision the best case scenario for Jonathan Kamika? I mean, an all-star 20 plus double double. Yeah, that’s and I it sounds like I’m minimizing guys like Caruso and you very much are and I’m not. But would disagree. What um like would you who who is that right now? who is who is I also think there’s more to Keon than you guys do potentially like I I don’t I don’t think there I don’t think the Alex Caruso comp is bad by the way I I I like Alex Caruso I’ve always would have loved him on Sacramento but um I mean last year like his coach called him a situational ro what was it a situational role player yes situational rotational player something like that last year Mike yeah don’t listen to that guy That’s your coach. That’s your coach. Oh. Oh, there was another controversy while you were gone, too. And remember, cuz I’m my cousins at the family reunion. Oh, Jesus. They’re all They’re not all of them, but there’s like a group of the four or five OGs who are Knicks fans. Okay. And we were talking. I was like, “Hey, I support the Knicks, man. It’s love, man. I I want to see them succeed. Not more than the Kings, but I want to see them succeed.” Yeah. And they were like, “Oh, okay. No doubt. No doubt. Look, this what we gonna do. We gonna put you in our Nick’s group chat. You know what I’m saying? We gonna put you in the group chat because and and they they thought that was a violation. I got I got two things. I mean, three, I guess. Yes. That’s that’s horrible. We shouldn’t be in the Knicks fan group chat. Tyler, you’re a Knicks fan. I’m not. Tyler brings up Derek White for Keon Ellis. I don’t see that. Like, Derek White got 36 in a playoff game in the second season. And then also we’re talking Keon Ellis future Kings future that is let’s bring in how confident are we signing an extension with the Kings. Well, let’s ask James. James, these two hate Keon Ellis. Not true. Not true. Lazy Barley. What do you And and I guess this is probably a really important place to start. James, it feels like a lot has happened. I don’t know that anything has actually happened, but it feels like a lot has happened since we last talked at 12:15. Do you what would what are the odds Keon Ellis is with Sacramento for the foreseeable future? Oh man, that’s a tough one. Like I to be honest with you, I I don’t know. I know that, you know, clearly there was some unhappiness about him uh about them picking up his his option. And I I mean to be honest I I think at this point it might have played out better for him that that they didn’t make him restricted free agent because we’re watching that unfold and it’s really ugly. Uh but the Kings also would not have had any cap space to go out and do anything. So it would have eaten up all of the buffer they have between the the salary cap and the luxury tax if they would have paid Keon. And like look, deep down, I think the Kings in a perfect world would have loved to have just given Keon a four-year deal like right now. They would have already like a four-year deal for this season that started this season. But that’s just not the dynamics of their cap space and where they were when uh they had to make the decision on Keon. And I think part of it was timing and um I think part of it is like just look at the restrictive free agent market. It’s just a disaster. I mean Josh Giddy and you know like Kaminga but you know Cam Thomas and you know all these guys are just stuck in limbo and Keon very well could have been in that same exact position. The one difference I would point out though is that I think maybe Quinton Grimes is in the same bucket that Keon would be around the same price tag. Um, but outside of that, like Kaminga and and Getty, like Cam Thomas, they’re all hoping for way more than that, right? Cam Thomas I like the blatant disrespect from the Nets where they’re like, “Hey, we’ll offer you 14.1 million, which is a mid-level exception on a one-year deal with a secondyear team option. That that’s like a really really tough tough negotiating like starting point. Keon is probably a player who’s going to make 12 to 15 million uh 12 to 14 million in restricted free agency or or as a free agent. That’s sort of like his his zone. Maybe a little bit less than that. Maybe a four-year 40. So, it’s possible that some team that’s out there that’s really good that still had their mid-level would have said, “Hey, we’re going to go get we’re going to go try to get Keon.” But if the Kings made it known that they’re going to match any offer, then, you know, Keon would have been in the same position that all these other guys would be. um you know outside of maybe the Nets taking a big swing at him and stealing him away. Um but even that isn’t like I I don’t think that that’s part of their team build uh philosophy. I we were James before you came in we were discussing like the ceilings and what we you know some of these players could potentially be. We’re talking Keon again too and we said Keon Ellis you know what if he maximized and turned into Alex Caruso which I think is plausible like he could do that that’s a valuable person and we were trying to figure out like Kaminga ceiling what would that look like maybe agree or don’t disagree but what if Kaminga turned into Jaylen Brown would you rather have Jaylen Brown or Alex Caruso to kind of start your franchise moving forward Yeah. I Sorry, Hammer. Sorry, Hammer. Go ahead. I mean, if we’re starting like a franchise, then I’d prefer like, you know, the the 22year-old potential superstar, potential all-star. If you know, I’m the Sacramento Kings and you’re trying to build or trying to take that next step like they were two years ago, then Caruso would have made a ton of sense. and they actually chased Caruso and that would have just made like a a absolute ton of sense for this team to go out and get a defensive minded guard like that. So, u I I think it depends on where you at you’re at and your team build, what’s the average age of your team, all of that stuff. Um but yeah, I get the point. Like one is a role player and an established like extremely good role player. The other one is a player who hasn’t accepted a role and you’re wondering what his role can be, what his ceiling can be. And you know, the question is always going to be, hey, look, if Jonathan Kaminga, you don’t end up being as good as you think you are, will you accept being someone less than that? and not as in like accept it and and be happy about it, but accept that, you know, you have to turn yourself into something different, whether it’s like an Aaron Gordon or a John Collins or one of those types of players. And, you know, to to date, I don’t think Kaminga’s got the opportunity with the Warriors to feel like he’s fulfilled this this dream of becoming something more. And so he’s left in this weird limbo which to be honest with you we don’t see very often. I mean there are players out there that you know you get four years into their career and they still you know I remember talking to Jason Thompson in like year seven and he’s like man I just want like 12 shots per game. It’s like bro you ain’t ever getting 12 shots per game. You went to Fbotchi and didn’t get 12 shots per game. You know that’s not being disrespectful. That’s just like your lot in life in the NBA and that’s okay. But if you’re unwilling to accept that, then you find yourself out of the league. I remember Omry Casby told me one time, he said, you know, he left the Kings, he went to the Cavs, did not have a good good time with the Cavs and there was expectations on that were different. And then he left there and he went to Houston and he was like, I sat down with Kevin McCale and Kevin McCale said, look, this is who you will be in the league and if you don’t be this player, you’re going to be out of the league very quick. And if you don’t accept this role and you don’t try to flourish in this ro role as a 3 and D guy, guy who stands in the corner and accepts your role and goes and grabs some rebounds and every once in a while you get a fast break and stuff like that. But if you won’t accept that, you’re going to find yourself in the unemployment line and you’re going to find yourself playing in Europe or you’re going to find yourself playing somewhere else. And that’s going to be on you. It’s not on us. We’re here. We have our team. We have our players that we have, you know, tiers of players. Like Kyle Matson likes to tier everybody. Um, and this is where you’re at and what tier you’re at. And we need you to play to your strengths and be that player. And if you don’t want to do that, that’s fine. We’ll find another place for you. But if you do want to be that, we think we can elongate your career and make you into a ball player that keeps getting paychecks. and Omry said I I accepted it because it was like the honest truth and it was with my own best interest in mind and once I accepted that it was a lot easier to move forward and be a really good role player. I also think this whole conversation is unfair because that is a massive if if Jonathan Kaminga becomes a Jaylen Brown. Well, we talked about what a ceiling is, right? You know, I mean, not saying that to you, but we talked about like what a ceiling is like probability. He’s probably more around Jerro Wallace. So like that’s that’s what I would that’s what I would bet. Sure. But so so if we went if we went like over the top with the idea of Jaylen Brown, I’ll go over the top with Keon Ellis and say Derek White, right? We’ll go back to the thing Jesse brought up earlier. Those two needed each other to win a title. And I think that’s my my point is I I feel like Keon can be a part of a future build for the Sacramento Kings, which is why I don’t want to lose him. And I think the most important part for me right now is I don’t feel like they have to. That’s the part that’s killing me. Like if you want to get the deal done just to get it done, then fine. Maybe you do it. Maybe. And if Kaminga is that important to you, fine. But I also look at it like who are you bidding against? It’s you’re you’re basically in a you’re in a game of chicken with Golden State. you don’t want him to play on this qualifying offer because you don’t want to lose the ability to trade him. You don’t want the ability to get back a draft asset or even a you look, they may think Devin Carter isn’t very good, but that’s fine. You’re still getting back a young player that you can at least find out that he’s not good. Otherwise, you get nothing. You also have the oldest basketball team in the league. you’re going to need somebody to play professional basketball for you in games 60, 70, and 80 of the season. And so I I’m I’m completely okay with Scott Perry just going, “All right.” And there’s a James, how do you do you think this thing really could draw out till October 1st? I I don’t think so. I mean, we always like you would hope that it would get figured out quicker. I’ll tell you this too, like you you brought up Devin Carter and like one of the player comps for Devin Carter is Gary Payeyton the second. Like this is a guy that the Warriors might be able to use that he might fit in what they’re doing. But again, I think with the Warriors, a lot of times you’re looking at it in in the same way that you’re looking at the Kaminga situation. Like, hey, he the word on the street is he doesn’t really want to play a role that he thinks he’s better than what his role is and what his role might be. And that makes it extremely difficult, right? because you know it’s it’s much easier for the Warriors to go out and sign and Al Horford, uh Seth Curry, and who’s the other guy they’re looking at that that they have locked up? The kid who blew out his knee last year? What’s that? Melton. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Melton. Melton. Right. So, so if you’re looking at like those players, those players know exactly who they are and the the Warriors are accepting those players and plugging them into a a situation that they think that they can flourish because those players have proven that they can flourish in those roles at other spots. So, when you’re taking on a young player like Devin Carter, like it you’re going to have to see if he fits your system or not. You’re going to have to see if he’s an NBA player or not. But again, great rebounder, uh, long wingspan, huge hops. Like again, Gary Payton the second is one of those guys who really he does look like as as a player. Um, and you if in the right situation, you might be able to figure out how to convert him into that player, but it comes down to like players being willing because, you know, again, if Devin Carter doesn’t figure out how to beat that player very quickly, he’s not going to be in the league. And and that’s a, you know, it’s a tough reality. every single year there are 30 first round picks that have guaranteed money coming in. That means that 30 dudes that were in the league the year before lose their jobs. You know, they’re not making more jobs that you’re just out and it’s sort of the tough reality. And it doesn’t matter if you’re the 13th pick or you’re the 28th pick in the first round, you’re fighting for your NBA job every single time you’re on the court. And uh so so look, I I know Golden State has a bunch of wants, needs, and all that stuff, but at the same time, like they got themselves into this situation, and it’s on them to figure out how to get out of it, but trying to strongarm somebody, using the press to strongarm somebody, like none of this seems like it’s uh it’s going to work out all that well for anybody involved. The thing that baffles me about the Warriors POV in this situation is the Warrior fans is the the notion that yeah, we’ll just bring them back on the qualifying offer. Like that’s literally the worst case scenario for the Warriors. And that’s the dumbest case scenario. You’ve done all of this and turned down all these deals that you say aren’t good enough and that you don’t want to take just to bring him back on a qualifying offer where he’s going to leave in x amount of months anyway and he has a no trade clause so you don’t have any control of it and you don’t get anything back. That would if you’re a Warriors fan, that’s the last thing you should be rooting for. Not celebrating, oh, we’ll just bring him back on the qualifying offer. That would be dumb. It’d be stupid. It’d be dumb. would be stupid and the second that he rolls an ankle and takes 12 weeks to come back from a rolled ankle because he he’s an unrestricted free agent at the end of the year and has no reason to rush back like that’s a problem and and it’s a problem that you created and I I get the system in place the system in place is to um is to preserve you know your draft picks or it’s to to make it so when you draft somebody you realistically don’t just get them for their first four years but really your first eight if you want them and and it’s to build continuity in the league. It’s so you can sell more jerseys. It’s so, you know, it’s just good for the league. But this situation here isn’t good for anybody because like let’s be clear, the Golden State Warriors are are being very obvious that they don’t want him back. I mean, when you offer a two-year deal in the second year as a team option, that means that you don’t intend to keep that team option. That that’s that’s what they’re doing. They’re like they’re hoping that some much bigger trade comes along and that they can take him as a $20 million trade ship and go deal him. But that’s where I think the October 1st date really does start to come into play because if he pushes until October 1st and that’s when he signs his deal, then I believe that they cannot trade him this season. I mean, they can’t trade him anyways because uh well, they can’t trade him if he’s on a um if he’s playing for the qualifying offer. he can turn down any trade because as soon as he gets traded, his Larry Bird rights end. And so if you’re trading him to say a team like the Kings, the best they can do is offer him the mid-level exception of 14 million bucks because they’re over the cap. And and so it puts him in a really bad situation. If you give him the one-year deal, you can trade him, but you got you have that six-month window, right? So if he pushes this out till October 1st and says, “Fine, I’ll sign the two-year $45 million deal.” that deal won’t be available to him anymore because they’re gonna be like, “Nah, we’re good. We don’t because now we can’t trade you.” So, remember how Lorie Marketin last year waited and waited and waited until that one date where they’re like, “If he signs it today, he can be traded before the deadline. If he signs it tomorrow, he cannot be traded until next off season.” It’s kind of like the same exact situation here, but just a little bit different. Um, James, did you get the opportunity to see what Mark Spears said on television today regarding Jonathan Kaminga and the Sacramento Kings? Um, I I didn’t listen to it. I did hear like a snippet from from Kyle. Um, yeah. Yeah, it’s probably the most important part that you heard. He talked pretty extensively about one um Jonathan Kaminga’s preference out of Sacramento and Phoenix is to come to Sacramento. uh and he laid out the reasons why and it’s the fact that Sacramento has clearly defined what they believe Jonathan Kaminga’s role would be uh with this Kings basketball team and that includes starting at the four position alongside Keegan at the three and Domas at the five and we kind of we Mark did not say this on television we’re working through this ourselves that leads me to believe that Zach that led us to believe that Zack Lavine is at the two Dennis Shruder is at the one and at least for the time being for the first time in 15 of his 16 seasons, uh, Demar De Rozan will go to the bench. And let’s start with that component. What do you think of Mark Spears or perhaps the Sacramento Kings laying out the fact that they have a very prominent role ahead for Jonathan Kaminga should this all happen? Well, yeah. I mean, it makes perfect sense. Like, um, Kyle and I have been like beating this drum. I’ve been coming on your show for the last like I don’t know maybe four years talking about needing length and athleticism at the wing. When you’re looking at Kaminga and you’re looking at the the skill set that he has, the athleticism that he has, this is the type of player that every other team in the league has a bunch of and the Kings don’t. So I I think he’s a switchable forward. I think he can play the three and the four. Um him and Keegan Murray would be able to just like seamlessly switch between players, right? So, I I get the reason why Kaminga makes sense to them. And I also think that like when you’re getting a 22-year-old player with like the sky is the limits. Um you’re also you’re bringing in somebody who um that you want to get out there and play major minutes. You know, you’re not going to concern yourself with everything else. I mean, hopefully he’s healthy and would be able to play, you know, 75 to 80 games, but um you know, this is this is a player that should be able to seamlessly fit into your rotation. Um, is he a perfect fit? No. U, you know, he’s not a great three-point shooter. He shot, I think, 37% in his second year, but hasn’t come close to that since. Um, but I also don’t think he’s been happy. And I don’t think he’s been a player who’s been put in a position to succeed. And, you know, I I think when you’re looking at the Warriors and how they design their their team, like, he’s an afterthought for them. And that’s just a reality. He’s a he’s a total afterthought. Um, so you got to figure out a way to kind of fit them in. Uh, if you’re the Warriors, but with the Kings, it’s like, “Hey man, go out there, play 34 minutes, show me what you got.” Like, let’s This should be a fun adventure. And you would drop your age considerably and and then, you know, the dollars and cents we can probably discuss uh when we get back from the break. Well, I I I can’t I can’t lay out the dollars and cents for Scott Perry, but I know if Jonathan Kaminga wants to come up to Sacramento, man, we will uh we’ll take him out to West Sacramento. We’ll take him out to Baker Family Wines, right? We’ll introduce him to the Hall of Famer, Dusty Baker, and the coach of the Nicaraguan national team. Yep. Cuz he just can’t stop managing baseball teams. Just kid. If he’s not making the best wine in the city, he’s managing baseball teams. You can join Dusty’s Clubhouse for exclusive releases and tasting room specials. I strongly encourage you to do that. Head over to bakerfamily wines.com right now. Plan on visiting the taste room. This wine is absolutely spectacular. If you’ve been paying attention to the show over the last year and some change, you know, I’ve I’ve I’ve hit my LeBron era. I’m drinking wine in 2025 and some of the best bottles I have, especially this 2022 Pino Noir. This is one of my favorites right here. It’s from Baker Family Wine, Dusty Baker, his crew, Chip, they have put some incredible work into this. Head over to bakerfamily wines.com right now. Join Dusty’s Clubhouse and make your plans to visit the tasting room. Not in Napa, not in Namador County, not in Loi. It is right here in West Sacramento. We’re going to come back. We’re going to talk a lot more about this King situation with Jonathan Kaminga, with James Ham. When we return here on Sacramento Sports Leader, ESPN 1320. Giants lose. What’s up, Mark? Yeah, it’s Mike. Sorry, boys. No, you’re good, man. What’s going on? What’s up, man? How are you? I’m good. How you doing, man? Good. Yes, sir. I’m good, sir. So, thank you for the uh the walk. It’ll be nice to have you out there. So, thank you for agreeing that on Thanksgiving Day, too. No, it is October, I think, like 25th. Okay. So, it’s later this year, not in September. Cuz to be honest with you, I had never gotten in before. I don’t know. Oh, no. Okay. But I’m down. I mean, good. They mentioned your name in it from the past. So, I’m glad you’re willing to do it. So, Dave, you Damn, you guys are still live, just so you know. Yeah, that’s fine. Yeah, I’m finding wherever I go. Hi, everybody. I don’t know if you can hear me or not. Very possible you cannot hear me. No, they can’t, James. Oh, they can. Oh, sweet. All right, I’ll talk to you while while they’re having a meeting. Sweet. Um, yeah, that’s Mark. He’s one of our many new uh new executives. Sweet. What’s going on everybody? Anything happening? I see you guys are talking about uh Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. I saw some post the other day on I don’t know what it was on some sort of social media site and it was calling out uh Grandpa Joe for being one of the the worst characters in television history. Just like a leech on society, wouldn’t get out of bed, wouldn’t work, wouldn’t go help, all that stuff. I thought it was funny. Uh Jaylen, what’s my favorite color? Um, I’m going to say typically I say forest green, like a rich green. Uh, Spre says Sar can’t be aggregated in a trade. Um there’s a window in which he can be aggregated in a trade. Um but I actually I I don’t think that that’s the case because it’s a one for one swap. I I would have to look that out. There is a way in which you cannot be aggregated in a trade. I don’t even know what I just walked into. Yeah, we have created a very relaxed environment here. You guys live kind of. He just walked in like, whoa, what up? Like, hey, what does that sign say out there? Yeah. Um, Rosto, do the Kings have a plan B? Uh, yeah. It’s to run the same roster out there. Uh, I didn’t see was there more on Keon somewhere that I missed or was that just like a topic of discussion you guys were having? That was just a conversation. Yeah, it was conversation. We just talking. Mhm. Uh, I agree, Norm. At least he had pants on. and not the day someone walks in here without parents, it’s gonna be a problem. Uh, we’re coming back, Hammer. This is an interesting show. Always very interesting work dynamic we’ve created. Are you guys live right now? No. The crazy thing is, hey, you guys live right now? What’s good? What’s good? No. No, just talking. Mark coming in to talk. You guys live? Yeah. Charlie sitting in here waiting for me earlier. Oh, are you back? Oh, no. That was the best part. Casey’s like, “Yeah, we’re coming back, Charlie.” Charlie’s just standing there still. I still don’t know what Charlie looked like he had something important to say. Yeah. Welcome to Jurassic Park. That’s what he had. Medulla oblangara. Oh, well, might have been that, too. Uh, might have been that, too. Um, shout out to DLo. Giants lost. I’m not gonna lie. As soon as he changed it, put it back on, it just all went downhill. Like I said, he put the game on immediate four pitch walk, tried to turn two, couldn’t make that happen. Literally play after that. Pirates still second. Hammer, it turns out I uh appear to be bad luck. Now, I do want to I didn’t watch the San Francisco Giants for a week and a half. Yeah. Can’t can’t put the whole damn season on. Let’s just say it’s been a long time since I’ve seen them win a baseball game, though. We’ll say that. In fact, the last one I think I saw was the comeback. It was the Rockies comeback. Oh, man. That’s even sad, too. We needed a comeback against the Rockies. That was tough. Jesus, that was tough. I haven’t seen them win in months. Oh, man. These guys have ruined the summer. When does football start? I could tell James was tweeting. That’s why we were talking about baseball. I knew you were working on something. And there it is. The uh the Daycoin two-way contract right there. Um Hit the Quan. Hit the It’s back, baby. Yeah. Let’s go. The first one to return. Yeah. It didn’t The first one didn’t last too long, but it’s all good. That spelling is going to kill me every single time he makes an appearance. I haven’t received it. So, let me Can I try? Duan. Yeah. Go ahead. Yeah. Yeah. D A Q W. Nope. Nope. You want to try again? D A Q U. Nope. Nope. A D A Q E. Nope. Nope. I actually love this game. You want to try again? D A Q. Nope. Nope. Oh, Jesus. You’ve said some right letters though. D A W. Nope. I’m out. See, I love this. Can you use it in a sentence? That’s a good That’s That’s funny. Somebody D A E Oh. Oh, no. Q W N. We should have been able to read it. Dayquin. The Sacramento Kings signed Dayquin Plouden to a two-way contract after an impressive summer league showing. Makes perfect sense now looking at it. Okay, I see Bquin. What is the origin? Like you got me. Is there another spelling? Yes, there is. Hammer in this. Yes. Yes, James. There are there are other spellings for sure. Um, hell, Dacoin Jeff didn’t spell his name like that. No, I think it was I think it was you you had I think it was D A. Was there a U inquest [Music] segment of the day, that’s for sure. as King since 1985 says you you think Casey would figure out that Q isn’t the third letter. They let me cook like past Q a couple times. That’s what that’s what messed me up. I said like Q A and they were like no. That’s when they when I said A. I kept saying Q and Q wasn’t even a third letter. Damn. I’m get it. I’ll never forget it now though. No. Yeah. No, I bet you won’t spell it right now. V A E Q W E O N. No. Damn. Um, just Well, the E must not be there. So, what is it? Spell it. D A E. Yep. Q Wo N. There it is. Yay. Oh man. Um, James, in situations like we’re seeing right now, this is a it’s a it’s an interesting situation regarding a restricted free agent. Normally, there’s offer sheets in play and things like that. Those those are not in play for Phoenix. Those are not in play for Sacramento and and and Golden State is working off this qualifying offer thing. you also have the kind of unique component that they don’t really want Jonathan Kaminga. And so that adds a whole wrinkle to this. And there’s, you know, the word leverage has been used a lot over the course of the last three weeks or so since then since this story first started to percolate. James, I’ll ask you, who do you think has the leverage in this situation? The the Warriors, the Kings, Jonathan Kaminga? feels like the Suns are just here. But like who really has the leverage in this? I think the really uncomfortable answer is absolutely no one. No one has the leverage because there are two teams out there. So it’s not like the Kings are aren’t competing against somebody else. The Suns offer is is not good. Um the Kings offer is not what you would consider good for the type of player that that Kaminga could potentially be. Um so like the Warriors are not in a good position because Kaminga can just play for 7.9 million. Kaminga is not in a good position because if he does that, you know, he gets to the end of the year and he’s an unrestricted free agent in a draft class that has a bunch of other unrestricted free agents from the pre previous season plus a bunch of new restricted free agents plus a bunch of new free agents that are available, you know, and so you’re you’re always going to be wondering, will he get his money back? and in a market whereesh the NBA is lowering the salary cap increase from 10% to 7%. So like look, I don’t think anyone is in a particularly great spot. I do get, you know, the Kings holding their line and saying, “Hey, look, this is we’re not going to add Keegan. We’re not going to add Keon. We’re not going to add Isaac Jones.” At least at this point, we haven’t heard any of those names being mentioned. But um you know you are in a in kind of this weird spot where like nobody is super comfortable with their spot w with with what’s happening. Um you know Kaminga does not want to he would much rather play just like Keon Ellis doesn’t want to play for 2 million. Uh he wants to play for 25 to 28 million right maybe 30 million. That’s what he was hoping to play for. And you know I think everybody’s expectations have to change just a little bit. But if you want the deal done, you know, we even hear this this thing now that has been floated that the Warriors want an unprotected first round pick from the Kings as opposed to the um you know, the the pick that they they’re a protected pick. And you know, both of those those things have like their pluses and minuses, right? Because the Kings don’t have a lot of sweetener to add to the back end of a protected first round pick. So, it could end up being like the the JJ Hixon deal from years ago where literally took like five years before that that pick uh got actually traded, which was was miserable. Like the Kings were stuck basically in the Steppian rule and couldn’t trade their picks out in front of them at all for five years because they had this protected pick that they were dealing with. Yeah, we don’t have to even go that far back. We can deal with this stupid ass Kevin Herder trade, which sounds me on damn near all conditional. Like, I’m I know it’s not just take the pick. I don’t want to do a conditional pick anymore after dealing with that nonsense. I’m cool off that. Um Well, to that point really quick, Casey, the Kings do have their, you know, like, hey, they could tell the the Warriors, hey, how about we do this? How about we do a game of chance? We’ll give you an unprotected 2027 San Antonio Spurs pick. That’s if it goes beyond 16, you lose it. If it’s one through 16, you get to keep it. And it’s not our pick, so we don’t have any any reason to tank for you. It’s the Spurs pick. But, you know, the Kings have already traded the backside of that pick. And so, it’s like, hey, if it if it if it uh like relays to you, it relays to you. If it if not, you get nothing. Or you could just give him the 2031 Minnesota Timberwolves pick and it’s unprotected. But that there’s just so much value in in an unprotected pick and that’s kind of not where the Warriors are are coming from a place of value. Well, James, me and and Damian, we talked about it on the complete opposite end of that spectrum. like we give you the 26 pick because we don’t believe even with all the negativity around the Kings that they’re going to be some 25 win team. Like we don’t they still have talent on the on the on the roster. And even last year they won 40 games. They lost in the first game of the playin. They were a nine seed and whatever it was that ended up being a for number 14 pick that they have to give away. If let’s just to say you recreate the same scenario again this season, I’d give you the 14 pick in 2026 as opposed to I don’t know what this team’s going to look like in 2029, 2030. And I mean that in a negative way. I’m not giving you an unprotected unprotected pick later in in this draft process. I’ll give it to you right now where I don’t think we’re going to be like bottoming out. Okay. So, you don’t think they’re going to be bottoming out? But I mean, let’s let’s be real. Vegas has him at 35 and a half wins. That’s like like the seventh or eighth pick in the draft. Like, and Jonathan Kaminga, like to be honest with you, at this point in his career is not worth the seventh or eighth pick in the draft. He’s not. And and part of that, you know, straight up, it’s it’s on the Warriors. Like, you’re not trading like the the seventh pick in the draft or the sixth pick, whatever he was. You’re trading a player who’s been in the league for four years and has had had all kinds of ups and downs and was out of your rotation at one point in the playoffs like and then you had to bring him back because you had an injury and he was incredible. But before that like what we’re going to believe a showcase in the playoffs that make it so and you didn’t win the playoff series. So like what are we basing his value off of? And like what we were talking about earlier, like there’s a tremendous amount of value in a pick before there’s a name attached to it. And once a player’s been in the league for four years, you don’t usually get, you know, dollar fordoll value for them. you’re going to get 40 cents on the dollar, which is why the the offers are what they are at this point, especially because of the the complexities of a deal where base year compensation and, you know, all of this other stuff, the the restricted free agent status and all that stuff is is still in play. The Suns won 36 games last year. Portland won 34. They were the 10th and 11th picks. Yeah, but I mean it changes from one year to the next and like look that what if you win look out and win the lottery. Like you don’t want to give up a the top three pick for for a player that you don’t know. Like if I’m the Kings, I’m not trading by 26. I’m certainly not trading my 27. And I even have a tough time trading my 28 because I’m not trading anything beyond that. Those are the ones that I’m not trading. Once you get to 28 29 and you got Demar and those those are the ones we’re not getting rid of cuz I’ll give you this scenario here. You get to the 2027 season, everybody’s off the books. We didn’t trade Deontto Sabonis. We have no veterans here. This escalated quickly. Well, I’m I’m just saying like don’t want to be here if we sorry. So you you trading him for assets. You’re just a sorry team and now you don’t have your first round pick in 27 or 28. Like that’s that’s very I think that’s a very real possibility. I feel I don’t I know Vegas has them at 30 35 James or whatever it was 38. I feel like this team can make the playoffs. They’re not making a run to the conference finals or winning a championship but could they get in through the playing? Could they get a six seed? Like this team we overvalued last July. They underperformed you know last April. They could meet somewhere in the middle. Now, I don’t know that that middle gets them to 48 wins, but does it get them to a better version of the basketball team that they were last year? Yeah, maybe. I don’t know that I can say that for 2027 or 2028. You know, Scott’s got a lot ahead of him to do, but do I feel like this team could win some games in 2026? I do. Maybe. Yeah. I mean, to be honest with you, I’m like, after this discussion, I’m probably rolling the dice on one of those other two picks, the picks that aren’t yours. Like, sure. But I mean, that’s fine. And if I was the Warriors, I’d hang up. Why do I want that Spurs pick that might not even have it? Well, what you could also do something like this. You could say Spurs pick. You could say the Spurs pick and if the Spurs pick doesn’t relay, we’ll give you an unprotected Minnesota Timberwolves pick. keep your own picks because like look, I think the potential of the Spurs being better than the Kings is is realistic. I think that the potential of Minnesota in 2031 being better than the Kings is is very realistic. We don’t know for sure. Um but that’s kind of like it’s the tough gamble here that you’re going to take as a franchise. Um like if you are going to try to add a player and you know it takes something to get something and then on top of that, we’ve talked about this a little bit. Top of that, you if you make the Kaminga trade and it doesn’t include one of your, you know, 18 to$25 million players, somebody’s got to go because you’re way over the luxury tax and you’re pushing on the the first apron. And so that means you got to make another corresponding move uh to somehow clear up space. Whether that’s, you know, again, Malik Monk going somewhere else, whether that’s uh, you know, Demar De Rozan going somewhere else, somebody has to go in that scenario if they’re not part of the trade to actually acquire Kaminga. You know, we talked a little bit a second ago about leverage and all this other stuff. And and I’ll I’ll flip the words just a little bit, you know, because um, James, you talked about how nobody really has any leverage. I’d flip it a little bit and say everybody has their own little piece of leverage, right? Kaminga has a little say so and how this goes about it because he’s got different deals that he can sign and no Trey Claus is the Warriors. As dumb as it would be, they don’t have to make a deal, right? They can just hold on to them. The team would probably and the the the group with the least amount of leverage honestly is probably the Kings because they’re dependent on everybody. They’re dependent on Kaminga wanting to come here. They’re dependent on the Warriors um deciding to trade him and everything and all they can do is offer what they can offer, but they don’t have any real say so in how this plays out. So, I I think I the leverage the Kings do have is the market and being able to not, you know, go crazy with a trade proposal, but I think everybody has their own little little value uh of leverage in this situation. I I would actually like I would flip it and say like I think the Kings have leverage because they can just walk away and it’s you know nothing ventured, nothing gained. You you had conversations it didn’t work out upwards and onwards let’s see what the season looks like. I think the Warriors um like again if he accepts the qualifying offer um or he signs a two-year 45 but demands that the second year is is a player option, not a team option, like all of these things could like I just don’t see them having a lot of ways to get better. And the reason why they’re doing this right now, why they’re holding everybody hostage is super super specific. They want to have a $20 million player to trade mid-season because as of right now they’ve got nothing. You know, they’ve got like they’ve got their top end heavy contracts. I we talked about this the other day, but like they they have, you know, of course Steph and then Jimmy Butler and you know, so they’ve got two top-end contracts. Then the next one is is Draymond Green at 26 million. But then Moses Moody makes 115 and Buddy Hil makes 9.2. and then they drop all the way down to 3.6 million. So, let’s say, I don’t know, LeBron James becomes available this during the season. Well, I don’t know if that’s going to happen or not, but you know, if you could package Moody and Kaminga and Buddy He uh plus first round picks and stuff, maybe you get that deal done. Um, but if you don’t have uh if you don’t have a Kaminga on the roster, then you don’t have that $20 million contract to trade for a $50 million player and you’re not going to be able to make the deal. So, I mean, again, if you take away if you’re not going to trade Steph, Jimmy, or Draymond Green, um, then to piece together a deal that would get you to the salary that that LeBron James makes, it literally would take every player on your roster outside of that, you would have to go Moody, he that’s that puts you at like right at 20 million. Then, Pajkki at 4 million, Ge Santos at 2.2. like you don’t have any any contracts, any money to send out in a LeBron James trade. And so that’s where I think the Warriors keep centering this thing. And it’s also why they should probably figure out a way to to swing a deal that includes either a Demard Rosen or a Malik Monk because then they would have that contract to trade uh if they can’t keep Kaminga at 20 million. But that’s all they’re looking for. We always talk about like the trade exceptions being a coupon. They’re looking at Kaminga as like a a coupon that can play here and there, but they’re they’re not going to want him to get hurt or anything else because they won’t be able to trade him. That’s why Kaminga’s team told the Warriors to go to hell. Yeah. Yeah. I mean I mean and I and I perfectly agree with that or I I very much agree with that. Hammer, we also speculated. We wondered if if you know either if this this thing with Jonathan Kaminga were able to get done or perhaps there was a resolution that landed with Kaminga being elsewhere. Uh if this would start some sort of uh you know effect for the Sacramento Kings and you mentioned Demar De Rozan and some of these other guys maybe once this transaction is complete there are other moves ahead for them to make. Um you know we go back to the Demar De Rozan thing. Gamard Rozan has played damn near 1,200 basketball games in his career. He the only games that he he hasn’t started in 12 of those 1,200 some odd games. All 12 of them were in his rookie season 16 years ago. And so the idea that you’re just going to casually move a player like Demard Rosen whose play has not declined to the bench I think is I think it’s interesting. I also think maybe you have a discussion with him and his agent about potential destinations for him across the league. Uh Miami is the one that comes up a lot. I believe there were discussions there, but they weren’t any good. Um but I I wonder if there’s a a next chain of events that that gets set off or a chain of events that gets set off for Sacramento should a resolution be reached in this Jonathan Kaminga situation. Yeah, that’s going to be the next step. Like what’s the the ripple effect? And you know, again, we we keep hearing Malik Monk’s name mentioned all over the place. Um, it’s it’s going to be easier to move Demar, I think, uh, because he’s only got one year and then a buyout at 10 million than it would be to move Malik Monk. And it’s easier to move Demar at 24.5 million or$25 million for a $15 million player than it is to move Monk for like an $8 million player because you got to remember, you got to clear up that cap space, that 10 million bucks. And then on top of that, everyone’s like, “Oh, they’ll just sign Russell Westbrook.” But like then they need another 2 million, 2.2 million or whatever to free up to make sure they don’t go over luxury tax if they’re going to do that as well. So, I I definitely could see a a play where they they did something like I said this earlier, but Demar for Terrence man where you’re uh you’re going to a team that has, you know, salary cap uh plenty of salary cap to work with, but also um you know, so they can absorb more contract coming in, but also they’ve got a player who is, you know, 15 15 and a half, 15 and a half, and 16 million over the next three years. So, you’re going to take back more contract, but you’re going to uh, you know, clear up a bunch of flexibility this year and and even take on a little bit more next year, like 5 million versus a 10 that you would have had for a buyout for tomorrow. And then that third year, you’re putting up 156 million that you don’t have on your books right now. And so, that’s where it gets a little complicated. But um the other thing someone brings up, you can uh wave and stretch uh Devin Carter, that doesn’t make an impact on the Kings, but waving and stretching Demard Rosen. And I’m not saying they’re going to do that, but you might be able to get him to take less money on that secondyear buyout and then stretch his money over three years. Um because that’s, you know, that would free up 16 million bucks that you don’t have right now. And I’m not saying that I think Dame Lillard broke people’s brains like that does not happen very often. the wave and stretch like that does not happen a lot but it happened to Dame obviously that was a stunning amount of money and all of a sudden everyone’s like oh just wave and stretch everyone Bill well is that but that’s not what they did is it didn’t they didn’t they buy him out just they they used to stretch provision what was that sneak away and cut the podcast what flag you’re going Wave and stretch everyone. I don’t think so. Not on this show. Yikes. My bad. He gads. That’s my bad. You know what? Let’s just end. It’s fine. It’s fine. We’ll we’ll we’ll just end on that note. That’s my bad. Um Well, I guess we’ll uh I mean, obviously, don’t expect anything to happen tonight, but we’ll see what happens over the course of the next few days. Man, it’ll certainly create some fun conversations uh as they center around the Sacramento Kings and James Ham and Kyle Matson will be here to cover it all beginning tomorrow at 10 a.m. here on Sacramento Sports Leader ESPN 13:20. Vamos, wave and stretch show flag. Got a flag on the last game. Yikes. I don’t think we’ve ever had a flag post show. Yeah, that was tough. Tough tough lag. Tough tough tough indeed. Goodness. All right, y’all. We’re going to shut down. We gota Well, got to go host a radio show, man. So, we’ll see y’all tomorrow. I think that was Casey with the walk-off flag. Walkoff flag. Appreciate y’all. Hit the thumb.
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3 Comments
Lebrons quality is absolutely getting downhill.
He could get downhill and finish better then any player in NBA history.
His ability to get downhill is absolutely his defining quality. I think He was an absolute superb playmaker early on until some of the National Media idiot talking heads would blast him every time He made the right play out of a double triple team and didnt force the shot.
If Will is A quality then Lebron is actually on the same realm as Jordan. Id still say prime late 80's'-90s Jordan's Will is unparalleled.
Jordan was the Kevin Rooney in his corner undefeated Mike Tyson. Tyson was never the same fighter after He knocked out Spinks.
Hed reached the highest height at that point. He didnt want to work anymore by having Rooney in is his corner.
You could NOTICEABLY see the impact during the first Razor Ruddock fight after He fired Rooney. His defensive head movement/peakaboo style practically was non existent after a year or so and ESPECIALLY when He fought Buster Douglass.
Taking nothing away from Buster but the Tyson He fought was a mere shell defensively then when He was when He fought boxers like Bonecrusher and Biggs.
Mike damn near NEVER got hit flush. Hes known for his offensive prowess obviously but at one point Mike was the best defensive fighter id ever seen in my life.
Mike Tyson made boxing must see Tv He was so damn good
Durant bar none one of the greatest offensive players that ever played if not the greatest.
Hes literally unguardable
After how Golden state lost that 3-1 lead and series to Cleveland im not sure without Durant if they beat Cleveland again.
The first finals win against Cleveland when Cleveland was up 2-1 Kyrie got hurt and Love did too if i remember correctly.
There isnt any guarantees whatsoever that if Golden State doesnt make Durant trade they ever win another.
They might not have even won that first one if Kyrie and Love do.y go down.
Cavs were up 2-1 with momentum